Floxie Hope


This site is to give HOPE to those who are suffering from Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome as a result of being poisoned by fluoroquinolone antibiotics – Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox, Floxin, etc.  It contains stories of healing.

Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox and all other fluoroquinolones are dangerous drugs that can have devastating effects that cumulatively I’ll refer to as Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome or Floxing.  Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome/Floxing includes damage to connective tissue (tendons, ligaments, cartilage, fascia, etc.) throughout the body, damage to the nervous systems (central, peripheral and autonomic), and more. The damage done by fluoroquinolone antibiotics can destroy a person’s quality of life or even kill them. Certainly, there is a time and a place for drugs with dangerous side effects. If you find yourself in a septic shock induced coma, fluoroquinolones may save your life. Unfortunately, these drugs are not being reserved for life or death situations. People are being prescribed them for urinary tract infections, suspected prostate infections, upper respiratory infections, as a prophylactic for travelers’ diarrhea, ear infections, pink eye, etc. Thousands of people have suffered needlessly from the devastating effects of fluoroquinolone antibiotics, when another, safer antibiotic could have, and should have, been used.

The damage done by fluoroquinolones is largely unacknowledged by the medical establishment and an accurate diagnosis, compensation and relief are difficult to come by. There is no known cure for Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome/Floxing.  However, many people continue to LIVE after being poisoned by fluroquinolones.  They find healing, recovery, perseverance, compassion and hope.  These are their stories.

This site is meant to give hope for healing to those who are adversely effected by fluoroquinolones.  It is no way meant to disregard the pain of those who are chronically suffering from the horrifying effects of Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox or the other fluoroquinolones.  There are people who don’t recover.  Their stories are real and they matter.  There are also people who are able to recover and I share their stories with the hope that they inspire others, or at least give hope that recovery is possible.

Here is a New York Times article about the dangers of fluoroquinolone antibiotics – http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/10/popular-antibiotics-may-carry-serious-side-effects/?_r=0 – more news stories, research papers and other resources can be found on the “Links and Resources” page.

Here is a Facebook group that is a great resource for those going through Fluoroquinolone Toxicity – https://www.facebook.com/groups/floxies/

Featured post – I’m floxed. Now what?

The Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Solution Ebook has helped many Floxies to recover, including DanielCindy and Ruth.  As a bonus, you will also receive The Floxie Food Guide – a book of diet guidelines to help you through fluoroquinolone toxicity:

flu tox get help you need banner click lisa




19,965 thoughts on “Floxie Hope

  1. Joanneg January 28, 2018 at 6:55 pm Reply

    Even though this site is about cancer, it explains ozone therapy in an easy to understand way.

  2. Joanneg January 28, 2018 at 6:58 pm Reply

    I forgot the video link

  3. Erin January 29, 2018 at 1:32 pm Reply

    Hi everyone. I was floxed in may 2016. I have to get all 4 of my wisdom teeth taken out, they are all impacted, and I’m worried about how to deal with the pain after extraction. I’m not going to be put under or on nitrous, I’m only going to be numb during the procedure. I haven’t taken any pain medicine since I was floxed and I know to avoid NSAIDS or steroids, but I am most likely going to need to take tylenol or some kind of pain medicine. Does this sound like a good plan, tylenol if I need it? I would appreciate any suggestions, thank you.

    • L January 29, 2018 at 1:37 pm Reply

      We are all different of course, but I had no trouble with tramadol.

  4. jat92517 January 30, 2018 at 3:37 pm Reply

    You can’t believe everything you see on the web.

    • D. Mowers February 7, 2018 at 1:13 pm Reply

      What’s that supposed to mean? We all know that the statement is true but what’s your point in posting it here?

    • Dan Jervis February 22, 2018 at 9:24 am Reply

      Who are you to judge? Have you suffered for 7800 days? Keep your septic thoughts to yourself and leave your head deeply inside your rectum.

      • Don Mowers February 22, 2018 at 9:49 am Reply

        Right on Dan. People who make comments like that always remind me of the dog and the fire hydrant. They just have to let others know they were there.

    • Michael Teeter February 25, 2018 at 8:34 pm Reply

      He is a chemical engineer studying glucose transport to reverse diabetes using process control trend charts. Although he doesn’t spell pharmaceutical correctly. Your comment although truthful does not apply here. I am a case study all on my own.

  5. Joanneg February 1, 2018 at 12:09 am Reply

    Its 2:00 in the morning, and I can’t sleep. I go for my first iv ozone therapy in 6hrs! I pray it works. I’ll post back to let you all know how it goes😊

    • L February 1, 2018 at 8:57 am Reply

      good move!

    • Michael Teeter February 25, 2018 at 8:34 pm Reply

      I never tried that one. Let me know how it goes.

    • L February 25, 2018 at 8:48 pm Reply

      I think it will go great! Keep us posted.

  6. Barbara Arnold February 1, 2018 at 1:12 am Reply

    Joanneg, you will be absolutely fine, just don’t expect to much initially. Also don’t forget you may get a small herx, but that will pass. I think (can’t remember) I had about 10 or 12 sessions and it definately helped me. So tons of luck and I really hope it helps you. If you continue to have sleep issues, I recommend cbd oil, that also really helped me. xx

    • D. Mowers February 12, 2018 at 6:25 am Reply

      CBD Oil………….. Please people look into it! Everyone is different but it may help with pain and will most likely help with ANXIETY. Beware everyone is jumping on the CBD band wagon so be sure you are getting a quality product and not a cheap knock off. Trying to use junk will only discourage you from the receiving the potential benefits of CBD Oil. I use it daily and it helps. https://www.hemplandusa.com/ Very expensive but considered as one of the best because it is pure and the only additive is peppermint to enhance the flavor.

      • Barbara Arnold February 12, 2018 at 8:01 am Reply

        Yep, I agree, but I think most floxies do research on any products now. We are generally ultra careful, thank goodness.

  7. Joanneg February 1, 2018 at 9:00 am Reply

    Well I just got back my appointment. I didn’t get the ozone therapy, I drove 1 1/2hrs to be told i had to agree to an $8,500 care package.
    I SURE wish they would have told me that when we talked on the phone!!
    Barbara, did you have to sign up for a package deal? Do you live in the US, if so where did you get your treatments? And thanks again for trying to encourage me through this.
    Anyhow, I just plan on drinking a small glass of ozone water, but only like once a week cuz it was hard on my stomach, and I think it kills good bacteria even though most of the sites say it doesn’t.
    But I got a tremendous amount of symptom relief with it, so unless it does something negative that’s the plan.
    Hope everyone is feeling better😊

    • L February 1, 2018 at 9:16 am Reply

      Oh I am so sorry! I know several practitioners in the area that do ozone, and I do not believe any of them require that! (I am in southern California.)

    • Bob February 1, 2018 at 6:38 pm Reply

      I have researched ozone quite a bit and many believe that rectal infusions are just as good as treating the blood. I found someone locally that does treatments for $30.00 and they wanted 20 treatment package. I have been researching ozone generators for home use but haven’t settled on one yet.

      • Deb February 2, 2018 at 2:54 pm Reply

        I have heard positive results with the rectal infusions also.

    • Barbara Arnold February 1, 2018 at 10:49 pm Reply

      Oh Joanneg, really sorry, what a dissapointment for you and what a waste of time and energy. No I don’t live in the US I live in Spain. I am an ex pat. I paid 100 euros a session, but did not have to sign up for any package. The Doctor I saw only did ozone, nothing else, and he went by my symptoms, it was still expensive though. I also have an ozone water purifier, I don’t use it much now as I forget it’s there. I don’t think it kills good bacteria, there is a scientific reason, which I can’t remember, but I researched it fully before I bought it. If you are having gut problems you need to look at your diet more, what you are eating and what your not eating.. The ozonated water has to be drunk fairly quickly because the ozone does not last if left. I do hope you can find an alternative ozone doctor.

    • Henk Noordhuizen February 14, 2018 at 8:51 am Reply

      I got a course of Cipro in sept. 2016 and had to stop after only 2 days. My doctor subscribed this in spite of the fact that she knew that Cipro and Flecainide Acetate together are a very dangerous mix. Few days later,when I told her I stopped with the Cipro,she got realy angry at me until I told her that an other doctor give me the advise to stop.She even told me that she never had any complaints about this Cipro poison;I guess that I’m het first survivor :-((

      I had heart pulptations for over a year;a frightening experiance over and over again. Those are almost gone ;only sometimes come back but less severe.

      One of the othjer adverse reactions I had was hyperglycemia,and hypoglycemia as well (which was less severe and disappeared within the first few month).

      I write this as a reaction to the posting of Joanneg,and the absurd price she would have to pay for “the packet”. My first experiance with anti-bio’s was in 2004,with a course of 2 broad spectrum AB’s,and this made me sick to the bone,It took me 3 years to find something to cure and stabilize my bloodsugarlevels. Used this again because this same problem ,one month after tose 2 poison-pills,did not disappear ,and it helped a lot,although I could not eat as much bread without problems as before the Cipro. And 2 weeks ago,all of a sudden,the problem came back very severe;don;t understad what made this happen!

      Now I decided to follow the whole protocol (it’s called the Beck Protocol),and started 2 weeks ago.It worked miracles! Thank you so much,Bob back !!! And because it can be done in a very cheap way (like I did in 2007,after 3 years of severe problems),I will try to explain it the best I can (I’m from the Netherlands;english is not my “own”language).

      The Beck protocol consists of 4 seperate things; blood electrification, magnetic pulsing, consuming ionoc silver water and drinking ozonated water (with a timespan of atleast 1-2 hours between the ozone and the silver,otherwise both react into silver-oxides,which don’t work for you). The Silver Pulser (for pulsing your blood and making the silver water),and the magnetic pulser are fairly easy to make yourself,maybe with help of somebody who knows the basics of electronics. After my big success in 2007 I bought the (semi-)professional and more convenient devices made by Sota;the owner of that company showed Bob Beck his improvements on the simple schematics that Beck published on the web,and Bob gave him permission to produce and sell this improved devices on a commercial base.

      Now,two weeks into the protocol (which lasts at least 2-3 month),my bloodsugar levels are stabile! Yesterday I even tested it in a very risky way by eating a BIG piece of Panetonne and did NOT get a hyper (one hour after eating this I measured 8,9 mmol;the max “permitted”,but to be expected after the amount of carbs and sugars I consumed. While,two weeks ago,two slices of whole wheat bread gave me a level of 16,4 mmol ,one hour later. Toke way too long to to come down to a healthy level,too. An amazing improvement,in just two weeks.

      I’m not going to explain the protocol because there is an very good website about Beck,and his protocol : bobbeck.com Just want to share my experience with this protocol,first with the homebuild devices,and later on with the great devices from Sota. I had very positive experiences with magnetic pulsing (the pancreas is the main area to pulse for problems with unstable bloodsugar),and with musculare and other pains. It also helps against infections. The silver ions are antimicrobal; recent research showed it to kill breastcancercells in vitro. I advise you to view the lecture Beck gave,on Youtube;links can be found on the bobbeck website.And,while there,you might read about his live and works as well; this man is a real genious;worked for the navy in developing advanced devices.

      I’l read comments from time to time and try to answer questions the best I can. Wish you all to find back your health And I thank everybody for good advice given here (magnesium supplements are among my favorites for many years,and here,in The Netherlands,we got Zechstein magnesiumsalt,which is great!

      Greetings from Henk Noordhuizen,The Netherlands.

  8. Andrea February 1, 2018 at 12:25 pm Reply

    Hi everyone. I wanted to share with y’all, another disappointing experience I had.
    I spoke to another doctor yesterday. He works in a pretty important clinic here in Italy and he’s also a neurologist. I travelled to get there, because I thought I could spoke to some of the top doctors in this country, But I was totally wrong.
    First of all, he said that there’s no scientific evidence that Quinolones cause neurological damage in young people, and it’s impossible that they can cause damage to organs like the bladder. When I objected it, he said that I could belive him or not, but that’s what the science says. I wish I had brought with me all the scientific researche I’ve read during this year, plus, all of our experiences. He was only aware that FQs can cause tendinopathy, but only in elderly people. So, basically, a top neurologist, was only aware about the side effects written on the warning label. Wow…that’s comforting!

    • Joanneg February 1, 2018 at 12:52 pm Reply

      Yea, thats so unbelievable!! But par for the course.
      One thing we all learned through this is just how clueless most dr.s are to a lot of health issues but especially FQ’s!

      • Mary February 4, 2018 at 7:43 am Reply

        Joanneg I agree BUT there are also a lot of dumbass naturopaths. Ozone inhalation being one of the dumbest things I have heard of., Sorry but people need advising safely.
        Supposing someone so desperate for a cure tries it out and suffers irreversible lung damage?
        That is my fear.


        • Andrea February 8, 2018 at 6:10 am

          I agree

    • Bob February 1, 2018 at 6:23 pm Reply

      What a pathetic dumb ass.

    • L February 1, 2018 at 9:23 pm Reply

      That makes me so furious!!! How about sending the idiot a copy of this? https://www.fda.gov/downloads/Drugs/DrugSafety/UCM365078.pdf

      You know, of the dozen or so doctors I saw post Cipro that threw me under the box, the neurologist was the WORST. He also was totally unaware of the damage from Cipro. He in fact, in his notes called me “delusional.” If I had a lot of money to burn I would buy up a lot of copies of the late Dr Jay Cohen’s book and send it to every knucklehead allopath I saw. Sorry you wasted your time and money.

      • Andrea February 2, 2018 at 3:40 am Reply

        Delusional!? I’m so sorry L, nobody, suffering like you do, should be called like that, expecially when you have evidence to back up your symptms

        • L February 2, 2018 at 12:22 pm

          yeah, that really was the icing on the cake. And at this point I was in horrible shape…35 lbs down, barely able to walk without help, massive visions issues, excruciating pain, and feeling like I had double pneumonia. I had already “had it” with allopaths and the ONLY reason I went to see him was to get the result of an ultrasound I had had on my wrist which swelled up over the tendon. I went to him in particular because a dr I had seen at UCLA, who also was not helpful, but had been the nicest and least dismissive, recommended him for the results of the test she ordered. Later when I tried to get my records for a lawsuit he refused to give them. I kept telling him he had to by law. Anyhow, after one of my visits trying to get the records, I looked at the couple in the waiting room and said “Run for your lives!” before I left. I then got a letter in the mail saying if I came to the office again they would call the police. 🙂 (I ended up sending him a flq article on nerve damage from Cipro, from the Journal Neurology with a post- it saying “Ever heard of this?” (IT is the most highly peer reviewed journal for neurology.)

        • Andrea February 2, 2018 at 2:51 pm

          Yeah,,,sad to say it, but the more I look at doctors, the more I see a vague clique. Don’t get me wrong, I still belive in official medicine, and I think that medicines and drugs are useful when you need them. As crazy as it may sound, I belive that even FQs are useful in some extreme cases (I’m talking about life or death situation) . And I think that there are still a few doctors out there, that really care for patients and are not ignorant. Anyway, most of them are too indoctrinated by big pharma. That’s a fact. Also, because of this, they tend to underestimate other great alternative approaches.

        • Mary February 5, 2018 at 6:42 pm

          Dr Mark Gillila talks about Cipro paralyzing him and successful stem cell therapy treatment in San Diego. The stem cells were taken from his own body fat according to CBS news report.
          See U tube as unable to copy the link for some reason.

          Dr Mark says his medical colleagues disbelieved him when he collapsed after taking Cipro for two weeks for a UTI!!!!!!

        • L February 5, 2018 at 8:20 pm

          I have also read that the value of the cells diminishes with age. I wonder too how much the time between being floxed, and the time of having this done matters. I spoke with the doctor and he said something to the effect of he thought “the sooner the better.”

      • Barbara Arnold February 3, 2018 at 2:45 am Reply

        You could be my sister L, we think alike lol Go girl go.

        • L February 3, 2018 at 11:08 am

          you gotta score those points where you can! 🙂

    • Barbara Arnold February 1, 2018 at 11:04 pm Reply

      Andrea, he is negligent in his duty of care. Some of these Doctors are arrogant beyond belief. I had a similar one who thought she was so important, and so far up her own…a.. I did make up a pile of evidence in 4 packages to give to every neurologist in my local hospital and delivered it personally to all their secretary’s. The first page I typed in bold YOU ARE NEGLEGENT IN YOUR DUTY OF CARE. Guess what… NO ANSWER, NOTHING. They are not healer’s in any which way at all. I avoid all Doctors now if it is at all possible as I have absolutely no respect for them. When I first got floxed I wasted nearly two years going from one so called specialist to another, all, with no exception were arrogant. This caused me so much stress and made my symptoms worse, I decided that I was never going to get anywhere with these idiots and stopped hoping that there was someone out there that was interested in actually helping me. I always look for ways to help myself now and I always tell as many people as I can about what happened to me. If I just save one person from the hell and devistation this shit causes then I’m happy.

      • Mary February 6, 2018 at 6:31 am Reply

        My Story

        20 Things Cipro’s Warning Label WON’T Tell You:
        1. As everyone knows, all drugs have potential side effects. In the vast majority of drugs on the market (over 95% of them), these side effects are transient–meaning they cease when the medication is discontinued. This is NOT the case with Cipro. Many of the side effects listed on Cipro’s warning label (plus many others that are not) can actually be PERMANENT and result in lifelong disability! Bayer blatantly hides this fact, as the word “permanent” appears absolutely nowhere on the drug’s warning label1.

        2. Cipro is a purely synthetic chemotherapeutic antibiotic in the fluoroquinolone (also referred to as “quinolone”, “quin” or “FQ”) class of drugs. Well over HALF of all fluoroquinolone antibiotics have been pulled from the market over the years for their horrific safety records–and those remaining (Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox and a few others) are no safer! A study of ADRs in Italy, published in 2005, found that among more than 50 types of drugs, fluoroquinolones were involved in the largest number of serious problems and accounted for 11 percent of all adverse events.2 Every single drug in this class carries a black box warning–the equivalent of a skull & crossbones–for its nasty and long-lasting side effects. A black box warning is the last step before a drug is taken completely off the market. There is NO SUCH THING as a safe fluoroquinolone antibiotic! *Update: Cipro now carries TWO black box warnings!
        3. The odds of experiencing an adverse reaction to Cipro (including, but certainly not limited to tendon rupture) are MUCH higher than the warning label would have you believe. These adverse reactions are also much more severe and long-lasting than Bayer will admit to.

        4. Cipro’s warning label makes it sound as if tendon rupture is the worst possible scenario. What it doesn’t tell you is that the drug is actually capable of unleashing an entire SYNDROME of systemic toxicity upon the patient which is often referred to by victims as “floxing” or being “floxed.” Others refer to the condition as “fluoroquinolone toxicity syndrome.” Regardless of what you want to call it, it is absolutely devastating and commonly includes 30-40 different adverse symptoms all being suffered simultaneously and often lasting for YEARS. Many of these symptoms are devastating in and of themselves. This Cipro-induced toxicity syndrome wreaks absolute havoc on every part of a person’s body–every tendon and joint in the body can become affected, every organ (including the brain), peripheral nervous system (resulting in severe and potentially permanent pain conditions, dystonia, muscle weakness or autonomic dysfunction), vision damage up to and including temporary blindness, retinal tears and/or permanent double vision, permanent tinnitus (ringing in the ears), long lasting or permanent central nervous system damage (including relentless insomnia, memory problems, random panic, depersonalization, psychosis), chronic fatigue, multiple chemical sensitivities, severe muscle wasting, hair loss, skin changes, severe dryness issues (dry skin/eyes/mouth/nose), extensive dental damage, sudden development of new food allergies and on and on and ON. While many of these side effects are indeed listed on Cipro’s warning label, many are not. And again, nowhere in the drug’s literature does Bayer acknowledge the existence of this devastating syndrome–nor do they disclose that if you fall victim to it you’ll be experiencing nearly ALL of the ADR’s listed on the warning label simultaneously! More than a few victims, as you may imagine, have been driven to suicide as a result of being floxed by fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Cipro.
        5. Cipro attacks much more than just your tendons–it is toxic to ALL connective tissues including muscle/bone/fascia/skin/nerves/even cartilage!3 A laboratory study done on puppies showed that Cipro actually melts the cartilage out of their joints. (In case you didn’t already know–cartilage does not regenerate! Once it’s gone, it’s gone). Degeneration of the cartilage matrix in humans has been observed following as few as two oral doses of Ciprofloxacin.4 This information has been known by scientists for over a decade now, and yet the word “cartilage” still appears absolutely nowhere on Cipro’s warning label! There’s a huge difference between “joint pain” (what is described on the drug insert) and complete joint destruction requiring replacement! And yet numerous individuals–both young and old–have had to undergo full joint replacement surgeries shortly after taking Cipro. People have also suffered osteonecrosis (bone death) as a result of taking this drug.
        6. Cipro does not cause “tendonitis” as Bayer describes it on the warning label. Tendonitis is an overuse injury. Fluoroquinolones–including Cipro–are directly toxic to tendon cells, chemically altering and destroying them both at the cellular and DNA level.5 Again–there’s a big difference!
        7. Cipro-induced injuries DO NOT HEAL NORMALLY, if at all. Floxed bodies lose their ability to heal. A small injury that would heal in a matter of days for a “normal” person often takes weeks or months to heal in a floxed person, or may not heal at all.
        8. Cipro can and will attack your body regardless of your age or prior level of health. Do not think that because you are young, healthy or have never experienced any tendon or joint problems that you are safe taking this drug. It doesn’t work that way! In fact Cipro is not even permitted for use in patients under the age of 18 because it can interfere with the development of a child’s still-growing connective tissues. Cipro can render a top athlete of any age completely crippled and unable to walk, let alone workout or compete ever again.
        9. Do not think because you’ve taken Cipro on previous occasions without any apparent problems that you’re safe to take it again! Cipro’s damage is cumulative, and the drug can turn on you at any time. This is not an allergic reaction we’re talking about here. Everyone’s threshold for the drug is different, but given enough of it, anyone can and will become floxed by Cipro. Once you have surpassed your threshold–that’s it. There is no going back. Many disabled Cipro victims report having taken Cipro “successfully” a number of times before it finally turned on them.
        10. Unlike most other drugs whose side effects surface while actually on the medication, Cipro is capable of causing severe delayed reactions that don’t even manifest until long after you’ve finished taking the drug. This is unbelievably dangerous. What it means is that you could be experiencing a potentially permanent, crippling reaction to the drug but have NO IDEA until it’s too late! Victims often report finishing their entire course of Cipro before “the bomb” finally goes off inside their body. It is not uncommon for a week or two to pass between the ingestion of Cipro and the onset of its toxicity. Once floxed, your risk of tearing or rupturing a tendon continues indefinitely–there are people still experiencing tendon tears & ruptures many years after ingesting this drug. Those who suffer delayed reactions often never make the connection between their sudden ‘mysterious’ health problems and the antibiotic they took days, weeks or even months prior, so these reactions go largely unreported. Worse, these victims often end up taking more FQ antibiotics at some point, which then cripples them even further.
        11. People have wound up on crutches or in wheelchairs for the rest of their lives from as little as a few pills. As stated earlier, it is not uncommon for every tendon and joint in a person’s body to become affected including shoulders, arms and hands, so often standard wheelchairs are not an option and an electric wheelchair or motorized scooter must be used instead.
        12. In addition to being highly toxic to connective tissue, Cipro is also a neurotoxin capable of crossing the blood-brain barrier and causing severe long-term neuropsychiatric side effects. These include random episodes of panic and anxiety, relentless insomnia, seizures, confusion, depersonalization, psychosis, memory loss, paranoia and hallucinations. These side effects can result from as little as ONE pill and persist for years or in some instances even be permanent! People have ended up in psychiatric wards or worse–killed themselves–as a result of some of these psychiatric side effects. Imagine for a moment being unable to sleep more than 1-2 hours a night, every night, for YEARS. link1 link2
        13. There are entire online communities and support groups consisting of thousands of fluoroquinolone antibiotic (Cipro) victims, with new members unfortunately joining nearly every single day.
        14. Dental damage! Cipro can calcify all of the nerves in your teeth as well as permanently dry out your mouth, promoting extensive tooth decay and/or tooth loss. There are people in their thirties who now wear dentures as a direct result of Cipro destroying all of their teeth from the inside out. Others have had teeth literally break off at the gum line after becoming floxed. Again–NO mention of this anywhere on the warning label!
        15. As stated previously, Cipro is a 100% synthetic chemotherapeutic drug. It works by interfering with bacterial DNA, preventing it from replicating. The problem is, how can a synthetic chemical differentiate between bacterial DNA and your DNA!? As it turns out, it can’t. Hint: If your cells cannot replicate, your body literally begins to fall apart! Which–coincidentally–is exactly what happens when a person becomes floxed. Muscles rapidly waste away, tendons tear and rupture (sometimes even in one’s sleep), retinas spontaneously tear, cartilage erodes from the joints.
        16. The vast majority of doctors are completely ignorant about Cipro and its horrific and long-lasting side effects. Most won’t believe you when you tell them a prescription antibiotic has caused your slew of sudden disabling health problems–even if your symptoms match the ones listed right on the drug’s warning label! They’ll insist that the drug can’t possibly still be harming you days/weeks/months/years after you’ve ingested it. They’ll try and tell you you’re just getting old or they’ll subject you to a myriad of expensive testing in hopes of finding an auto-immune disorder or some other explanation for your problems. Inevitably the tests all come back negative. There is no auto-immune disorder…you were poisoned by an FDA-approved antibiotic. Sadly, even if you do manage to find a doctor who is familiar with fluoroquinolone toxicity, there is absolutely nothing they or anyone else can do to reverse the damage once it has occurred. There is quite simply NO treatment for floxing–no remedy, no tonic, no antidote. Once the damage is done, it’s DONE. And yet Cipro’s warning label instructs you to call your doctor immediately if you begin showing signs of an adverse reaction! What’s the point?!

        17. Doctors often try to misdiagnose flox victims as having auto-immune diseases such as multiple sclerosis, since many Cipro-induced ADR’s mimic those of auto-immune disorders. Other favorite misdiagnosises include reflex sympathetic dystrophy (also called chronic regional pain syndrome or CRPS), fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue syndrome, scleroderma, Raynauld’s syndrome, and Sjogren’s. Very few doctors–outside of alternative practitioners–will ever attribute your slew of sudden health problems to your having been poisoned by a prescription antibiotic.
        18. Bayer does not know the mechanism behind how or why Cipro cripples people (at least that’s what they claim). They also do not care, and are not interested in finding out. Bayer does NOT like to hear from their victims and does everything in their power to silence them. Many websites set up in order to spread information and awareness about floxing have been threatened with legal action and shut down. Others have ‘mysteriously’ disappeared from the web over the years without explanation. We’ll see how long this one lasts!
        19. If you become crippled by Cipro, don’t expect any lawyers to take your case. They will claim you were warned. Of course, as I have just outlined, you were not at all warned adequately or truthfully about the scope, likelihood, severity or duration (aka permanence) of Cipro’s nasty and life-altering side effects. Then there’s the issue of proving cause and effect and statute of limitations with a drug whose side effects sometimes don’t even fully surface until years after being ingested! Talk about the perfect crime!
        20. SSDI does not recognize fluoroquinolone toxicity as a diagnosis, so you will have to fight tooth and nail to obtain any disability benefits once you’ve been poisoned. The very government that allows this drug to be handed out like candy then turns around and tries to prevent you from collecting disability benefits once you’ve fallen victim to it!

        In short, a prescription for Cipro could end up being the most expensive prescription you EVER fill. My life ended on October 25th, 2009 thanks to just (12) 500mg Cipro pills I’d taken over the course of six days. Other than a suspected urinary infection, I had been an incredibly healthy and active 30-year-old prior to ingesting those six grams worth of poison. SIX GRAMS was all it took to completely and utterly end my life. I met NONE of the “risk factors” listed on Cipro’s warning label, and yet here I am years later housebound and essentially bedridden and with devastating injuries to my musculoskeletal and nervous system. Think for a moment of all the things that make your life worth living. Now imagine suddenly being unable to do any of those things. That is my reality now thanks to Bayer “Heathcare”, an inept FDA and my doctor who I trusted to ‘do no harm.’ Those 12 pills cost me absolutely EVERYTHING. No more work. No more traveling. No more gym. No more living on my own. No more walks around the neighborhood. No more trips to the mall. No more grocery shopping. No more swimming. No more tennis. No more bowling. No more dating. No more sex life. No more dreams of buying my own home or opening my own business. Hell, I can barely walk to the mailbox! My car is gone, credit is destroyed, quality of life demolished. EVERYTHING IS GONE!!!
        This site is my way of screaming from the mountaintops since the FDA is obviously NOT doing their job!!! This website is the warning I wish I had been given. Bayer may have crippled me, but as long as I’m still breathing they will NEVER shut me up about this! I will do my best to spread this website to the far reaches of the internet in an effort to try and reach as many people as possible before they too become unsuspecting victims of this horrific drug. This NEVER should have happened to me–not when there are a plethora of other, safer antibiotics on the market that are just as effective at killing bacteria WITHOUT the risk of permanently maiming the patient! The fact that both Bayer and the FDA know about Cipro’s horrific safety profile and not only look the other way but actively COVER UP these facts and keep them hidden from the public and the medical community is downright criminal! Do you know that I’ve filed adverse reaction reports with the FDA every six months since this happened to me and not ONCE has anyone from the agency bothered to contact me for any further information? As it turns out, the FDA’s main interest is NOT assuring public safety but rather maximizing drug company profits.

        Please read my story, visit the external links I have compiled and warn everyone you know about what is happening. I do not want one more person to fall victim to Bayer’s limitless greed and the FDA’s utter ineptitude and corruption!

        CIPRO IS POISON!!!

        1. As of August 2013, the FDA finally added the word “permanent” to fluoroquinolone warning labels, but only in regards to nerve damage: http://www.fda.gov/Drugs/DrugSafety/ucm365050.htm
        2. Galatti et al., Neuropsychiatric reactions to drugs: an analysis of spontaneous reports from general practitioners in Italy. Pharmacological Research 3: 211 (2005)
        3. http://www.levaquinadversesideeffect.com/wp-content/uploads/Documents
        4. http://www.jbjs.org/article.aspx?Volume=82&page=161
        5. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18027099
        *Please note that EVERYTHING stated on this webpage is also true for Levaquin, Avelox and ALL other fluoroquinolone antibiotics–there is NO such thing as a safe fluoroquinolone antibiotic!

        • L February 6, 2018 at 12:04 pm

          Mary, I share your outrage. The devastation is CRIMINAL, especially since Bayer, Johnson and Johnson (Levaquin.Avelox) AND the FDA have known for DECADES.

          I agree as well with how out of touch (ignorant) most doctors are regarding the damage.

          RE “don’t expect any lawyers to take your case.” Yes, it will be difficult to find a lawyer, BUT it very much depends on individual circumstances. I ended up fighting my case on my own, but I have found an attorney for another floxie. What I will tell you is that if you took a generic you can’t (at this time—some law firms are working to change that) sue the manufacturer. BUT you can sue the doctor for negligence, depending upon the individual facts of your case and in some states you can sue the pharmacy depending on your state’s pharmaceutical laws (especially duty to warn laws.) I am afraid sometimes this is the ONLY message they will understand…when they are financially impacted.

          I would encourage you to look into prolozone for damaged tendons and other connective tissues. This helps the body heal itself. Post Cipro I ended up with torn meniscus. I used a cane to walk, couldn’t squat down, etc. Several months post injection, I was pretty much back to normal regarding my knees. (I wish it could correct the vision and olfactory and aural damage! Not to mention the fluid around my heart, and other issues.) But please look into this. IT is not very expensive either. My ND did it but many sports doctors are now using it. (Not to be confused with prolotherapy, which I think works on the same theory but does not use ozone.)

        • D. Mowers February 7, 2018 at 1:54 pm

          I am 83 years old and would you believe it just now learning about all the terrible things that flouroquinolones can do to a person. In the mid 1980’s I was in the clinical trials of Cipro. I took it then because I had acquired a chronic urinary infection and no other applicable antibiotic was successful. I have taken it many times since. In all I have probably taken it 50 to 60 times over the past 30+ years. Probably in the neighborhood of 1,000 pills. Over the years I have developed symptoms that doctors could not explain so they just lumped over it. I was told that it was just old age setting in and I accepted it.
          I recently had to make a trip to the ER and was given an IV dose of Leviquin. Upon release I came home and spent the next 10 days taking Cipro.
          As of today I am not seeing any more serious (than I already have) effects from the flouroquinolones.
          I must consider myself extremely fortunate in my past experience with Cipro. Now that I have been given the Leviquin IV…. I don’t know what to think. Now that I have found these sites discussing flouroquinolones and their terrible side/after effects I am really concerned about my future.

        • Bob February 7, 2018 at 2:54 pm

          Don’t succumb to the power of suggestion. Some people don’t seem to be hurt by cipro. You are probably a good detoxer. Don’t worry about it but make sure you are getting enough minerals like magnesium and calcium.

        • L February 7, 2018 at 6:52 pm

          Bob, it has been strongly suggested that virtually ANYONE would be affected by the fluoroquinolones, given their own personal threshold….that the damage is cumulative. D Mowers is indeed fortunate to have not been extremely damaged given all the fluoroquinolones given to date. But please do not suggest it is all in his/her head. We get enough of that from the medical community.

        • jat92517 February 7, 2018 at 9:53 pm


          Do a saturated Epsom Salt Foot Soak for a week. Search this site for details – Epsom Salt.

          If you react Vito this, it means you have other nutrient deficiencies. Ask a question on this blog and describe what you are feeling in as much detail as you can. Someone will answer you.


        • jérôme February 13, 2018 at 5:33 am

          Did someone try a diet like paleo or keto,and a fasting?

        • Gerald Lock March 4, 2018 at 5:52 pm

          My experience is similar to what Mary has experienced. One big difference is that I was prescribed the drug when I was 72 years old for an unconfirmed infection. A few weeks later the pain in both lower legs started. Walking soon became almost impossible because of the pateller pain in both legs. I was soon using a cane and within a year was using a walker. I originally thought pain was my only problem until an orthopedist prescribed 1000mg of Naproxen per day. The pain subsided slightly and it was then that I realized not only was the tendon pain limiting my walking, but I also had severe motor function problems which were confirmed with testing for neuropathy. Over the past 5 years I have met many doctors most of whom were completely ignorant about fluoroquinolones. I too went to the UCLA Neurology Department and explained my history right up front told them why I believed I had a fluoroquinolone problem. After a lot of testing and several visits, their recommendation was (I kid you not) to stop drinking wine and take some vitamin B12. Five years later I continue to deteriorate. I wish the best of luck to those seeking cures with herbs, diets, poultices and chants but I believe the reality is that we are poisoned and no one has yet come forward to say HERE is the antidote.

        • L March 4, 2018 at 7:59 pm

          Oh Gerald, I am so sorry. And the fact they gave you all that naproxen ON top of the Cipro just shows how ignorant they are on the subject. Actually, of the dozen or so doctors that threw me under bus post-poisoning, the only one who had even an inkling (although she thought it was only the tendon damage…(and I was a MESS….vision damage, auditory, olfactory, devastated gut, major nerve damage and feeling like death) happened to be a young female neurologist with UCLA. (The absolute WORST doctor I saw was a neurologist in private practice.)

          My ND literally saved my life. I would refer you but his office is closed. He may reopen in the near future. However, since you seem to be in So Cal I was about to recommend you try the Whitaker Wellness center, but was disappointed to learn he is retiring. I contacted them to see where they are referring patients to.

        • jwinn March 5, 2018 at 1:31 pm

          This hurts my heart and brings back the nightmare I have experienced since April, 2009. It gives me anxiety just reading this. It also makes me sick to my stomach to think of the people who have lost their lives because of these drugs. I have recently had to change doctors due to insurance reasons, and I am reliving the entire nightmare all over again. Doctors choose to be ignorant on the harmful effects of these drugs and continue to ‘dismiss’ any claims of pain or injury caused by them. I have lived the past 10 years barely living and just waiting to die. Cipro and Levaquin (plus prednisone and NSAIDS) stole my life. I will always wonder if even 1 doctor had listened and actually cared, would my life be different? I will never know.

    • Mary February 17, 2018 at 11:36 am Reply

      All these drs p… in the same pot as my father used to say.
      American Anaestheologist faked data! What a surprise LOL!


  9. Andrea February 2, 2018 at 3:34 am Reply

    Thanks guys for your answers.
    Yeah, I forgot to mention, that, when I asked him what he would suggest to do for my symptoms (I was there mostly for my bladder issues) he said, just to add fuel to the fire, that there’s probably nothing wrong with my bladder, maybe it’s just a little “weak”, and that I should watch my liquid intake during the day ( even if I repetedly told him that I only drink water and no more than 2 lt per day) and to start to “forget” about my symptoms, because, according to him, it became a psychological thing.
    Jesus… when this “doctors” have no answer and don’t know what the f**k to say, they soon come up with the psychological answer. That’s a great way to put the blame on you. Trust me, I wanted to spit in that face, but in the end, I just smiled, and said “Okay”, since I already knew that the visit would probably end up like this.

    • Mary February 7, 2018 at 7:06 am Reply

      Andrea I agree . I was referred to an endocrinology surgeon for thyroid issues following floxing of course.
      This prize idiot refused to do thyroid blood screening, she also refused to do an ultra sound scan of the thyroid despite it being the next move as a multinodular goitre had been found as an incidental finding when I had a ct scan to exclude blood clots.

      This apology for a dr said well ‘we may not find anything. To which I blurted out well you won’t if you do not look will you?’
      I advised her just in case she could not read that the ct scan showed a multinodular goitre and that blood tests done elsewhere showed thyroid disease.

      I had said I felt depressed and very anxious -lus about 10 other signs and symptoms all screaming out the diagnosis of thyroid issues and she asked me if I wished to be referred to a osychiatrist.

      I said NO I did not know that endo issues were psychiatric problems. The point of this is to show that these drs know nothing about most conditions let alone being floxed which damages the thyroid.


      • L February 7, 2018 at 11:25 am Reply

        IT is astounding how ignorant so many doctors are. They have been force fed a standard protocol, relying heavily on big pharma, and if you have something that doesn’t fit perfectly in their little box, they are lost. And if you DARE to suggest a suspicion, you are ridiculed for doing “medicine by google” or told you are having mental issues. Another HUGE problem is that everyone is SO specialized, they not only are unable to make any connections to other parts of the body, they often complicate matters by treating part without looking at the whole. The ND that finally got me on the road to recovery, who of course is NOT covered by insurance, knew MORE about the entire body and its interactions/reactions than any of the other dozen MDs I saw.

        • Bob February 7, 2018 at 12:16 pm

          YES, It is astounding how ignorant they are. And they follow the guidance of the FDA. I am being treated by a homeopathic doctor right now and today he told me not to pay attention to anything coming out of the FDA. The FDA has been ” cracking down” on homeopathy which is by nature harmless. CIPRO which can cripple you and ruin your life is OK with them, the evil bastards.

        • L February 7, 2018 at 12:38 pm

          Yeah, my ND told me last week that they were making homeopathic remedies illegal, but I looked it up on Snopes and they are not illegal, but reclassified. Big pharma does not like competition. I just infuriates me that big pharma can literally KILL millions of people and disable millions more, but if ONE person has a bad reaction to anything natural, all hell breaks loose.

        • jat92517 February 7, 2018 at 1:24 pm

          When you realize medical school has only two years or less of technical courses and the rest is clinical ‘hands on’ teaching by observing the patients in thier field with no research project, our complaints fall in line with reality. They are not Doctors of Philosophy but Medical Doctors, trained in a treatment Protocol. We expect more than they are trained to do.

          Medicine chemistry has gotten so complex we need a new type of Doctor ,CMPhD to backup these people. They need to do some research that contributes to the “body of knowledge” (requires inductive and deductive reasoning and process analysis thinking skills) plus pharmacology, 6 chemistry courses, and Chemical process control experience. Then clinical on cases that require some dectective work under the supervision of a CMPhD plus a professor. The professor needs to keep learning the real world continuously.

          Then we’ll begin to understand how the human body works.

          I control my diabetes with a handful of over the counter supplements and a “eat what want diet” that limits, makes sure I get, or tracks the consumption of high glucose carbs. Often I am only taking one OTC supplement. I test my blood glucose once a week because it does not change very quickly.

        • L February 7, 2018 at 1:46 pm

          And yet, as I stated, my ND (AND my chiro AND my accupuncturist) know more about the body and its different systems than ANY of the MDs I saw. (and pharmacology is a big part of the problem.)

      • Bob February 7, 2018 at 12:22 pm Reply

        They are very poorly educated.

  10. Deb February 2, 2018 at 3:02 pm Reply

    Does anyone have herbal/natural suggestions for gastritis and indigestion? I don’t know if floxies can take antacids or something like Pepto Bismol. Thanks!

    • Virginia February 2, 2018 at 5:02 pm Reply

      There are lots of good natural remedies: I have used DGL (a form of licorice), Mastic gum, ginger, slipper elm, marshmallow root, aloe vera juice, and many others with success. You can google “natural remedies for gastritis/indigestion” and experiment with the suggestions.

      • L February 2, 2018 at 5:26 pm Reply

        Virginia do a word search on this site. There have been many posts dealing with this. Also look into betaine HCl with protein meals (dosage is tricky and best done with ND) Also digestive enzymes and absolutely add a good quality, multi strain probiotic

        • Mary February 6, 2018 at 12:45 pm

          L Thanks for your reply to the posting I sent with all the damage that Cipro and other flq causes to us.
          I will definitely try the prolozone as I am nearly giving in right now to these feelings of deep despair.

          There is no reply icon next to your name on your reply hence posting to you on another , hope that makes sense.

          Thanks once again. It does help to talk and share .BTW Did you read that drs/scientists re working on new antibiotics devised from ones they discarded in the past¬

          Chief of this crazy project is Dr O’Neill . London.Medical Research Council.

        • L February 6, 2018 at 1:12 pm

          Mary, it just makes me so disgusted that they are recycling old drugs. But I am not in the least surprise, because…..MONEY! How much cheaper to just bring back the oldies. A few tweaks, a new name, and they’ve got a new money maker!

          Are you in the US? If so, which state? You may be able to get someone to post if they have had the prolozone injections done in your area. (Btw, I am sure it depends on where you live, but my injections cost $200 per knee. Pretty cheap all things considered! My ND also did the arthritic hips, knees and back of the father of one of his employees, who just comes back every couple years for “tune ups,” but is good to go now!)

    • jat92517 February 7, 2018 at 10:00 pm Reply


      I still have a hard time posting this site . My equipment looses my posts. Yes you can take pepto Bismarck. Ginger tea also settles your stomach. Water helps me for a while.

      • Peter February 8, 2018 at 4:48 am Reply

        Additional comment – I also recommend finding a good Chinese acupuncturist who is proficient with herbs. My acupuncturist says that his herbs will not interfere with other meds or herbs I am taking. A good acupuncturist can address many of the issues related to floxing. Mine is dealing with 2 other floxies, one of whom was severely affected and is recovering. The Chinese approach is totally holistic and sees the body very differently from
        Western medicine, and distills the issue into simpler, broader solutions, but can also pinpoint individual specific symptoms. They can also activate healing processes.
        For gastric problems (I have acid reflux sometimes), I mix a little (1/4 teaspoon) baking soda
        with organic apple cider vinegar (2 tablespoons) in a small amount of water (no more than 1 cup). It will fizz at first. Doesn’t taste bad, or make me shiver like the cider alone does. Gives instant relief. The baking soda also draws out poisons. Again, run all these suggestions by your doctor first, to make sure there are no contraindications for you personally .

        • jat92517 February 8, 2018 at 5:42 am


          Baking Soad and Vinegar neutralize each other so basically you are drink mined Salt in water water. Better to use Sea salt in water or just water.

        • Peter February 8, 2018 at 10:30 am

          Hi John –

          Ok. Seems to work for me when I have acid indigestion. Causes me to burb, and then
          the acid feeling goes away. Picked it up from a natural healing site.

        • Mary February 8, 2018 at 6:20 pm

          Peter Does the baking soda chelate the Cipro etc? Thanks sorry for short posting.

        • Peter February 8, 2018 at 7:19 pm

          Hi Mary –

          I don’t know, some research says baking soda does pull out toxins. When I use it for stomach acid issues, I use very little of it, half a teaspoon or less, and not often.

          Cilantro (coriander) has been known to remove heavy metal from tissues, so I eat a lot of it (I really like Indian food – there is a company called Saffron Road that makes excellent gluten-free frozen Indian, Mexican and other cuisines, all which are great with cilantro). A few people (about 10% of the population) genetically don’t get along with cilantro – you will know if it smells and tastes like soap, instead of the fragrant herb that it is. Cipro isn’t necessarily a heavy metal, but I go for anything that is healthy and has de-toxifying properties.

          I also put organic turmeric powder in these ethnic dishes. I also cook with it (it withstands the heat), and again, not much is needed. As the regime says, foods like broccoli, Brussel sprouts, garlic, onions, etc. are all good for floxies. I eat these foods cooked only. The raw form is too intense for the stomach. One must also find a really pure organic olive oil,
          cold pressed and unmixed with other oils, as a lot of olive oil is mixed.

          Organic coconut oil is excellent for the brain, especially a floxed brain. I put it in my oatmeal, along with organic lowfat plain kefir and berries – blueberries, blackberries especially, and cinnamon. Really good.

          After a time the Cipro is gone. The issue that remains is that the Cipro triggered the body to go into an aberrant autoimmune response that needs to be
          neutralized by building up your resources and immune system. Acupuncture is very useful to pinpoint the autoimmune response, and stabilize it back to equilibrium, along with diet, supplements, exercise, hydration, meditation and attitude. My acupuncturist is really good
          at the treatments, and I always feel relief for quite a while afterwards. Sometimes it
          is really powerfully relaxing, and I end up sleeping without movement right on the table,
          feeling nicely drugged by the bio-chemicals that have been released by my own body, and then float into my car for the ride home. Does not make me spacey. Quite the opposite –
          the physical relief also relieves anxiety and lets me focus.

          As always, check with your doctor first before following a layperson’s advice.

    • Henk Noordhuizen February 14, 2018 at 4:46 pm Reply

      I have the same problems and eating a grapefruit or other citrusfruit shortly after a meal really helps. Others deal with this problems by taking 1 or 2 spoons of appel cider vinager in a glass of water but I prefer fruit. why this helps? Because the main cause is,in most people, NOT too much but NOT ENOUGH stomach acid.

  11. Mary February 3, 2018 at 4:36 pm Reply

    Hi everyone Have u seen the warning from the fda about IMMODIUM/LOPERAMIDE/

    • Mary February 6, 2018 at 3:10 pm Reply

      L Thanks for your reply re making of ‘new’ antibiotics from the crap they discarded years ago. I am in the UK.

      I get really ratty with this peripheral neuropathy or whatever misdiagnosis given to me to cov er up the prescribing of Cipro with a short five day of prednisone for a chest infection. First thing that happened was severe depression followed by all the lovely side effects we know so well.

      A physio told me that the pain was due to medication! Then an endocrinologist confirmed this saying it was due to antibiotic toxicity syndrome that is what led me to this wonderful website. No bloody treatment offered !! Sorry for the rant.

      Did u see the video by Dr Mark Gallili who suffered toxicity but says stem cell treatment cured him?

      Take care.

      • L February 6, 2018 at 3:46 pm Reply

        I did see the video and in fact spoke with him on the phone. I think “The sooner the better” as far as that goes. Also I have read that age effects the viability of your own stem cells. Anyhow, can’t afford it!

        • Mary February 6, 2018 at 4:02 pm

          Hi L How much does it cost? Is it available in UK? Have u got his phone number please? I feel so depressed with all of this s… L have u got a list of ALL the drugs containing fluoride
          I wonder if Lady GAGA was floxed?

        • L February 6, 2018 at 4:24 pm

          I just looked his number up online. You have his name from the article. He is in Beverly Hills I believe. CAn’t remember the cost just that it sounded like more than I could afford (several thousand) best to call and talk to him or his staff yourself

  12. patricia helt February 3, 2018 at 8:37 pm Reply

    Hi all
    I don’t visit this site much anymore so I apologize if this has already been brought up: i tried to reach out to a fellow floxie but got no response , but it is the subject on vaccines. Has anyone received the flu shot post flox? Im extremely sceptical about vaccines, but am considering switching careers where vaccines, especially the flu shot, are required. Any thoughts?

    • Bob February 3, 2018 at 8:56 pm Reply

      I would stay away from them. What does your intuition tell you?

      • patricia February 3, 2018 at 10:59 pm Reply

        Good question Bob:) im going w my intuition and staying far away

    • L February 3, 2018 at 9:01 pm Reply

      Both my ND and my integrative MD advised me not to. I will never get the flu vaccine again. There are too many toxins in it. Plus, it’s such a crap shoot….effectiveness can be as low as 10%. The last two years pre-floxing that I got the flu shot, I ALSO got the flu. Since then I have gotten the flu two of three years and nipped it in the bud both times with oil of oregano, Sambuca, olive leaf extract and zinc lozenges. If you have a career where you have to get the vaccine or wear a mask, I would opt for the mask. We have already had our bodies so damaged by toxins. We don’t need more.

      • patricia February 3, 2018 at 10:55 pm Reply

        Thanks L….i know how toxic those vaccines are, it’s frustrating how so many employers require these vaccinations.

      • Deb February 4, 2018 at 4:18 pm Reply

        Hi L,

        I haven’t had the flu but your advice on the oil of oregano was so good for the respiratory infection I had, I wanted to know your protocol for the oil of oregano, Sambuca and olive leaf are just to have. Thanks!

        • L February 4, 2018 at 5:05 pm

          Sure. For the oil of oregano I always buy organic and one that comes already mixed in a carrier oil (you never want to ingest it without the oil.) I put several drops under my tongue, hold for about ten seconds, add a bit of water, and swallow. I do that 3 times a day for 7-10 days. AS for the sambucol (actually sambucus, or elderberry, not that brand), I again buy organic and just follow the bottle directions. I think they have two sets. one is more for maintenance and the other is if you are actually sick. As for the olive leaf, my doctor put me on that for a month when he thought my asthma may have been from a virus. Again, I just followed the bottle directions.

    • Barbara Arnold February 4, 2018 at 2:12 am Reply

      Patricia, I have had the flu shot many times, before and after being floxed. I have not had the flu since. This is a very difficult decision for us all. We are all different with different health issues. I used to get bronchitis and the flu quite a lot before I retired. I did look into the ingredients and yes they to contain some toxic chemical’s, to preserve the vaccine, but the amount is so minute, a fruit juice or any package food stuff or even wine contain more toxins. However it was a no brainer for me because I am in the high risk group and I did not want to take the chance. So far so good. There are many different opinions on this and we all have to decide for ourselves. I personally did not have any negative re action, but that’s just me.

      • Madge hirsch February 4, 2018 at 11:40 am Reply

        Hi Barbara- oral ingestion of toxins such as aluminium is a lot less dangerous than having them injected into you.

      • patricia February 5, 2018 at 6:45 am Reply

        Thank you for your reply Barbara, im glad the flu shot has worked for you and you didnt have any reaction to it. I wonder about all the other vaccines, like MMR….if those are safe post flox?

  13. Barbara Arnold February 4, 2018 at 11:55 pm Reply

    L…that article scares me to death, so even only 20% effective I would still have it. Thing is, different Countries have different strains, and so far Spain’s strain seems to be warding off an epidemic. I’m not sure about the UK. It’s all a bloody minefield, but the jab is the only allopathic meficine I take. I do every thing I can to not take meds, but who knows for the future.
    I have just finnished my 20 sessions of hyperbaric oxygen therapy and I am feeling so much better. I have decided to have one or two a month to keep up the momentum. I would say overall I am 95 to 98% back to where I was, and considering my age I think that’s quite good. xx

  14. Peter February 6, 2018 at 3:41 pm Reply

    Hello all –

    I was floxed by Cipro at the end of October 2017, so it’s been over 3 months. Luckily I found this site the first day the symptoms appeared (thank you Lisa). My symptoms were neuropathy in the legs and some in the hands, but worst was the attack on the joints, especially shoulders and hands. There was some spaciness mentally, but I think a lot of that was the anxiety of having to deal with the floxing. Since then I have followed the diet and supplements regime.
    The neuropathy is pretty much gone, as is the pain and looseness in the hands. One of the shoulder sockets is still weak, but nothing like before.
    I found that not all of the supplements in the regime were good for me, because I already have a genetic central nervous system disorder called dysautonomia, and my type includes
    scoliosis, mitral valve prolapse and other features that cause issues. So, one has to try the supplements by trial and error, especially the dosages, to see how you react. Dysautonomiacs are hypersensitive to medications and supplements, so, especially with Magnesium, I have to be careful. The recommendation by one of the participants here named John to do Espsom salt foot soaks has been very helpful, with no side effects, and
    the relief is pretty quick. I also have Magnesium spray and gel when one joint acts up.
    The tendency is to do too much too quickly, which for me caused nausea and loose stools for a few days, as I was taking magnesium pills and the gel at the same time.
    Organic bone broth (they have it at Whole Foods and even at the Publix supermarket) is great to keep up collagen and protein, but I also take collagen supplement, the type recommended on the regime, plus the recommended multivitamin (which has a good amount of magnesium already), Vitamin C, D3, Omega capsules, etc. I found CoQ10 to
    aggravate palpitations, so I backed off, but that was due to dysautonomia.
    Organic plain kefir (not the versions with sugared flavors) has been great for the digestive system. No issues since having it daily. I mix it with organic gluten-free oatmeal and berries in the morning.
    Exercise daily, but no more than 30 minutes – swimming/walking/elliptical/light weights (but be careful or even avoid if joints are affected). Also, there is a very good website for dealing with anticipatory anxiety
    at http://www.verywellmind.com, plus Andrew Weil has a CD for breath techniques to help with

    Just wanted people to know it gets better. I have stayed absolutely away from sugar, tobacco, alcohol. Eating organic (not just plants, but fish and chicken with no antibiotics, hormones, etc.) and staying hydrated. Pure water. Fight through and keep doing
    the things you need and love to do as much as possible. Keep your living area neat and clean, to help feel normal. Envision yourself getting better. Listen to music, watch funny TV, be with people who care about you and who are willing to listen.
    This is just what has worked for me. Run everything by your doctor first. Everyone is different, but everyone’s body wants to heal if you let it. The body is very intelligent, and
    has a lot of power and resources already built in for healing. Just allow it to do so by
    giving it what it needs to heal.

    • leslie February 8, 2018 at 7:57 am Reply

      hi peter. Did you do or take anything to make your neuropathy go away?

      • Peter February 8, 2018 at 10:24 am Reply

        Hi Leslie –

        A few things helped with the neuropathy – First is magnesium, and again, be careful – start with a small amount and work up to higher amounts. I found that for me, taking chelated
        magnesium tablets tended to have more side effects (loose stools, nausea at higher doses)
        than the Epsom salt foot baths. The magnesium gel (Amazon has the gel from Ancient Minerals, and Pure Magnesium Oil spray from Life-Flo). Both get their magnesium from the Zechstein sea bed. I found the gel to be more powerful than the spray, so be careful, especially if you also take the chelated Mg tablets. I actually burned the skin on my shoulders with the gel, when I first tried it, not knowing how strong it was. The gels have salt in them, so it will sting slightly at first. Both the spray and the gel should not be kept on for long – 15 min. max or less. If you feel relief before 15 min., wipe it off.

        The second help has been acupuncture and Chinese herbs. My acupuncturist is Chinese, and is proficient in Chinese herbs, and teaches doctors and med student at UMiami about acupuncture. Try to find someone trained in China, because they are better with the herbs, and are better able to give clear and simple overviews of your condition.

        Third is hydration. The body needs pure water to help eliminate toxins, and a dehydrated body, studies show, will show greater symptoms than one properly hydrated. This is not easy, since the thirst mechanism seems to get compromised in floxing, so sometimes you
        can’t tell that your body is thirsty. Also, on the other hand, too much water can be heavy on the kidneys, so you need to be very attentive to what your body is telling you.

        Fourth, and probably most important, is to get proper sleep. Best to be very disciplined
        with this – wake up at the same time every day, try to avoid napping, and go to bed the same time every night. If you have to nap, try to do it before 3 pm, so your night sleep isn’t screwed. This comes from both the Children’s Dysautonomia Foundation in Washington DC, for people with sleep issues, and also a sleep psychologist I worked with. The floxing
        intensified some of the dysautonomia issues (which are unrelated to but exacerbated by floxing), but I am happy and grateful to find that
        all these issues are easing off tremendously. The “hump” seems to have been about 3 1/2 months from the initial floxing symptoms. I have no more neuropathy, but
        it is very clear that the magnesium is still needed, as joint weakness reverts without it.
        Your body and autonomic system need sleep. That is when a lot of your unconscious healing mechanisms (your autonomic system) do a lot of their healing work. The vagus nerve exercises also prime your body and mind for that healing.

        Resolving anxiety may be hard if you are really anxious, which is why the Vagus Nerve booklet is really good – has great exercises for anxiety relief. Valerian root is also good for relaxation and sleep, but it is tricky, as dosage and quality must be carefully researched – don’t rely on what Whole Foods employees tell you – do your own careful research. One can also become dependent on such supplements, as they are meant for temporary relief.
        I have used it a few times, in liquid drops. Smells bad, tastes ok, and it worked for me. But,
        run it by your doctor as everyone’s body and health situation is unique, and it could
        conflict with other things you may be taking.

        Fifth, which is the most elusive, is your attitude and perspective. If you take the positive position that you are essentially in training to get stronger, and not a victim, the brain will start sending endorphins and healing biochemicals to the areas that need it. Visualizing yourself and all your organs, tissues, blood, brain, bones, etc. as getting healthier and stronger also sets up the internal healing mechanisms already existing and waiting to go
        in your body.

        Sixth is exercise – Some form daily. As Lisa mentioned, swimming is really good, because
        the water suspends your body weight. But, there should be cross-training, such as walking or elliptical, so your bones remain strong. Exercise does a million things to move the healing along, and also triggers more body chemicals that make you feel good physically and emotionally. Yoga is also really good. Sun Salutations done slowly with proper breathing
        are all I really need to do yoga wise. When I was younger, I also lived and traveled in India for about a year, meeting all types of teachers. I finally found one who shows a way to
        go within, very practically, and it really helps. Very powerful and wonderful feeling.
        You can check it out on http://www.timelesstoday.com. There is also an app. I have been practicing the meditation since 1974 and it has saved my life. Meditation, by all accounts,
        is tremendously helpful and activates your parasympathetic system, for rest and healing.
        There is no downside to meditation.

        Again, I am not a doctor, just someone who has been doing research and trial and error to
        get myself better. Check with your doctor before putting anything into your body you are not used to, how much exercise you should do, diet, etc.

        Visualize yourself as someone who is now doing what you can to help your body do what it wants to do, which is to recover and get better and really healthy. See your body and
        your whole being getting better. The dark side of your mind wants to dismiss attitude as having any power, but your mind and attitude will be the greatest elements in your healing.
        Bring some light into a room that has been dark for a while, and the darkness will go away immediately, no matter how long the darkness has been there, and no matter how dark it has been. There may be setbacks along the way, but you will find yourself getting
        that much better as you go along. Acknowledge and embrace the improvements in how you feel, and don’t dwell on setbacks, if symptoms linger or return for a while. It just means you haven’t yet given yourself and your body what they need to get better, and it takes patience. Once you do, you will get better. Enjoy your life while you go through this. Your life is not floxing. Floxing is just a temporary bump in the road.

  15. Mary February 6, 2018 at 4:15 pm Reply

    Dear Peter Just wanted to say what a great .If u don’t mind my saying so.
    A few days ago the PN seemed to calm down. I was worried as I had not taken any magnesium for a few days and felt I needed it to help the D3 absorb. I am convinced the magnesium triggered off a reaction. I feel suicidal.

    I cannot take CoQ10 enzyme either due to cardiac issues. Please can u tell me how to buy the organic bone broth? Is it produced in the UK or just the US?
    Magnesium gives me the same problems as it gives you .

    How are you feeling now/

    • Henk Noordhuizen February 14, 2018 at 3:19 pm Reply

      Mary,you can make (organic) broth yourself. In a shop which sells organic meat,ask for the bones you want Te.g.:chicken,cow,etc.). Cook them for 3-4 hours,with some salt added.There you have your broth :-))

      It is important to understand that too high levers of magnesium can give te same symptoms as too low levels. It is possible t let your magnesium be tested (intercellulair; the only reliable way to see if you are low,or high in magnesium. Calcium and Vit. D3 are,indeed,very important for the uptake of magnesium but Vit. K1 and K2 are of the same importance! The british cottage cheese is a good source of Vit K.

      In the Netherlands we have,deep underground,the most our source of magnesium chloride in the world:Zechstein. You can buy the salt (flakes) and make a (foot-)bath with it,but there’s also a liquid called magnesium-oil.It is not oil-based but just (destilled) water with 31% MgCl,which gives it a slippery feel,like oil. The oil is quite expensive but ik make it myself by making a saturated solution of the magnesium flakes (47% MgCl) in destilled water.I’m not sure if this magnesium salt is obtainable in the UK.

      Cardiac issues are often caused by a defficiency of magnesium and/or other minerals (e.g. natrium and kalium are important electrolytes). Of great importance is relaxation; yoga,meditation,a walk in the forrest or along the beach. Or just listening to calming sounds,classic music (Mozart,Dvorak,etc.).

      You can rub the magnesium-oil on your skin end,preferably leave it there.But when you are very deficient it might irritate a lot. The,next time,mix 1 part of the “oil” with one or two parts of (distilled) water. You can also take a bath with 400-500 grams of zechtstein salt,or Epsom salt,as hot as you can bare,and for at least 30 minutes,or longer. Let someone keep an eye on you;you might get so relaxed that you fall asleep and could end up drawning. Both ways,the oil-rubbing and the bath,are very relaxing and alow for a way higher intake of magnesium without it acting as a laxative,like it does when you consume a magnesiumsupplement.

      • L February 14, 2018 at 3:37 pm Reply

        good advice Henk. Except for bone broth, bones need to cook for 6-24 hours, and preferably toward that latter number. (The reason most people don’t do it themselves.)

        • Henk Noordhuizen February 14, 2018 at 3:46 pm

          The 3 hours I mentioned is the shortest time they need. You can start the process right after you started your day and leave it on the stove untill you go to bed (a total of 14 to 16 hours?). It helps a lot if you break the bones (hammer?) because the bonemarrow contains lots of good stuff :-))

  16. Peter February 7, 2018 at 9:16 am Reply

    Hi Mary – the bone broth comes in cartons of different sizes, for beef, chicken and turkey broth. Your local health food store can get it for you if they don’t have it in stock. Whole Foods also has bone broths with herbs, mushrooms, etc., for taste, as the
    plain bone broth is pretty bland. I sometimes mix in celery, carrots, salt (I use Himalayan pink salt, which has lots of good minerals in it). I actually also need salt for blood volume, which is a dysautonomia issue – the opposite of most people.

    I just looked on Amazon – for bone broths they have Pacific brand and Kettle and Fire, the two types I use – in cartons. It’s not cheap, but I find it very helpful – your body will tell you how much to take. Some days I want it more than others.

    From what I understand: whatever fluoroquinolone is taken leeches magnesium from connective tissue, and needs to be replaced. D3 is needed to process, as is calcium, but
    it is recommended to get your calcium through your food rather than supplements, due to
    potential interference by the calcium supplement to other processes. If you take it through your food, your body will process it as needed to work with the magnesium. Your body’s internal doctor is the best and smartest doctor you can get.

    If you had a bad reaction to the magnesium, you likely took too much. The amount recommended on this site was way too much for me, even when I did a gradual increase – caused palpitations, loose stools,
    nausea. But, when I reduced the dosage (I top out at 300-400 per day, including gel or spray) on the magnesium, those symptoms went away and clicking, popping, pain and looseness in the joints subsided. But, I again recommend the Epsom salt foot baths that John recommended on this site. I use a plastic tub big enough for both feet, fill it with warm water up to the ankles, and put in 2 lbs of the salt, and move my feet around in it until it dissolves,
    and have my feet in it for 15 minutes, then wipe off with a towel. I do not rinse off right away.
    In the same way as above, the body seems to know exactly how much to absorb (magnesium absorbs easily through the skin, and the feet are the most resilient access point and less prone to dryness.) If you do the foot baths and still have pain, then a good magnesium gel or spray, applied very lightly to the area of concern, can help directly and quickly.

    Again, run all of this by your doctor, especially if you have cardiac issues. Magnesium
    is something you have to be very careful with. Floxies need it more than other people, but
    it is easy to take too much. Everyone’s body is different. Having dysautonomia makes me hypersensitive to all meds and supplements, so I take less of everything than normal.

    The article that was presented by Lisa Palmer called “The Vagus Nerve Guide” is very good.
    Has a lot of good stuff in it to learn how to relax and get your parasympathetic (rest and healing) part of your central nervous system stimulated, and to get many of the body’s organs into equilibrium, and reduce stress and anxiety. I got it on the Amazon online feature off the link from this site.

    Visualizing yourself getting better, one day at a time, is very powerful. Don’t fall prey to
    the negative thoughts. Reject them and visualize yourself healthy on a peaceful beach, breathing normally and relaxed, and happy and confident. It really works to activate
    healing hormones and to just relax and relieve worry. The mind has a lot to do with this.

    If you have Apple TV, watch the movie called “Heal”. Excellent movie about the power of
    mind to heal.

    I am not a doctor, and am only talking from my experience and personal researach. Run any suggestions on this site by your doctor first (I have found that most doctors need to be educated about this syndrome – bring literature and shove it in their face if they look skeptical). Most specialists are myopic, and focus only on their specialty, and do not have
    holistic knowledge of the body. My best link is my general practitioner, who I have been seeing for over 25 years – he is more open and knowledgeable about all these things, as he
    sees many different conditions and ailments, whereas specialists only see ailments within their discipline. I have seen a lot of specialists over the years, and most of them are more ignorant than they want to admit.

    Keep going – you will heal, don’t worry. Enjoy your life, and adjust the way you see
    what you are going through – see an open peaceful road rather than a prison, because that
    open road runs next to the beautiful beach, where you can go if you want to relax and watch the beauty, and breathe slowly and deeply.

  17. Andrea February 8, 2018 at 6:36 am Reply

    Hi everyone. After reading about stem cells, I’ve just contacted, via email, a stem cells clinic in Switzerland. I’ll keep you updated as soon as they answer me.

  18. Gerard February 13, 2018 at 3:37 am Reply
  19. jérôme February 13, 2018 at 5:34 am Reply

    Did someone try a diet or a fasting?

    • Andrea February 13, 2018 at 11:32 am Reply

      Hi Jerome. Yes me.
      If you read some of my previous posts I’ve shared my exeperiences. Anyway I’ll sum them up here : Diet, very important. I’ve noticed a big difference when I eat clean. By clean I mean lots of organic veggies and frutis. Whole grains,beans, some organic eggs. I’ve noticed that an 80-90% vegan diet works the best for me. Dairy seems to be pro inflammatory for me. Same with chciken and meat. I try to avoid any kind of simple sugar,refined carbs and junk food in general. They’re so bad for me. I completely give up coffe too. It’s the worst for my brain/dizziness issues.
      I’ve tried to fast for 3 days.No food, no supplements. Only water for 72 hours straight. I did it because I’ve read about the fast mimicking diet by Dr Walter Longo (check it out and let me know what do you think about it), who is Italian like me 🙂 ,but I’ve gotta tell you that it was too much for me. I was too weak, too dizzy and by the third day all my symptoms fleared up again. Luckly after reintroducing food and supplements , expecially Vitamin D3, they were back to normal. I hope you’ll find this helpful.

      • jérôme February 14, 2018 at 2:16 am Reply

        Andrea,have you tried also a monodiet? I intend to to a coconut monodiet for 2 or 3 days…I will probably do a long water fasting if my symptoms don’t improve…

        • jérôme February 14, 2018 at 2:17 am

          I take only one meal a day (Omad) and feel it gives me more energy

        • Andrea February 14, 2018 at 12:07 pm

          Nope. Never tried a monodiet. Anyway, be carefoul if you want to try to fast. There were moments during the fast that I barely could stay up for more than a few minutes. Like I said, it was too much for me.
          It wasn’t the first time I fasted. I remeber years ago, so before being floxed, I tried to fast for 2 days and it wasn’t that bad…Did you checked the Valter Longo’s mimicking diet? It is basically a 5 days “fast” with minimal amounts of foods,It is supposed to regenerate your cell

  20. Andrea February 13, 2018 at 11:38 am Reply

    Hi everyone. I’m probably going to do a new medical exam, and there’s a big chance of contracting a Urinary tract infection from that. I’ve already explained to the doctor my problems, and he prescribed me Trimethoprim/sulfamethoxazole by the commercial name Bactrim. Does anyone knows if it’s compatible for us floxies? Thanks a lot.

    • jérôme February 14, 2018 at 2:34 am Reply

      Andrea,Bactrim is a very dangerous antibiotic;try to avoid it…google it

      • Andrea February 14, 2018 at 12:08 pm Reply

        All right. Thanks.

  21. Mary February 13, 2018 at 6:55 pm Reply

    Contact Us
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    You are here: Home / Lupus Primer / Lifestyle and Additional Information / Things to Avoid
    Things to Avoid
    If you have lupus or a condition that predisposes you to lupus, such as undifferentiated connective tissue disease (UCTD), there are certain foods and medications that you should avoid. The substances listed below have shown to induce lupus signs and flares and should be avoided by people with lupus or autoimmune diseases suggesting “pre-lupus.”
    (1) Sunlight
    People with lupus should avoid the sun, since sunlight can cause rashes and flares. Some people are more sensitive to sunlight than others, but all people with lupus are advised to be cautious when they are outside. Of course, it would be impractical to completely avoid going outdoors, but try to be prepared. Carry a sunscreen with an SPF of at least 70 and be sure that your sunscreen contains Helioplex, an ingredient that blocks UV-A and UV-B rays, both of which are harmful to people with lupus. Apply sunscreen to all areas of the body, even those covered by your clothes, since most normal clothing items only protect your skin to the level of SPF 5. In addition, carry a hat with you when you know you will be outside. Certain sportswear manufacturers now make hats with SPF built into the material, which may be helpful for people with greater photosensitivity.
    (2) Bactrim and Septra (sulfamethoxazole and trimethoprim)
    Bactrim and Septra are antibiotics that contain sulfamethoxazole and trimethoprim. They are grouped as “sulfa” antibiotics because they contain a substance called sulfonamide. Bactrim and Septra are often prescribed for bacterial infections, especially urinary tract infections. They are also sometimes given prophylactically (i.e., to prevent infection), especially in people taking immunosuppressive medications. However, it is very important that you avoid Bactrim and Septra, because these antibiotics are known to cause an increase in sun sensitivity and lower blood counts in people with lupus, resulting in lupus flares. Several medications can be used instead of Bactim or Septra for the prevention and treatment of infection; perhaps the most frequently used substitute is Dapsone (diaminodiphenyl sulfone) to prevent Pneumocystis pneumonia.
    (3) Garlic
    Scientists believe that three substancs in garlic—allicin, ajoene, and thiosulfinates—rev-up your immune system by enhancing the activity of white blood cells, particularly macrophages and lymphocytes. Scientists also believe that the sulfur components of garlic help to prevent and suppress cancer in the body. For this reason, garlic is often used as a supplement to combat colds and infections. Unfortunately, the enhancement of immune response is counterproductive in people with autoimmune disease such as lupus, because their immune system is already overactive. As a result, people with lupus and lupus-like signs should avoid cooking with garlic and adding it to food. Of course, a tiny amount of the herb will not harm you, but try to consciously avoid purchasing and preparing foods with garlic.
    (4) Alfalfa Sprouts
    Alfalfa sprouts contain an amino acid called L-canavanine that can increase inflammation in people with lupus by stimulating the immune system. As a result, people with lupus and similar autoimmune conditions should avoid alfalfa sprouts completely.
    (5) Melatonin and Rozerem (ramelteon)
    Melatonin is a hormone secreted by the pineal gland in your brain that regulates other hormones in the body that control how your body reacts to daily patterns of light and dark. Melatonin release is suppressed during the light hours of the day and stimulated by dark, helping you stick to patterns of nighttime sleep and daytime wakefulness. As a result, melatonin is often used as a sleep aid over other medications. Melatonin and melatonin-containing supplements should be avoided in people with lupus and other autoimmune disorders because they may stimulate the immune system. In addition, people with these conditions should also avoid the prescription sleep aid Rozerem (ramelteon), because it mimics melatonin in the body. It is important that you understand the necessity of avoiding both melatonin and Rozerem, since sleep aids are often used to help people with fibromylagia and other conditions to attain normal sleep patterns. In general, be sure that you speak with your physician before taking any new medications or supplements.
    (6) Echinacea
    Echinacea is often used as a dietary supplement to boost the immune system against colds and other illnesses. However, because Echinacea boosts your immune system, it may cause flares in people with autoimmune diseases such as lupus. In fact, Echinacea supplements sold in Europe bear warning labels that advise against use by people with autoimmune diseases. As a result, people with lupus and other autoimmune diseases should avoid these supplements. In general, it is important that you speak with your physician before taking any new medications or supplements.
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    • Andrea February 14, 2018 at 12:10 pm Reply

      Thanks Mary

  22. jérôme February 14, 2018 at 2:22 am Reply

    jat92517,what do you mean by saturated foot bath?

    • Theresa Warren February 14, 2018 at 8:52 am Reply

      He has mentioned it many times. It is a foot bath with so much epsom salt that a thin layer of salt lies on the bottom of the tub because the solution is saturated.

  23. L February 14, 2018 at 11:55 am Reply

    So….Lisa has posted a few blogs re mast cell activation after being floxed, and now I just read that if you have one of of MTHFR mutations, you are ALSO more likely to be plagued by this. Double whammy. No wonder I am so congested all the time!

    • Mary February 16, 2018 at 3:00 pm Reply

      L I know it really makes me despair. I detest drs for their arrogance, lack of knowledge etc, etc. I wish I had never taken any meds especially that poison aka Fluoroqiunolone. xx

      • L February 16, 2018 at 4:51 pm Reply

        yeah, me too. I am down to thyroid meds and a rescue inhaler. Hope to not take ANY pharmaceuticals ever again!

        • Mary February 20, 2018 at 7:44 am

          L mind my asking what inhalers and thyroid meds you are taking?

          Have you ever been prescribed that poison aka Lyrica. It destroys the immune system. Website Lyrica survivors . Sorry re the questions.x

        • L February 20, 2018 at 10:20 am

          Levothyroxine for the thyroid, and Ventolin a “rescue inhaler.” Re lyrica, I had read realy bad things about it, so no never took it. I will not take a prescription unless I have exhausted all other possibilities. I was on inhaled steroids for decades, during which time I was assured by doctors that they would not harm bones, even though I was skeptical. And of course now it turns out they do. Plus they contain not just steroids but fluoride. I had to find a way off of them when I was floxed, and fortunately ended up with an ND that gave me H2O2 IVs. I weaned off of them, and for three years never had one asthma attack. More recently, last November, I had breathing issues, that I think came from some kind of virus. I was using the rescue inhaler, with my doctor’s “blessing” up to 5 times a day. I got some IVs when it was really rough, and took supplements to help with inflammation and congestion. I am back to being inhaler free now.

      • jat92517 February 17, 2018 at 1:11 am Reply


        Chronic congestion is one of the symptoms of food intolerance. Alternating loose and hard stools is another. Pimples in your skin all over is a third. One does not always experience all. The ruling diagnostic is to look internally at the condition of the intestinal villia. OR you can lookup elimination diets – you avoid a list of foods for a week to see if your congestion improves. There are 8 common foods – gluten and soy are the top two. As all soy is toxic today, soy should be avoided. Peanuts is a third. Peanuts can give severe allergic reactions also – this is not the same thing.

        Something is making this mucus. If you can’t bring it up and Mucinex doesn’t work, Dr. D’Adomo sells Redox – an herbal decongestant that will loosen this type of congestion. Call his office and the person you talk to will give you a quiz on symptoms first. That is another diagnostic. A bottle costs $25 but you get an answer in two days. If it works look for which food is the cause.

        Food intolerance is difficult to diagnose as there are many causes and many symptoms. Everybody can have this to different degrees…but chronic congestion often appears.

        I hope you do not have this as it eventually makes you nutritionally deficient and recovering from that is tough duty.


        John Taylor

        • Henk Noordhuizen February 17, 2018 at 6:00 am

          All this symptoms are,indeed,symptoms of a food intolerance. And thát is a symptom of an imbalance in your gut,because the antibiotics killed lots of bacteria. Some bacteria-families will probably have totally,maybe even permanently have disappeared,and some others took their place,among them,possibly,”bad” ones. Medication to work on the symptoms won’t give a lasting effect; main thing to do is bringing the good bacteria back,if possible. You’ll need a good probiotic,and a good prébiotic as well,to help those new bacteria (probiotics) settle in your guts.

          Congestion,when talking about mucus in the lungs you can’t get rid of: try tea of Narrow Leaved Plantain;it works miracles! I have two different plants of Plantain in my garden (The Narror Leaved is from seeds I collected in the wild,the quite Common Plantain grew there already) The juice from the leaves works miracles on irritation from nettles,or musquito bites (I’ve tried ol the salves available on the bites but nothing works near as well as Plantain juice. You can eat the leaves in salads,too,or use some leaves when making a healthy juice with your (slow-)juicer. The taste of the leaves is not my favorite but in a juice with other ingredients it’s fine.

          When you have problems with a (too) hard stool, try Psyllium seeds. My doctor gave me a synthetic fiber drink but I was not happy with it. It worked well in softening the stool (averse reaction from another medicine),but it had its own nasty adverse reactions, and I replaced it with the Psyllium seeds. The seeds I buy are broken already; just add water,and I add half a teaspoon of Vit. C powder as wel.

          I had,after the first cours if AB’s I got in 2004 (Amoxicilline and Metronidazole) loose stool for over 3 years (!),and even little bits of sugar or carbohydrates (whole wheat bread,etc).made my bloodsugarlevel go crazy. Up and down (hyper- and hypoglycemia). I lost all hope to ever get well when I (re-)discovered the work of Bob Beck.I build a Blood Purifier (now called Silver Pulser,made by Sota),and a Magnetic Pulser, decided to give the MP a try on my belly,and, to my big suprice, after just two weeks I had a normal stool,and the intollerance for carbo’s and sugar was almost gone. That’s why I decided to by those devices from Sota; my homebuild are still there and I often use those but I’m happy as hell that I own those Sota devices;they’re more convenient to use and very well build.

          After the Cyproflox (2 days/4 pills,sept.2016) my stool stayed oké (thanks to the nasty medicine that still makes it so hard?),but my bloodsugarlever went crazy once again. After a month I decided to use the Pulser again and in two weeks time my bloodsugar stabilized. A few weeks ago the went crazy once again,probably because op the preservatives in the bread I ate (to my suprise that bread did not spoil for almost 2 weeks;normaly I see the first start of fungus after 3-4 days). Now I decided to do the whole protocol (except for the Coll.SIlverwater),and concentrate on pulsing my pancreas,and after,again,two weeks,my sugarlevel is,again,stable!

          I know that one of the reverse reactions to antibiotics is a (severe,sometimes even daedly) infection of the pancreas,but now I believe that the Hyper- and hypoglycemia is related to someting like that. The Beck Protocol really works; inform yourself (bobbeck.com) and build those devices yourself (cheap,but work well) or find a friend/neighbor who can help you with the build.When you have plenty of money;boy from Sota Instruments;you won’t be disappointed.

          I want to excuse myself for my long writings but it took me years to collect all the information that helped me so well; there’s a lot of BS on the web an it took a lot of time to find the onfo worthy of knowing (and a lot of money ass well :-(( and now I want to share what I know and found to work with other people who might need it.

          Have a nice weekend.Greetings from The Netherlands :-))

  24. Andrea February 14, 2018 at 12:25 pm Reply

    How about Ampicillin? Like I said, I’m going to do a cystoscopy, and the doctor says there’s the risk of contracting an infection. He wanted me to take Bactrim, but ‘m not going to take it. Some side effects are similar to those of FQ.I’ve read the article that Lisa posted about the antibiotics after being floxed, but I found nothing about Ampicillin, any iinfo?

    • Madge hirsch February 15, 2018 at 9:49 am Reply

      I have recently finished a 14 day stint of Augmentin iv and then oral for another severe bout of diverticulitis. Apart from some diarrhoea after switching to the oral I have been ok. The diarrhoea was helped a lot by taking Saccharomyces boulardii a probiotic yeast and my usual probiotic in between the doses of Augmentin. I have noticed some worsening of my floxing symptoms but that could be down to the stress of being unwell and the prospect of the bowel resection I have decided to undergo as I am sick of these diverticuli !

      • Andrea February 15, 2018 at 12:50 pm Reply

        Thanks a lot for the infos Madge

      • Mary February 16, 2018 at 1:39 pm Reply

        Andrea I recently read an article on the causes of gut problems. additives, processed foods , artificial sweeteners and this includes aspartame and saccharin.

        Lactose can cause irritation of the intestines and diarrhoe Augmentin is a fierce antibiotic.

  25. Martha February 14, 2018 at 12:48 pm Reply

    Thinking of everyone who has suffered with this. I am three years lost floxing from levaquin. I regained all functionality thank God. But the use of medications proves tricky. Recently had other health issues but found doctors and nurse practitioners who don’t dismiss me. Had to use antibiotics a few times and discovered that I am now allergic to penicillin, amoxicillin and possibly keflex. It may not have any relation to being floxed but could be. Bactrim wipes me out with fatigue. Doxycycline works for me with no side effects. I really appreciate docs who get it. I had one doc talk to me about using meloxicam for pain and when I told him about my experience he actually did his own research and said no to using nsaids. I do take antidepressants and mirtazapine and Amitriptyline work for me. Cymbalta did not as it caused nerve tingling like I had when floxed. I did use a very short course of predNisone for an allergic reaction that helped with no issues. I think each of us is unique in responses to things so just work closely with doc who dont dismiss you. If they do not find another doc if you can.

    • Andrea February 14, 2018 at 1:47 pm Reply

      Thanks Martha

    • L February 14, 2018 at 1:49 pm Reply

      You were lucky to have found a doctor who takes the time to do research. I would be VERY cautious of using prednisone. (I am convinced the reason I was hit so badly is that I was given prednisone at the same time as Cipro. I would also avoid other antibiotics whenever possible. Things you can take instead: oil of oregano, olive leaf extract and colloidal silver tincture.

      I had been on antidepressants for decades. A doctor told me I had to be on them for life. Well, I had read that they did a study with turmeric (95% curcumin) fared better than Prozac. So I slowly weaned myself off the antidepressants (you can’t just stop or the side effects are awful) and on to the turmeric. And for a full year before I was hit with the Cipro, I was doing fine. OF course then the depression came back in spades. Still I refused any other meds. And now I have read that a) there has never been any actual proof that depression is caused by a chemical imbalance and b) patients fared equally well using a placebo….

      • D. Mowers February 16, 2018 at 7:33 am Reply

        I have found a web site selling homeopathic products for many different problems.
        It may be worth looking into. One of their products might help you.

      • Don February 17, 2018 at 8:53 pm Reply

        More supplements and more supplements. Check out St. John’s Wort as a “natural” for depression and SAMe is supposed to be a “mood enhancer”. And of course our heavily discussed here “magnesium” at proper levels too.

        • Andrea February 18, 2018 at 6:36 am

          I’ve tried SAMe for a couple of months this summer, Didn’t do really anything for me. It was just another pill to pop, so I gave it up, but hey, it might help someone else. Defently better try that than conventional antidepressant.

  26. Henk Noordhuizen February 14, 2018 at 4:57 pm Reply

    Has anybody on this forum/blog ever read about the historical background of Bayer? You can find it here: http://www.profit-over-life.org/ And the plans for the EU are made by… well,you guessed it. The same Bayer Is trying to merge with the second evil company: Monsanto. For those who wonder how Bayer,and other evil companies,can get away with poisening the whole world.They simply OWN our governments.

  27. Don February 16, 2018 at 7:23 am Reply

    URINARY TRACT INFECTIONS & D-Mannose. Many of you have commented that you started having symptoms of being Floxed whether immediately or shortly after being prescribed one of the Fluoroquinolone antibiotics for a urinary tract infection. Please, please read this. (especially women) Look into and research “D-Mannose”. D-Mannose is not a drug. It is a supplement. Many of you who have contracted urinary tract infections have been told to drink cranberry juice. Why? Because cranberry juice contains D-Mannose. Why drink cranberry juice when you can buy pure D-Mannose from a health food store? D-Mannose has the ability to make the urinary tract walls “slippery”. Slippery to the point where the bacteria can not easily attach to the walls and can be washed away with the urine. D-Mannose also seems to have the ability to attach to E Coli and ball it up where it can not stick to the urinary tract walls. I will not go into more detail on D-Mannose but YOU should look into D-Mannose and consider using it as a preventive.
    I USE IT. D-Mannose
    After years of wondering why I feel the way I do (and finding nothing from the doctors) I found Floxie Hope.com and the Floxie page on Facebook. I now realize that after being prescribed Cipro for 30+ years for the recurrences of a chronic urinary tract infection I am Floxied. I am 83 now. My goal is to learn to live with the problem now that I have found an underlying reason for feeling lousy.
    Being Floxied is causing me neurological problems. as well as many others.
    Please people. Look into the possibility that D-Mannose may help you avoid any future urinary tract infections and needing antibiotics.
    God help us all to cope with the insidious side effects of Fluoroquinolones.

    • Henk Noordhuizen February 16, 2018 at 8:24 am Reply

      D-Mannose is,indeed,a safe way to handle UT-infections. A good preventive could be granberry-juice with extra Vit.C (which,too,reaches the bladder when taken in high enough doses). Have used my Beck magnetic pulser with success as well. But most of all: drink enough water,specially in case of a UT- infection; the fluid will help drain the bacteria out of your bladder.

    • L February 16, 2018 at 10:43 am Reply

      Yes Don—you are correct that D Mannose helps keep the little buggers from sticking to the wall. IT is not a cure but can be used preventatively. There is also a protocol, that any ND (esp female ND) should have that treats UTIs if you do get one. It included D-Mannose, high doses of vitamin A, vitamin C and Herb PHarm’s urinary system support. IT is rather complicated in that the dosages change, and it can take weeks to get rid of it. But so worth not having to take an antibiotic.

      Something else that can help prevent it is corn silk tea.

  28. Andrea February 16, 2018 at 7:47 am Reply

    Thanks a lot Don. I’ll try D Mannose if I’ll do the cistoscopy.

  29. Don February 17, 2018 at 12:35 pm Reply

    Just a note. D Mowers is Don, an 83 year old male. I would like to pass something on to all who read the information on this site. Have you read about Dr. Carolyn Dean? Dr. Dean has specialized in understanding magnesium. I read that a few of you have commented on magnesium. Good. Go to this web site and read what Dr. Dean has to say about magnesium. How deficient most of us are and how it is something that affects our health but somewhat overlooked by the MD doctors as long as the lab test come back within the published limits. The web site to start at.
    Bottom line and not to bore you with more chatter. Raising your magnesium level to what Dr. Dean is suggesting may help with our toxicity problem.
    Better health you all of you.

    • Henk Noordhuizen February 17, 2018 at 1:07 pm Reply

      She just updated her book,The Magnesium Miracle,as far as I know. Another important advocat of magnesium is Dr. mark Sircus:
      Fro this methode you can use a bath woth Zechstein magnesiumfakes or Epsom salt (don’t forget my warning about taking a bath with magnesium),or you can use magnesium-oil (Zechstein). I found a cheaper method for the magnesium-oil: buy the Zechstein flakes an put 660 grams of the flakes in 600 ml (6 dl) of (destilled) water and heat this a bit while stiring untill the salt had desolved. Way cheaper than the “oil” (which is,actually,the same;31 % MgCl). By the way: in the “alternative” sector magnesium deficiency is called “the doctor’s best secret”.

      • Don February 17, 2018 at 8:47 pm Reply

        As far as I know the latest book Dr. Dean has is the copy I have dated 2014. I just looked at the web site of Dr, Sircus. It looks like there is some very good information there. I am in search of all I can find out about what will help a person who has been Floxed.

        • Don Mowers February 18, 2018 at 7:51 am

          Browsing the web sites of Dr. Dean I see that there is a 2017 issue now.

        • Henk Noordhuizen February 19, 2018 at 1:34 pm

          Latest update is from last year:https://drcarolyndean.com/category/books/

    • jat92517 February 17, 2018 at 4:31 pm Reply

      Hallayluia !!!!

      A 200 pound person has a normal 1 gram of magnesium in the blood and 6000 grams in tissue.

      Guess where the deficiency is. Now figure out how to replace it… Saturated Epsom salt foot soaks give you 30 to 50 grams a day.

  30. A.Coleman February 17, 2018 at 5:45 pm Reply

    Hi gang – I have been experimenting with my Mg supplementation lately and those informal tests reaffirm that it is having a large positive effect on my neuropathy. Even though I have been a floxie for over 2 1/2 years I never had a Mg test. Based on my informal tests I got my integrative medicine doc to order a test and I got her to order the RBC test, which is more accurate than the serum test.

    My question is that she said I had to stop supplements and all other vitamins for one week prior to serum collection. Has anyone else experienced this? I see stopping the Mg and even stopping my vitamin D and maybe even vitamin K2 since metabolic use of Vitamin D sucks up Mg, but what about other vitamins like B or E?

    Any experience out there would be appreciated.

    BTW – this experimentation all came about after a float session my wife got me for Christmas. I think that much Mg transdermal was still a bit much for my body, but after the initial stress my body settled down and I even had a couple of nearly symptom free days. More to come on that in a later post – but my primary comment would be that this is too intense of a treatment for someone who is less than 75% of normal post floxing.

    • Andrea February 18, 2018 at 6:47 am Reply

      A. Coleman / jat92517

      Hi, The only supplements I’m taking for my floxie symptoms are vitamin D3 and K2. I’ve tried magnesium many times and in different forms, but it always seemed to make my symptoms worse. Any thoughts on that?
      I take vitamin D3, because I’m almost sure it’s the only thing that really helps me. When I don’t take it, all the pains inside my bones, expecially in my shinbones, flear up.

      • Don Mowers February 18, 2018 at 7:47 am Reply

        https://drcarolyndean.com/ Have you looked into the magnesium that is available from Dr. Dean? I can’t find the statement but I read that Vitamin D depletes the magnesium in a person’s system. Do you know what you magnesium level is? Word is that the RBC test is more accurate than the simple blood test. Considering how important magnesium is according to Dr. Dean are you on the right track? Maybe her formula of magnesium will work for you. She details how it is different from others. More expensive but I am going to try it. What ever it takes to mitigate my discomfort and neurological problems. https://www.rnareset.com/products/remag-magnesium-solution?variant=13899661319

        • Andrea February 18, 2018 at 9:35 am

          Don, I’ve tried the Remag, I’ve got the open bottle in my supplement drower. Nothing different from the others magnesium supplements I’ve tried. When I’ve checked my magnesium it was ok. And I’ve also done the RBC test. Nothing wrong with it either.

      • Barbara Arnold February 18, 2018 at 8:32 am Reply

        Andrea, some people feel worse on mag because of decreased sodium levels which affect the adrenals. Aldo vit d can deplete magnesium. You can also feel worse before you feel better. Or you may have other ‘toxins’ that re act with the mag, or you may be one of those people that are very sensitive to mag and other suppliments. I would recommend you check out Dr. Deans web as she is an expert on magnesium. Or start again very low and slow.

        • toby February 18, 2018 at 9:14 am

          I also felt worse on magnesium. Should I test sodium levels or something else?

    • jat92517 February 18, 2018 at 7:33 am Reply

      A. Coleman,

      If you are taking magnesium by mouth you are getting very little. Your blood holds about 1 gram. Your body uses about 6000 grams. FQs flush Mg out of your body. Very slow process to recover orally. Much more than a gram of any salt MgCitrate or worse Mg Cloride gives you cramps and diarrhea.

      You can get much more transdermal and recover from being floxied faster. Any adverse symptoms are likely from another deficiency that gets absorbed into,your cells along with the Mg. Mussels are the likely culprit. They require Mg, and Potasium ….and Calcium but we tend to have enough Calcium. Calcium suplimmets are indicated with arthritis and osteoporosis. A Potasim deficiency feels like a muscle spasm to be distinguished from a muscle cramp that won’t stretch out -,Mg.

      So please sure exactly what you felt from the bath.

      John Taylor

      • Andrea February 18, 2018 at 9:40 am Reply

        John, I’ve tried many magnesium supplements, I’ve also tried magnesium spray and only a few times magnesium soak bath. Nothing helped. Actually when I take magnesium orally,alone or in combination with other minerals, like the Doctor Dean Magnesium, I just feel worse in my brain.

        • jat92517 February 18, 2018 at 10:07 am

          I pickup on two key phases. Magnesium bath and feel worse in my brain.
          A bath is long way from a SATURATED Epsom salt foot soak. You can’t haul in enough salt for a satires bath. Waste of money anyway. If you don’t gel a benefit from a SATURATED foot soak. That would be interesting.

          The brain part needs more information. Do you know your rrsting blood glucose level and is your Vitamin D H25 above 30. How would you describe your sleep in general.

          John Tsylor

        • Andrea February 18, 2018 at 10:41 am

          Sorry, I didn’t express myself properly. When I’ve wrote “magnesium bath” I meant I’ve tried for a couple of times, what you have suggested, so an epsom salt foot soak. Now, I don’t know if it was saturated enough, but it was a basin, with warm water at ankle level. I think there was enough epsom salt, because it didn’t dissolve completely. If you could suggest a proper water/Epsom salt ratio, please share it.
          My Vitamin D level is 48 ng/ml, and my blood sugar level was 89 a few months ago when I’ve checked it. My sleep,would be good, overall,if it wasn’t for my bladder problems, that sometimes makes me wake up many times at night.

        • jat92517 February 18, 2018 at 11:53 am

          I don’t know why Magnesium makes your brain feel bawd. These numbers are quite good good and suggest you are past the floxie symptoms. Can that be?

        • L February 18, 2018 at 11:56 am

          To say “suggest you are past the floxie symptoms” makes absolutely zero sense. You cannot tell this from vitamin d levels. There are far too many things going on.

        • Andrea February 18, 2018 at 10:45 am

          And my magnesium blood level was 2.04 mg%

        • Andrea February 18, 2018 at 12:37 pm

          John, It’s not that “magnesium makes my brain feel bad” . Let me rephrase that : I just feel worse when I take it orally : dizziness, headaches, weakness, joint pain, all these symptoms seem to flear up, and the soak/spray thing never did anything to me.

        • A.Coleman February 19, 2018 at 6:31 am


          I never had negative impacts from Mg supplements, but never saw any real improvement either until I had the soak session, which uses massive amounts of Epsom salts to obtain the neutral buoyancy for your body. That is similar to John’s foot baths but for your whole body.

          I don’t have full evidence yet, but do note that since I had the float and have started taking my own Epsom salt baths I am feeling better. Now I want to check my levels and see just how I need to proceed to obtain optimal Mg levels, which will support my Vitamin D, which is a bit lower than your level, at 42ng/ml.

          Finally, I see your Mg blood level of 2.04 mg% and note that is pretty low actually, especially if that was an RBC test, which Dr. Dean recommends at 6.0 to 6.5. If a serum test then those are basically worthless because that is the last place in your body to show low Mg. I would try to get an RBC test then you will know and can plan your approach with knowledge. If you can’t get your doc to order one they are only $49 online.

          I know different things work differently for different people, but I wonder if the Mg soaks aren’t just a little too much too soon for you. In my initial post I noted that I wouldn’t recommend anyone try a float session who was a floxie and hadn’t recovered to at least 75%.

          If you have tired John’s foot baths and still are getting a negative experience try a traditional Epsom salt bath with a much lower concentration of Mg. Start with two or three cups of Epsom salt in the whole tub. The next day may be a bit worse but watch it over 2 or three days, then repeat. Keep it up twice a week or so for two or three weeks at least and see if it doesn’t help.

          Regardless having an accurate RBC Magnesium count is the most informed approach – which is what I am doing so I can stop guessing at my level and treatment approach.

      • A.Coleman February 19, 2018 at 6:19 am Reply


        Thanks for your information and your previous posts on Mg absorption via foot baths. I realize that my supplemental Mg (via Magnesium Glycinate) hasn’t been doing much other than keeping me from an even bigger hole. I even quit using Mg for a while due to a perceived lack of impact and only started taking it again because I learned it is needed to help facilitate Vitamin D absorption. (At one time post floxing my Vitamin D was a measly 13 ng/ul and it is still only 42 now).

        I had tried Epsom salt baths over the last few years but infrequently. Following the float session, which uses massive amounts of Epsom salt to create the neutral buoyancy I noticed a vast improvement. The float solution is at the saturation level of your foot baths, but with a whole body to absorb the Mg. That’s when I started experimenting with my own Epsom salt baths.

        The approach you recommend is one that I plan to try when I can start taking Mg again. While it helps me, sitting in a bath tub for 20 to 30 minutes daily isn’t as attractive as using a foot bath is.

        I would still like some feedback from everyone on the need to stay off my vitamins for a week before the RBC blood test. I plan to get the blood draw on day 6 after finally finding one website that called for the week wait, while most others call for only a 24 hour wait.

        • Barbara Arnold February 19, 2018 at 6:36 am

          A Coleman….you need k2-7 for better vit d absorbtion

        • Andrea February 19, 2018 at 7:51 am

          Thanks A. Coleman.
          Yes, I think my magnesium levels was from a serum test. Anyway I don’t think your vitamin D level is bad. I think the right spot is anything between 40 to 50 ng/ml. I don’t think that higher levels are considered healthier. Actually they can be dangerous, anyway, defenetly higher than normal range. Anyway, like Barbara suggested, alway remeber to take k2 along with it, for better absortion and avoiding too much calcium in your blood.
          One thing I don’t understand, it’s,why you think that taking too much magnesium, from soak/bath or supplements, should be bad for someone in an early stage of recovery? Also, can you be more specific on the water/epsom salt ratio of your baths? Thanks a lot.

        • A.Coleman February 19, 2018 at 9:47 am

          Barbara – Thanks I should have clarified. I have been taking both Vitamin D and K2 all along. Stopped the Mg for about 2 months when I didn’t realize that was an important Vitamin D cofactor. Resumed about 5 months back but only started seeing Mg positive impacts to me after the float session and Johns helpful posts about Epsom Salt foot baths put two and two together.

        • A.Coleman February 19, 2018 at 10:02 am


          Hi – if you google Magnesium Herx you will find several posts and theories most from our friends in the Lyme sufferer group. Here is one http://www.lymebook.com/mag-excerpt.pdf to check out.

          As to my “low impact” Epsom Salt ratio – I noted that I put 3 cups of Epsom Salts in a whole bath tub – then soak in water as hot as I can stand it for 20 to 30 minutes. I have been doing this twice a week – but feel in my situation I may be ready to ramp it up to start using a higher saturation and foot baths as John suggests.

          The float session is a whole body session in water that is super saturated with Epsom Salts and lasts 50 minutes. That was a bit much for me, but even still helped after two days of feeling a bit worse.

          So, my recommendation is to start slow with Mg in a tub and then move up as tolerable. Sure you could do the same small amount in a foot tub – but that would be a bit lower as you would have less skin to soak up the salts.

        • L February 19, 2018 at 10:12 am

          I had a panel done that included RBC (it was quite comprehensive, several pages long from True Diagnostics, and included MTHFR among other things.) It was just the standard morning fasting before the test.

          I also want to emphasize the importance of D. My doctor (integrative internist and pulmonologist) has me on 10,000 units a day, even though according to tests I am in the normal range. He said the ranges are too low. I even dropped to 2,000 a day and he said that wasn’t enough.

        • Andrea February 19, 2018 at 10:41 am

          Thank a lot for the infos A. Coleman. Here’s a link about vitamin D suggested levels


        • Andrea February 19, 2018 at 10:48 am

          Anyway you still didn’t answer one of my question 🙂 , why do you think certain floxies can’t handle too much magnesium, at least at the beginning? If FQs depleted it from my body, wouldn’t be it the contrary? Why this adverse reaction?

        • Henk Noordhuizen February 19, 2018 at 1:49 pm

          Has anybody else got the problem of double vision? Have it since about two weeks and it frightens me (photography is one of my main hobbies). It seems,for the last 2 days,to get way less severe but every once and a while it returns,most of the time for less then a minute. Is there a good chance for it to completely disappear after a while?

        • A.Coleman February 21, 2018 at 5:19 pm


          Sorry work has been really hectic lately. The information about how Mg might be something you want to avoid in high concentrations when a new floxie is found in the link I shared about Herx reactions.

          The concept is that when your body has been starved of a key nutrient and then it becomes more available all of your body systems start trying to “ramp up” to start working again it can be a stress to other elements that are out of balance.

          This is similar to the issue many flexes who try Glutathione IV therapy report. It would seem like it would be a good thing and it is, but it is a real jolt to the system. If you try a float session to get maximum Mg absorption for your whole body be prepared for a few days or maybe more of feeling worse before you feel better.

          I note that even when I do Epsom salt baths at home it is usual for me to feel worse the day after the bath and only feel better on days 2 plus. IF I keep it up and take them regularly twice to three times a week now that I am getting closer to being well, I can avoid the relapses easier.

        • A.Coleman February 21, 2018 at 5:25 pm

          Henk – thanks so much for sharing the article from Dr. Mercola. Great timing and insights into the needs to increase Mg.

          The link to the role of Mg in Mitochondria function is one that should be key to all flexes as most think the fluoroquinolone mess with the mitochondria and that explains why we are so depleted in Mg as our mitochondria do not effectively use Mg leading to larger requirements.

        • Andrea February 22, 2018 at 7:06 am

          Thank for the clarification A. Coleman, and sorry if I didn’t read more corefully the link you posted.
          Anyway, It’s been a couple of days that I started reintroducing the Remyte solution. So far I didn’t noticed anything bad, or good, plus I’m planning to get a lot of epsom salt and start to do baths, or at least soaking my entire legs,every other day, and see what happens. I will keep you updated.

  31. toby February 18, 2018 at 8:30 am Reply

    Hi. I am using probiotic which contains L. rhamnosus Rosell 11.
    If I add L. rhamnosus GG, will I have some additional benefits? Can these two be combined?

  32. KS February 20, 2018 at 8:08 am Reply

    Hi all. I have an endoscopy coming up and the doctor wants to use propofol. Has anyone had experience (good or bad with it)? I am a bit worried about my symptoms resurfacing or getting worse. I have had lidocaine before with no issues.

    • KS February 21, 2018 at 8:32 am Reply


      • Don Mowers February 21, 2018 at 9:07 am Reply

        Does the propofol contain any “Fluoride? Many drugs other than the FQ family including anesthesias contain “Fluoride. The more you look the more you will find it in many things.

        • KS February 21, 2018 at 9:29 am

          I don’t believe so.

      • L February 21, 2018 at 10:25 am Reply

        I have not taken that specific drug, but since being floxed I have been given a few different anesthetics and pain meds, and had no problem with any of them. We are all individual though in our reactions. LIke Don, my main concern would be whether it contains a fluoride. I did a quick search and could not find anything so I would think it does not

        • KS February 21, 2018 at 1:52 pm

          Thank you. Taking any new drugs terrifies me.

        • L February 21, 2018 at 1:56 pm

          yeah, me too. I have an integrative MD now and if he suggests a pharmaceutical, I just raise my eyebrows and he immediately say “yeah, we won’t do that.”

    • Madge hirsch February 22, 2018 at 11:26 am Reply

      I had it for a colonoscopy about 5/6 weeks after being floxed. I had some headaches after wards but that could have just as easily been due to the Cipro. I will have it again tomorrow for another colonoscopy. Will report any ill effects.

      • L February 22, 2018 at 11:53 am Reply

        Oh wow…I forgot! I had that too. (Guess I tried to put the whole colonoscopy out of my mind.) Yeah, zero side effects for me.

      • KS February 22, 2018 at 12:01 pm Reply

        Thank you!!

        • Madge hirsch February 24, 2018 at 4:48 pm

          Had the Propofol yesterday afternoon. Felt fine on waking up then a little nauseous later that evening. Some headache today and I remember I had that last time plus some reflux which I don’t normally have. This could also be due to the purge stuff for the colonoscopy prep. On the whole not really problematic.

        • L February 24, 2018 at 7:38 pm

          yeah, pretty much how I felt…think it is all very normal and not “floxish”

  33. toby February 22, 2018 at 10:55 am Reply

    Hi. I read posts about fluoride. I am floxed with metronidazole. Should I avoid fluoride?
    I am using sulpiride for my stomach problems. Does it contains fluoride? I googled and I think answer is no.
    I need some dental intervention and I asked him does he use fluoride? Answer was no. Are local anesthetics safe?

    • L February 22, 2018 at 11:21 am Reply

      Hi Toby, actually to be “floxed” you would have to have had a fluoroquinolone. (The word “flox” is derived from the names of the drugs in this family, like ciprofloxacin) Having said that, I know many who have taken flagyl or metronidazole that have also had awful experiences like those who have taken a fluoroquinolone. I do not know if metronidazole actually has fluoride in it. One reason floxies need to avoid fluoride is that fluroquinolones DO contain fluoride and that is part of what makes them so dangerous. It allows them to breach the blood/brain barrier.

      Either way, I do not believe fluoride is good for anyone. (You can get a lot more info at the fluoride action network. Even Erin Brokovich has become an anti-fluoride campaigner.) Whether or not it is worse for you post metronidazole, there is no way to know—so my suggestion would be to avoid it.

      I have had a lot of dental work done since being floxed (Cipro.) I purposely sought out an holistic dentist (Huggins trained is the standard.) They use no fluoride, and they use methods and products that are more bio-compatible. In fact, I had him remove my mercury fillings—something I would only have done with a huggins-trained dentist. I have had two different types of local anesthetic with no problems. (We are all different and I know others have had issues…) In fact, in addition to the dentist, I had prolozone injections in my knees for torn meniscus, and that is ozone combine with the anesthetic procaine…again, no problems.) If you want to find an holistic dds, here a site to look https://www.hugginsappliedhealing.com/

      • toby February 22, 2018 at 11:45 am Reply

        We can say I had metronidazole toxicity. My problem is very high anxiety.


        This guy says Metronidazole doesn’t contain fluoride. So do you think its safe for me to drink tap water and use toothpaste with fluoride?

        • Henk Noordhuizen February 25, 2018 at 1:15 pm

          Hi Toby,I had Metronidazole and Amoxicilline (2 x 500 mg and 3 x 500 mg,had to take both together),and it made me terribly sick. I stopped taken them after 5 days but the loose stool and the problems with a very unstable glucose-level kept going on for 3 years. The only thing that helped a bit was ionic silverwater ( most silverwater is sold under the name Colloidal Silverwater but,in fact,it is Ionic Silverwater).

          After those 3 years I learned more about the Beck Protocol and decided to build both the Blood Cleaner/Pulser and the Magnetic Pulser; simple job for anybody with basic knowledge about electronics. The schematics are easy to find on the web (bobbeck.com). To my suprise it took only 2 weeks for both symptomes to almost disappear! After 3 years of severe problems,and my doctor telling me it all had to heal in the natural way!

          Even after 3 years he told me that same thing,and that those glucose-fluctuations were all between the ears. It took several more years before the connection between (severe) bloodglucose-fluctuations and “some” of the antibiotics was admitted by the Farmafia.

          In sept. 2016 I got Cipro and stopped taking it after 2 days because of very hefty adverse reactions. And again my bloodsugarlevel started to go up and down like crayzy. I waited for a month with no improvement but again 2 weeks of only pulsing my pancreas with the magnetic pulser brought great improvement. Had severe heartproblems from that Cipro-poison as well and that took more than a year to get stable.

          All of a sudden, 3-4 weeks ago,my bloodsugarlevel went crazy again,and I still don’t know why. Some days later I started to have double vision,not constantly but,in the beginning,many times a day,and lasting for 10 minutes or more;this was very frightening. Now its a bit less in frequenty and when it comes it,mostly,lasts for just a few minutes.

          Because I’m doing the whole Beck Protocol at the moment and still focus on my pancreas when pulsing with the MP my bloodsugar level is quite stable and I intend to follow this protocol for at least another 2 month. I skip the use of Ionic Silverwater this time,and I don’t pulse my belly with the magnetic pulser because I don’t want to have the protocol to have an impact on my colonic flora;those 2 days of cipro didn’t harm (lucky me ;-))

          In fact ALL antibiotics are toxic; that’s why they kill bacteria.Fluoride-based AB’s are extra toxic beacuse fluoride attacks the bacteria (ánd the human cells) on DNA-level.That’s why many adverse reactions of Cypro etc. are very longlasting,or even permanent. And now,because of bacteria getting more and more AB-resistant,they’re looking for new AB’s. There’s óne success,so far: an AB against MRSA which also didn’t work most of the time anymore proved to be highly efficient again……after adding Colloidal Silver. Another experiment,in vitro,with breastcancer cells and a chemo that didn’t work very well showed the same thing: after adding Colloïdal Silver….success! What a shame that they can’t patent CS,nor IS; that’s the reason that it’s still not used in most hospitals,and when,only for burning wounds.It’s all about the money,like always.

  34. gérard February 22, 2018 at 11:26 am Reply

    hello, question a bit silly but for epsom salt foot baths, will I use tap water, and fluorine that’s in it?

    • L February 22, 2018 at 11:55 am Reply

      I don’t think that’s a silly question at all. In fact, while I do not have a bathtub, I always wonder about people who say they enjoy a long hot bath post floxing…for that very reason. I do a foot soak, and do use fluoridated water, just not really hot. But I do wonder how much better it would be with nonfluoridated.

  35. Andrea February 22, 2018 at 11:37 am Reply

    gérard, I dont’t know about that. Unless you have a water filter at home, I don’t think you have much other chances.

    • gérard February 22, 2018 at 11:38 am Reply

      merci de votre réponse 😦

      • Andrea February 22, 2018 at 11:50 am Reply

        Di niente 😉

  36. Andrea February 22, 2018 at 11:48 am Reply

    Hi guys,
    after reading the latest posts about fluoride, it came to my mind that when I was a toddler, my parents used to give me fluorine/fluoride (I don’t know the right one in english) supplements to preventing oral cavities. Could my reaction to the fluoroquinolone be caused or at least facilitated by that early exposure? What do you think?

    • L February 23, 2018 at 4:51 pm Reply

      Hey Andrea, I used fluoride toothpaste, had fluoride treatments and drank fluoridated water all my life. I didn’t get floxed til my third go-round with a fluoroquinolone. I think most people in the US are exposed to a LOT of fluoride so I don’t think that’s it. I think it is more likely a genetic mutation or something else.

    • jat92517 February 23, 2018 at 6:52 pm Reply

      Hey Andrea,

      I agree with L. I think the Florine is tied up the Cipro Chemical structure and there is very little Florine available to cause harm. The little that is will react like any other free radical, cause damage and be gone. This happens all the time with free radicals. Worrying about Florine is close to worrying about breathing.

      Floride is the oxidized form of Florine.


      • L February 23, 2018 at 7:28 pm Reply

        Just to be clear, I don’t believe the fluoride treatment Andrea got was of much consequence regarding the Cipro. However, the fluoride IN the Cipro is very consequential. I believe that is one of the components that makes it so dangerous, including giving it the opportunity to breach the blood/brain barrier.

      • Henk Noordhuizen February 24, 2018 at 2:28 am Reply

        Some days ago Sajuta Patel told us her story and I visited her website. She is a pro pharmacist and floxed in 2014. Read her story and visit her website;she did research the link between her healthproblems after Cipro and focussed on the ingredients in Cipro,especcialy on the fluoride.Here is her conclussion: https://journeywithsujata.com/fluoride-and-fluoroquinolone-toxicity-could-there-be-a-connection/

        • Don Mowers February 24, 2018 at 9:03 am

          I also visited Sujata Patel’s web site and read her article. Very enlightening. One of the first that I have read that actually put forward an explanation of how the fluorides, fluorines and fluoroquinolones manage to do their dirty work. It is well worth a read.

    • Andrea February 24, 2018 at 3:32 am Reply

      Thanks guys

  37. L February 23, 2018 at 4:52 pm Reply

    Hey all, not sure why this popped into my head–perhaps something I read. But I was thinking about the last tetanus shot I had, and was wondering if anyone has had a tetanus shot since being floxed, and if so if they had a reaction to it.

    • Madge hirsch February 24, 2018 at 5:00 pm Reply

      I visited a website of someone who used to post here and has since died. I can’t remember her name but she lived in Spain and was into rescuing animals. She posted horrible photos of terrible lesions on her legs and arms that had appeared after having a tetanus booster. Prior to that she was starting to recover from her floxing and she reckons the tetanus shot wiped out all her recovery. I also remember someone else posting here that they too had had lesions appear after a tetanus shot. Lisa would probably know who she was. I am very reluctant to have another tetanus booster despite being a keen gardener. I have had several over my lifetime and am crossing my fingers they will have provided me with enough protection.

      • Don Mowers February 24, 2018 at 5:25 pm Reply

        Right, wrong? I don’t know but I have not had a tetanus shot on 60 years. I never see anyone discussing the use of Colloidal Silver here. It is as old as history and proven to work in many cases. Research it. Learn to make your own good quality Colloidal Silver at home.
        Plenty of information on the web. I don’t advocate anything. You decide yourself.

        • Barbara Arnold February 25, 2018 at 10:44 pm

          Hi Don, I have taken colloidal silver in the past. I got it from advice on Kerri Knox’s websight. In fact I have just ordered some to take on vacation with me to keep the ‘bugs’ away. She now recommends ionic nano silver, which is what I’m getting.

        • Don Mowers February 26, 2018 at 8:06 am

          High Barbara. About Colloidal Silver. Nano silver is more or less a way to define silver in very fine particles. It is actually the way all Colloidal Silver should be made, but regrettably there are those more interested in profit than quality. Short course on Colloidal Silver. Colloidal silver is made by submersing 2 pieces of silver wire in distilled water and passing an electrical current between them. The current is usually DC from any DC source (9 v batteries connected in series, low voltage transformer or even a solar panel) and does not exceed about 36 volts. As this current flows it causes the silver on the positive wire to leave the wire with an electrical charge and suspend in the water. The fallacy of many and the secret to making high quality small particle (nano silver) is to make it slowly with a very limited current. (Limited current flow requires a current limiter [current limiting diode] to be installed in the supply wires) Many suppliers more interested in profit make the silver too fast and it is in larger particles. Hence the body is less able to absorb and use it. In most cases the Colloidal Silver is made in strengths from about 10 PPM (parts per million) to highs in the hundreds.
          I make my own so I know the strength and the freshness. Throughout the industry they speak of making 10 to 15 PPM Colloidal Silver in just a few hours. Since I use a very limited current flow, it takes my silver about 4 days to get to the 15 PPM level. Consequently the solution is nearly clear and the particles (nano particles) are very small. I hope this short dissertation is a help to anyone thinking about Colloidal Silver.
          It works. It is laboratory proven to be effective against over 600 different pathogens. The pharma industry is finding out that when added to antibiotics it enhances their effectiveness.
          Ironically, it was the “go to” germ killer until antibiotics came along and pushed it under the rug.

        • Barbara Arnold February 26, 2018 at 11:27 pm

          Thanks for your very informative post Don. I did go into colloidal silver many years ago, but I’m sure your post will really help others on floxie hope. I got the nano silver that Kerri Knox advised as she’s generally pretty authentic, but I suppose you really can’t beat making it yourself if possible.

        • Henk Noordhuizen February 27, 2018 at 2:08 am

          The (electric) way of making Silverwater is invented by Bob Beck,and part of his Beck Protocol.The factual name is Ionic Silver,and it it has proven to,in vitro, “ad greatly” to the efficienty of a chemo that’s used to treat breastcancer).Years ago I read about two women who where on the list for a breastcancer treatment. Both started using Ionic Silver;one mede it herself,the other bought is,and when time had come for the treatment they both didn’t need it anymore because the tumors where not there anymore.I use the Silver Pulser (actually I use all devices for the Beck Protocol) from Sota.It makes excellent Ionic Silver.

          The Sota devices are the only ones that are endorsed by Bob Beck.He and Russ Torlage (from,what would later become:Sota Instruments) became friends after Russ showed Bob his improvements on the initial schematics made by Beck. Remember: those where kept simple but effective,especially made that way so that everybody with only a very basic knowledge of electronics could build those devices themselves.I advice everyone to get informed about this Protocol (and the man behind it),build,or let somebody build those devices and give them a try.

          While building them yourself is very cheap and when you use reloadable batteries the usage costs pennies After I succesfully treated some 3 year old problems (diarrhea and hypo/hyperglycemia) which I got after my first antibiotics course in 2004) I bought the devices from Sota as soon as I got enough money.

          By the way:it took just 2 weeks with,mainly,the Magnetic Pulser,to do the job.And now,after the Cipro (sept. 2016) it helped me agiain,in 2 weeks (!) to get rid of hyper/hypoglycemia. A month ago I had a relapse and started the whole protocol except for the Ionic Silver and,once again it worked 100%. Yesterday I had a short relapse again,probably from a strong cup of Pu Ehr tea (that should be low in fluoride,but o.k.,it was a quite stron cup of tea),but what the cause of that earlier relapse was is stil a mystery to me. May have been conservatives in the bread I ate; the rest of the bread didn’t show any decay,fungus,untill it was 1 1/2 weeks old.

        • Henk Noordhuizen February 27, 2018 at 2:15 am

          Forgot to mention about the chemo with the added Ionic Silver:on it’s own the chemo hardly worked, with the Ionic Silver added it worked great.Now the medics have decided that you FIRST have to take the chemo,and AFTER the chemo you take the Ionic Silver.Why would thát be???? Do your “lucky “guess.

      • Andrea February 25, 2018 at 4:32 am Reply

        Madge, this is horrible, How did she die?
        Anyway, in my opinion one of the most frightening and disabling side effect of the FQs is that you never know what will happen to you. I’m so scared of everything right now. What if I have to undergo surgery? or, like in L case, taking a vaccine shot, anything could go downhill. Even taking a simple aspirin, could make things way worse. I feel like we’re doomed.
        Sorry for my outburst.

        • L February 25, 2018 at 10:52 am

          yes, I think that is a common feeling. It’s just a crap shoot isn’t it? I felt so fortunate to have had different anesthetics and pain meds with no apparent repercussions post cipro.

        • Madge hirsch February 26, 2018 at 11:43 am

          I don’t know how she died. I am having major bowel surgery a month today. I am more concerned about the surgery itself than a reaction from being floxed. My main problem from that at the moment widespread tendonitis. I will be getting an epidural as well as being put to sleep as this will reduce the need for morphine after the op.

        • L February 26, 2018 at 12:16 pm

          So sorry you have to have the surgery Madge. I wish you well.

      • L February 25, 2018 at 10:44 am Reply

        OMG, that’s horrible. I remember her posting, but didn’t recall the lesions came after a tentanus booster. I guess the thing would be to not have a prophylactic one and just wait until/if something happened first to require one.

        • Madge hirsch March 1, 2018 at 11:30 am

          Thanks L. I just hope it puts an end to my diverticulitis . My colonosopy last week was a failure as the sigmoid part of my colon is so messed up with scar tissue my consultant could not advance the camera without risking a perforation. She said it was further proof I needed the op as any further attacks could lead to a perforation and perirtonitis. I have been warned by the surgeon that it can take many months to establish normal transit afterwards so we have more or less written off this year for holidays. I am hoping my floxing symptoms won’t be too badly affected by the general anaesthetic. I have to have an epidural to cut down on the amount of post op morphine as the morphine interferes with the resumption of normal transit.

      • Barbara Arnold February 26, 2018 at 11:30 pm Reply

        Hey Madge, I wish you all the very best with your surgery and shall send you lots of good thoughts xx

        • Madge hirsch March 1, 2018 at 11:37 am

          Thanks Barbara. I am dreading it but after the failed colonoscopy last week more or less resigned to the necessity of it. Not trusting doctors in general after being floxed is a problem but I do have confidence in my surgeon. He was very frank and open and not at all arrogant. I hope I make a quick recovery like I did after my hysterectomy . But that was nearly 18 years and 2 floxings ago! Have you recovered from your back problems yet?

  38. J February 26, 2018 at 8:52 am Reply

    Hi all,

    I seem to be dealing with a relapse/cycle and I don’t understand why. I’ve made tons of progress over the last few months (and have been dealing with FQ toxicity from Levaquin for years).

    I eat all the right foods, try to get as many nutrients as I can and avoid fluoride as much as possible. I’ve felt good lately until the end of last week, a very stressful high anxiety week that had me on edge every day because of work and, probably as a result, was beginning to feel sick. I took a few Cold-EEZEs (basically a lozenge zinc supplement you can find by the cough drops) to help ward off of a cold. I usually stay away from stuff like that, but *have* had some in the past with no issue whatsoever.

    I probably had 3 or 4 on both Thursday and Friday. On Friday night, about a half hour after the last Cold-EEZE, I had a major dizzy spell and almost fell over. The dizzy spells have continued randomly until today. I also have worsening head pressure, worsening brain fog, worsening joint pain/popping, pain/weakness returning in legs (especially knees and achilles). Everything seems to get worse after I eat.

    I am so bummed out and confused. A Cold-EEZE!? Seriously?! I can’t think of anything else it would be. My diet is extremely clean and has been the same for months. I figured I had finally found the lifestyle that worked for me and kept me safe. I suppose it could have also been the result of the high anxiety week?

    Maybe, AT WORST, I figured that Cold-EEZE would just temporarily make my FQ symptoms worse and I’d be fine in a day…but this very much feels like a “NEW REACTION” with multi-symptoms!?! I just don’t understand.

    • Ryan L February 26, 2018 at 10:55 am Reply

      It could be the Zinc lozenges or the anxiety, but likely the combination. I have read somewhere that Zinc can affect magnesium absorption (Can’t remember where), and numerous posts here in the past have talked about stress and magnesium depletion as a result of stress. There are also two forms of Cold-EEZE (One has sugar and the other doesn’t). I’ve used the sugar free one in the past and did not have any noticeable issues.

    • Henk Noordhuizen February 26, 2018 at 11:31 am Reply
    • Henk Noordhuizen February 26, 2018 at 11:34 am Reply
    • L February 26, 2018 at 12:13 pm Reply

      wow J…I can’t imagine that cold-eeze would cause that. In fact I would be more concerned with the corn syrup in it than anything else.

      I think sometime we attribute a relapse to something (cup of coffee, too much exercise, gluten, etc) and we really don’t know. We are so desperate I think to be able to pin it on something so we can have control over it; but I think we just don’t know how this garbage works and perhaps it has nothing to do with anything we have eaten or done. It is one of the great frustrations of these toxins.

      • Andrea February 26, 2018 at 2:28 pm Reply

        I agree with everything you wrote.
        For example, these last two weeks have been quite bad for me. I felt like I was getting into a relapse, then today, I wake up, and I felt really good, no pain, no dizziness, no brain fog. I feel almost healed, and I didn’t do anything different. Who knows what’s going to be like tomorrow…

  39. Henk Noordhuizen February 26, 2018 at 11:40 am Reply
    • L February 26, 2018 at 12:15 pm Reply

      I would NOT use WebMD as a source. AS you can see from their lists they refer to many of these side effects as rare—which they are NOT. WebMD is very AMA/FDA/big pharma based. Please don’t rely on them or refer to them as a source

      • Henk Noordhuizen February 26, 2018 at 12:26 pm Reply

        Could be,but they mention several adverse reactions not mentioned by other “reliable” websites.And because it’s known that first of all it’s the doctors who don’t take notice of adverse reactions when reported by patients you can’t blame webmd,pubmed or even the FDA for considering those reactions as being “rare”. That’s why websites like Rxlist excist.: https://www.rxlist.com/drugs/alpha_a.htm

      • Henk Noordhuizen February 26, 2018 at 12:33 pm Reply

        Here’s another website with quite reliable information: https://www.drugs.com/

  40. J February 26, 2018 at 1:12 pm Reply

    Thanks for all the responses regarding Cold-EEZE. I actually do try to use the sugar free ones when possible, and have always been fine. The sugar/corn syrup was indeed my biggest concern as I have been avoiding sugar for years. I don’t even eat fruit. Maybe the sugar from the Cold-EEZE was a shock to my system. Again, I was worried this could happen, but for god sakes, I figured I’d just feel bad for a day or so…I never believed it would kickstart an entire new reaction/cycle!?!

    Ultimately I will never know and, L, I think you are onto something that sometimes these relapses just happen without a clear cause. I just hope this is short lasting and isn’t too much of a setback.

    • Andrea February 26, 2018 at 2:15 pm Reply

      I definitely have problems with refined sugar, syrups etc, but never had problems with fruit. I think they’re way different. But of course, we’re all different.

      • J February 26, 2018 at 2:28 pm Reply

        Yeah, I didn’t mean to imply I’ve had problems with fruit. I’ve never noticed I feel *worse* after fruit. But, I did start to wonder if giving up/eating less fruit may help me feel *better*… and help heal any potential problems with the gut. I’m just trying to follow what some paleo/autoimmune protocols suggest to see if it will help me.

        • Andrea February 26, 2018 at 2:58 pm

          Good. Try and let us know.
          I’ve never tried paleo myself, but I’ve never had gut issues in the first place (crossing fingers), anyway. In my opinion, what works best for me, is when I eat an almost vegan diet, with the exception for some eggs and some fish. Unfortunately I’m not very disciplinated, so there are periods, like now, where I tend to eat a lot a crap. Anyway, I’m almost sure that there are three things that seems to make my symptoms worse :
          1 Coffee,very common among floxies, 2 Sugar, syrups, refined carbs, junk food in general 3 Dairy, I thnik for me is very pro inlammatory. Hope this will help you.

  41. Don Mowers March 1, 2018 at 9:13 am Reply

    This is a very interesting article about fluoride toxicity. You might like to read it. https://buelahman.wordpress.com/2011/05/27/health-effects-of-fluoride-consumption/

    • L March 1, 2018 at 9:23 am Reply

      Fluoride is poison. I think the part about it being put in to the water to control the masses actually is unproven, and we need to be careful about spreading false information. However, putting it in the water was a way for manufacturers of aluminum and other products to get rid of their manufacturing waste.

      • Don Mowers March 1, 2018 at 9:50 am Reply

        Fluoride for population mind control. I agree one should not be trying to spread any story on that. But I ask one question. It is said that Hitler used it in the water in his prison camps. Why? It certainly was not because he was concerned about the prisoner’s tooth health. What was his reason?

        • Theresa Warren March 1, 2018 at 12:28 pm

          “It is said that Hitler used it in the water in his prison camps.” Do you have documentation of this assertion, that is not hearsay? I have been trying to find some.

        • Don Mowers March 1, 2018 at 1:00 pm

          After I posted that “it was said” I did some searching online and it appears that it was misinformation that has been spread. It appears to be a myth with legs. I did find site after site describing how detrimental fluoride is to ones health. Other than from antibiotics (which in some cases seem to have immediate negative results) the process of fluoride assimilation into the body is gradual, but cumulative. Something disturbing is that it appears that some and maybe all cholesterol lowering drugs contain fluoride. Is that why in many cases we are warned that cholesterol drug can possibly lead to dementia? Fluoride in any form and in any quantity has no place in the diet of mammals.

        • L March 1, 2018 at 3:00 pm

          I have read that too (about Hitler using fluoride) but a site I found, which media-bias declares to be unbiased (politifact), claims this is not true. However, there is an interesting (terrifying) connection of Bayer to Nazi Germany. They had a plant at Auschwitz where they did their chemical experiments. https://www.globalresearch.ca/auschwitz-tthe-role-of-ig-farben-bayer/5526720 Sadly, those scientists who should have been tried for war crimes, were brought to the use to WORK under the Operation Paperclip. Bayer hasn’t changed much, has it?

        • Theresa Warren March 2, 2018 at 11:31 am

          Yes, my research to find verification for fluoride in prison camps led me to I.G. Farben, also the way big corporations supported Hitler, and the alliances with American corporate interests. After Hitler conquered a country, German corporations would come in like vultures and take over the country’s factories. They built concentration camps for slave labor to work in them. After the war, the executives of these companies got light slaps on the wrist and went back to their careers. The entire pharmaceutical industry is basically derived from Nazis, who were not shy about doing human experimentation. I read the Crime and Punishment of IG Farben by Joseph Borkin.

        • L March 2, 2018 at 11:46 am

          yes, I think it is remarkable how powerful big pharma has become and how so few people know its origins. The FDA gives the “respectability.”

        • Henk Noordhuizen March 4, 2018 at 12:04 pm

          I.G.Farben was the main financier of Hitler,and after a research about their role in the war the conclusion was that,without the financial help of I.G. Farben there would never have been a WW2! And,after a “slap on the fingers”) they soon started creating the European Union (plans were already made during the war). And they succeeded! Read all about it on this great website (thanks to Dr. Rath): http://www.profit-over-life.org/

        • L March 4, 2018 at 12:39 pm

          yes, the crimes against humanity are so appalling…and the world’s best kept secret. So much of the world trusts big pharma to have their best interests at heart. And it is so hard to tell people about their shady past. You are called a conspiracy theorist.

    • Don Mowers March 1, 2018 at 9:28 am Reply

      Sorry…………. I did not read all the way through the comment section and it has a lot of what one would call “off color” stuff in it. If I could delete the whole post I would. It seems like once posted delete is not possible.

  42. Lisa March 1, 2018 at 1:07 pm Reply

    Anyone who is interested in learning about the dangers of fluoride should read, “The Devil’s Poison: How fluoride is killing you” by Dean Murphy, DDS. It’s interesting. The title is a bit too inflammatory for my taste, and, warning, he concludes that the Russians are trying to lower our collective IQs (which, I suppose is possible, but it seems a bit shark-jumpy and unlikely), but, other than those things, it’s a good and informative book.

  43. Don Mowers March 1, 2018 at 1:18 pm Reply

    Since realizing that I have become a victim of fluoride toxicity I am finding that there is a mountain of literature out there. One just has to find it, read it and not let it happen to you.

    • jat92517 March 2, 2018 at 5:28 pm Reply


      I am planning a post on Florine. Not all Florine chemicals are created equal. This blog has criticized Florine in all forms. That is uninformed. Some forms have their benefits but others are very toxic.

      Cipro took 4 runs at killing me. It reduced the muscles below my waist to 1/2 their capacity, activated an old pinched nerve injury to the point where Morphine at the maximum dose would not control it. I lost complete use of my right leg. I was bed ridden. It was difficult to get into wheel chair. I could not shave or brush my teeth. I had to eat and drink lying down. I was screaming in pain but they would not give me more morphine. I spent 7 weeks in the hospital and rehab plus 4 weeks at home recovering.

      Now I walk with a slight limp but I can shop the whole grocery store. I cannot climb a 1000 foot mountain in 30 minutes like I used to. I can work for 12 hours without resting. I used to be able to do 18. I am 70 years old and CIPRO has not defeated me. I defeated Cipro at every turn because I understand chemistry. Chemistry from the first 5 out of 7 corses I took.

      The reason I am taking my time posting blog on flouring is two. It is a challenge to condense the teachings of five courses into one understandable page, especially to people who have little chemistry background. My 12 working hours a day must be used to work and pay my bills first.

      I have 12 chemistry courses under my belt but none on surface chemistry or our bodie’s physiology. Those are self taught.

      I am not impressed with knowledge of doctors or pharmacists. They have 2 years of technical courses and then to clinical. They have not done any research or process management studies. They only know what they are taught and cannot teach themselves by observation and analysis.

      Now I believe I am quite functional and think Vipro is out of shot.

      To explain the toxicity of Flourone in Cipro and not in water and toothpaste. Requires getting deeply into organic and surface chemistry. Flouring is toxic to us inall forms but for water treatment and toothpaste only two decades less or 1 percent. The alternatives of not using it in these applications are far more damaging. I have a filling in every tooth and 10 crowns because I grew up before Florine water and toothpaste were available…and the amount of chlorine we had to use in public water supplies beforeflorine is far more damaging to iour bodies. The anorobic bacteria (oxygen free growth bacteria) that both agents kill grows in your gut and give you cronich dissentary.

      Briefly Florine is toxic in the FAs because they are located next to carbon ring with double bond carbons. The Florine steals the electrons and makes the double bond more reactive. That is what caused the destruction. Flouring once reacted cannot react any more it is “permanently” tied up. Permanent until one heats to 450 F where it explosively dissociates. While we can do that in a chem plant, it isn’t going to happen to any extent inside your body.

      I hope this helps you. The questions on this blog have helped me understand the first step in how Cipro destroyed and then regenerates to destroy again.


      John Taylor

      • L March 2, 2018 at 5:44 pm Reply

        I could not disagree with you more regarding fluoride in toothpaste and water. Your information is extremely inaccurate and potentially harmful.

        First, most first world countries have stopped fluoridating their water. The US is one of the last remaining. These other countries know how damaging it is to our health.

        Second, fluoride in toothpaste is NOT healthful. In fact, it can make teeth softer. (Seriously, anyone who group up using fluoride toothpaste, fluoride treatments, fluoridated water, etc probably, like me, has a MOUTH FULL of cavities.) It can actually damage your teeth and bones. There is a wealth of information out there on this. Just do a little research.


        • Madge hirsch March 3, 2018 at 8:41 am

          It also damages the thyroid . Probably responsible for the epidemic of hypothyroidism . I lived 13 years in a major city in UK where the water was fluorinated. I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism the year before we moved from there to France. Previous floxings could have had an effect but drinking that crap water for years probably compounded the damage. In areas of India where there are naturally high levels of fluoride in the water people suffer horribly with teeth and bone problems.

        • Don Mowers March 3, 2018 at 8:58 am

          After reading about fluoride I have added a fluoride filter to my home water system. Water now passes through three filters before it is used. If you do not already have the ability to filter fluoride out of your water look into it. Filter cartridges cost from $25 to $60 and will last for up to 15,000 gallons. Next is to add a “quality” fluoride filter to my shower head. To late. I have already been floxed but maybe all this will help in dealing with it.

        • L March 3, 2018 at 9:19 am

          I would do that if I could. I live in a small rented apartment. However, I buy distilled water from a water store and then add back in the minerals I need with something called Concentrace. I also keep my showers short and not hot.

        • Don Mowers March 3, 2018 at 10:23 am

          There are many counter top portable models that connect to the kitchen faucet. Just Google counter top water filter and you will get many choices.

        • L March 3, 2018 at 10:54 am

          yeah, I really just don’t have the space. Tiny place

        • Don Mowers March 3, 2018 at 10:28 am

          There are also fluoride filters that just screw on to the existing shower pipe and then it either has it’s own shower head or you use the one you have now and screw it on to the filter. With the variety of filters available there is no reason to subject yourself to fluoride in drinking water or in your shower.

        • Bob March 3, 2018 at 11:43 am

          I recently installed a good filter system undersink after hauling drinking water for years . Also a rental. IF I move I’ll take it with me. Should have done it years ago.

      • L March 2, 2018 at 5:58 pm Reply

        BTW since being floxed I only see a holistic (Huggins trained) dentist because they consider your whole body and its health and use bio-compatible materials and more healthful procedures. Holistic dentists typically argue against any form of ingested fluoride, arguing that research has linked ingested fluoride to cancer and various bone problems while other research has shown no benefit to the teeth from ingested fluoride. They also argue that too much fluoride can cause fluorosis and that fluoridating public water supplies is forced medication of the general public.

      • Bob March 2, 2018 at 8:30 pm Reply

        Children have died in the dentist chair from getting a fluoride treatment on their teeth. There is a reason they put it in rat poison.

        • harriet March 24, 2018 at 11:28 am

          Hi Bob Didn’t know they put fluoride in rat poison, scary stuff.

  44. L March 3, 2018 at 9:26 am Reply

    There was a nice graphic showing the restaurants with the most antibiotics in their food, but since I can’t post a picture, here is an article that lists those places (hopefully you’re not eating there anyway!) further down. https://theheartysoul.com/antibiotics-in-fast-food-meat/

  45. Lisa March 3, 2018 at 10:23 am Reply

    Barbara received this email from Dr. Carolyn Dean, forwarded it to me, and I am now sharing it with you. 🙂

    There are a staggering number of different magnesium supplements on the market. If you search for “magnesium” in the Health product category on Amazon, there are over 8,000 results!

    So, with so many to choose from, how can you pick one that is going to be the safest and most effective? This list will help you in your search.

    1. Read the label

    Many magnesium products contain compounds that are not easily absorbed – or only provide a small increment of elemental magnesium. The 3 most popular magnesium formulations are magnesium citrate, magnesium oxide, and magnesium glycinate. In one clinical study, amino acid chelates like magnesium glycinate demonstrate higher bioavailability than inorganic compounds like magnesium oxide which is only absorbed by 4%. The bioavailabilities of magnesium aspartate, magnesium citrate, magnesium lactate, and magnesium malate fall somewhere in between. In a clinical trial of 16 subjects, magnesium chloride absorption was found to be the highest of all magnesium forms.

    2. Look for purity

    Ask for the manufacturer’s certificate of authenticity to review for label claims and heavy metal content. Some magnesium tablets contain titanium dioxide, an insoluble whitening agent. Although “Generally Recognized as Safe” by the US Food and Drug Administration, titanium dioxide has been linked in research to cancer and neurological damage.

    3. Check for ingredient safety

    Many magnesium brands record elemental magnesium levels that in one serving exceed magnesium’s established upper limit of 350 mg per day. This is a red-flag for consumers indicating that the formulas have not been developed by a doctor or by using FDA guidelines.

    4. Calculate the value

    Consider magnesium citrate or magnesium glycinate. Often these tablets or capsules will come in 400 mg servings. But, these are just a magnesium compound wherein the ions of each element – constantly ionize and then bind together. When they are bound together they are not absorbed into the cells. With this type of product, the best cellular absorption is probably about 20%. So, you think you’re getting 400 mg when you’re really only getting 80 mgs!

    Hopefully, this list will help you narrow your search and find the best formula.

    And, if you want to make it easy on yourself, then try our very own ReMag magnesium formula. It ticks all four of the boxes above and its pico-meter molecule size means more magnesium gets absorbed and less magnesium gets expelled.

    You can find ReMag here:



    Dr. Carolyn Dean

    • Bob March 3, 2018 at 11:36 am Reply

      I used Remag when I was first floxed and I think it is a great product. I now use Electrolyte Balance from Pristine Hydro which has magnesium bicarbonate as well as potassium, calcium and sodium bicarbonate. It is a unique producte containing multiple electrolytes. Check it out its good stuff.

    • jat92517 March 4, 2018 at 7:02 am Reply

      Hi Lisa,

      Nice ad from Dr. Dean……or you could use the much cheaper, highly absorptive Epson Salt for your magnesium and get 30 times as much in one 10 minute sitting than a daily supplement. If you are deficient in Magnesium – stuff muscles is a sign of being 450 grams under in your cells for a 200 pound person – a gram or less (She claims something like 0.2 grams) a day will never solve the problem. Epsom Salts also contain sulfate needed to reverse arthritis, tachycardia, and improve glucose absorption into your cells.What a deal for less than the cost of shipping.

      Cipro can flush about half the magnesium out of your body in as quickly as 3 months – that is close to 2500 grams of magnesium. Many floxies are that deficient. Your body then dissolves muscle to get Magnesium for brain and organ function. You hear about people who can’t walk far, or can’t walk at all. Been there, done that, bed ridden using a wheel chair for 4 weeks. Now partly due to Epsom Salt soaks, 7 weeks later I can walk without a cane the full grocery store. I still need to soak but it is down to every other day now.

      But we like pills. So pills sell. So the pill sellers make money while we wonder “why doesn’t this magnesium pill help me recover from being floxied, I’ll try something else, I tried Magnesium.”

      John Taylor

      PS I don’t make any money selling Epsom Salt, I just lose time posting but I know it has helped other people.

      PPS I have a friend with arthritis. She has hesitated to soak her feet in Epsom Salt for 6 months or a year. Now since the western medicine “cures” are getting expensive and she knows they are short term only. Now she can’t walkfar and needs a cane. Reality is setting in. She can see less capability coming. She wants to start with the nutrition and excercise. “But I don’t feel any better after one soak.” I said “Of course not you are are at step one out of six. Step one will take two months…and you don’t want or can’t figure out how to take step two. Do you want to talk about step two options.” “No” This is very typical.


      John Taylor

      • Barbara Arnold March 4, 2018 at 7:36 am Reply

        It’s not an ad as such, it’s information on magnesium. No one is forcing anyone to buy anything. Sorry but a lot of research has gone into this and there are other opinions beside’s yours. ALL are valid as far as information is concerned. We then have to do our own research and make up our own minds. I also, like many others have been in a wheelchair, me, for two months. Now I am 95 to 98 % better. We are all different and it’s a lot more complicated than you suggest. I am now 74 years by the way. So please stop banging on as though you have all the answers.

        • Don Mowers March 4, 2018 at 7:44 am

          Kudos to you Barbara. Mr. Taylor might be smart and well informed but his attitude seems a bit abrasive. We are all here to get as much information as we can to deal with being floxed. In my opinion that is where we all should be focused.

  46. toby March 4, 2018 at 3:16 am Reply

    I have gastritis and it gaves me nausea. Currently I am using mirtazapine 30mg and sulpiride 200mg. I want to quit sulpiride and take some natural product.

    What you recommend?

    What about mastic gum? Does it kill good bacteria in our gut? Can it make my simptoms worse? I am using probiotics.

    • L March 4, 2018 at 10:46 am Reply

      Toby, I think you need to get yourself to an integrative MD or ND. The drugs you are taking are for depression and schizophrenia or major depressive disorder. While I don’t normally trust allopaths, you need to find someone who can treat your conditions holistically. (I personally was on antidepressants for decades and weaned off while taking turmeric 95% curcumin). First, you cannot just stop these drugs or you will experience side effects. You must be taken off of them gradually and find another way to treat whatever conditions you have. As for the gastritis, again if you can find a holistic practitioner, they can help you with this. After I was floxed I dropped 1/4 of my body weight. My gut was a mess. IF you can think of a digestive/gut issue—I had it! It took months, but I get better with the guidance of an ND, using not only probiotics but HCL Betaine, digestive enzymes, and others. Bone broth is good too. But please, find someone to help you through all this.

      • Don Mowers March 4, 2018 at 11:15 am Reply

        May I second L’s comments. The Turmeric 95% Curcumin is great for so many things it would be hard to list them. Among them is stomach and gut protector. I would like to also suggest Ginger Root. It is very effective in settling the stomach and probably the rest of the digestive tract. Curcumin inhibits inflammation and Ginger does have some pain killing properties. And the idea of being sure probiotics are also in the mix is excellent. Above all. Get off anything that comes in a prescription bottle and cooked up in a laboratory of big pharma. For over 40 years I trusted doctors and prescription drugs and only when I managed to shed them and get to natural supplements did I turn the corner. I have been floxed by over 30 years of repeated doses of Cipro. I didn’t know any better until I started reading about the alternatives.

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 4, 2018 at 11:26 am Reply

      Mirtazapine is an antidepressivant,and Sulpiride is an antipsychotic medicine. You might try to replace both of them with óne natural substance: CBD-oil. This also fights nausea. A three-in-one sollution. In the US the FDA took it off tje list of legal supplements because… a big farmaceutic company showed interest in it. But,wherever you live,you might be able to find it anyhow. It’s not psycho-active (although it’s a mild antidepressivant and a great ant- psychotic it won’t get you “stoned” or “high”) and should actually be legaly availible anywhere.

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 4, 2018 at 11:54 am Reply

      By the way: maybe it’s a good idea to,first,find a way to get a test for cellulair magnesium. Among the symptoms of a mag. deficienty are: (chronic) depression,and anxiety/fear without a known reason/panic attacks. I did a search on mastic gum and I think it’s well worth trying for the gastritis. Research shows that it’s helpfull for many,but not all users with gastritis,has no known interactions with medicines or food,and,as far as I can find,it’s safe. Be carefull with the dosage: ther’s,untill now,no research on the optimal,and safe dosage. Better stay on the safe side,and don’t take more than what’s written on the package.

      • toby March 4, 2018 at 12:38 pm Reply

        I can’t find anybody. Nobody knows anything about floxing.
        I read about HCL Betaine. It is good for stomach acid. Is it good for nausea?

        @ Don Mowers Henk Noordhuizen

        CBD oil isn’t legal in my country. I tried magnesium and curcumin and felt worse on it.

        I thought about ginger. I had metronidazole toxicity. Ginger has interaction with metronidazole, It increases metronidazole level in blood. I don’t know is it safe now. I am 7 months out.

        I want to quit sulpiride because maybe It could make my simptoms worse. I would stay on mirtazapine. What you think is mirtazapine safe?

        In healthy body mastic gum is safe. But for floxies, I don’t know. What if it kills good bacteria in our gut?

        Are there any else natural product which could help with nausea and gastritis?

        • L March 4, 2018 at 12:48 pm

          Well, normally people have too little stomach acid, and mistakenly think they have too much. (Doctors too will prescribe things like Nexium or other proton pump inhibitors to treat stomach acid when in fact the problem comes from too little acid.) Working with hcl betaine can be tricky. I had the help of a naturopath. What you do is start out taking one with a high protein meal. If that doesn’t help, then try two, and so on. My “starting point” was 5. I stayed on that for months and eventually weaned my way down to one. You can read online how people have used it.

          It is hard anywhere to find someone familiar with floxing. The best thing is to find a holistic practitioner, who can treat the whole body. Perhaps you can find a Lyme specialist? We share many of the same side effects with victims of Lyme Disease. Also, when you go to see someone, you can take these “dear doctor” letters with you that explain what has happened by physicians who themselves have been floxed. (I used the ones from Drs. Plumb and De Jong. https://floxiehope.com/tag/dear-doctor-letter/

          Perhaps if you post the general area where you live, you can find someone on this site who can make a recommendation.

        • toby March 4, 2018 at 1:15 pm

          I checked. Betaine HCL with pepsin exist on the market in my country. I will try it along with my probiotic.
          I am from Serbia in Europe

        • L March 4, 2018 at 1:30 pm

          Good luck Toby. Hopefully someone from Serbia will see this and reply. Also, you might want to post on the Flouroquinolone wall of pain on Facebook. (In fact, if you are on facebook, there are over a dozen fluoroquinolone related pages!) https://www.facebook.com/The-Fluoroquinolone-Wall-of-Pain-209182505773463/

        • Henk Noordhuizen March 4, 2018 at 3:36 pm

          I had PPI’s (Losec,Omeprazol),for about 15 years,and I ended up in the Emergency room with severe cardiac arrhythmia,twice,in two weeks time.I had the full list of magnesium defficiency symptoms except PMS ( I’m a male,you see ;-)) After the second hospital “visit” I immediatly stopped with the Omeprazole and had a horrible time. I read about the fact that many,if not most people with acid reflux are not high but low in stomach acid,and it was suggested to try HCL Betaine but it did nothing at all for me. Then I discovered that,as soon as,after a dish,the refluxes start, (juice of) a citrusfruit helps,at least most of the time. First the refluxes get worse,but after 5-10 minutes they’re gone.

          I had Metronidazole toxification too (had to take it together with Amoxyicillin,in 2004. It took me 3 years,and the Beck Protocol,to,more or less,recover. Those AB’s don’t stay in your body (Fluor-based substances do),

          You might try ginger;make a tea with a few grams of grinded root. You can add a bit of honey,or,if you want to avoid sugars,a bit of Stevia (which might be positive for your stomach,too).

          In several countries around the mediterranian hemp is still grownlocaly,for seeds and for fibers (I’ve seen it in Italy). For CBD-oil this is what your looking for; you don’t need THC,which causes the “high” feeling. That localy grown hemp contains extremely low THC,but enough CBD to cure. That’s the hemp where,also in the Netherlands (where I live) the CBD oil is made from. Not áll Dutch hemp is grown for the stoners :-)) Hemp/Cannabis is probably the safest,and the most “broadspectrum” medical plant that is known by humanity,and that’s the main,if not the only reason that it’s illegal to grow or use.By the way: a farmaceutical company in Brittain, GW Farmaceuticals, produces a Cannabis tincture (patented !),and it’s sold in Europe,Asia,and other countries. Guess who has the monopoly on the distribution in Europe? Bayer!

          If you can find somebody who grows ordinairy hemp,the kind for fibers and seeds,you can ask for the leaves (is waste,for most farmers,and used here to make the oil),and make your own oil by dissolving the CBD. Just put the leaves in Virgin Olive oil and cook,for one hour,Au Bain Mary (The pan with the hempleaves and the olive oil in another,bigger pan with boiling water). When finished you filter the oil and put it in a bottle;that’s all.No “high”,no “stoned” but 100% natural.

        • L March 4, 2018 at 3:59 pm

          The HCL Betaine, like I said, is tricky. it took a while but definitely worked for me, because my gut was just ravaged after the Cipro. But your post also reminded me of something else …organic apple cider vinegar is also used for gut issues.

          Doesn’t surprise that bayer has their filthy hands in the cannabis market now too. They are so vile. One reason they fight so hard against cannabis in the states is that they can’t patent the actual plant. Vultures.

        • Vanja March 4, 2018 at 2:17 pm

          Toby, Have you tried kantarion tea?

        • toby March 4, 2018 at 6:06 pm

          I tried kantarion (st.john’s wort) before toxicity, few years ago and couldn’t tolerate it.

          I will try HCL Betaine and ginger as you said that’s safe . I will eat raw ginger because it has stronger effect.

          What about mirtazapine? Is it ok to stay on it? It works as antiemetic and appetite suppressant. What medications should I avoid?

        • Barbara Arnold March 5, 2018 at 3:43 am

          I have just googled CBD oil Surbia, and there are plenty there selling CBD oil. It’s also on Surbian facebook. You may be confused with cannabis oil that contains the THC (the bit that gives you the high) CBD oil is legal in Europe because the thc is so minimal if any, I live in Spain but get mine from the UK. It is legal in Spain, but I have more information from facebook in England regarding what types to take. Maybe worth another look.

        • Henk Noordhuizen March 5, 2018 at 3:53 am

          You might also try 1 or 2 tablespoons of aple vinagor in a glass of water,before the meal.Tried it myself but for me it doesn’t work. One or two citrus fruits after the meal work way better for me and are very healthy,too. Sometimes,after the fruit, the reflux gets a little worse,but 10 -15 minutes later the reflux is gone.

        • toby March 5, 2018 at 12:56 pm

          @Barbara Arnold

          You are right, CBD oil is legal here. As you said I confused it with cannabis oil. I will inquire.

          @Henk Noordhuizen

          I like orange and tangerine. I will try it. Apple vinagor looks safe.
          Do you know which drugs should I avoid?

        • L March 5, 2018 at 1:37 pm

          Apple cider vinegar has SO many benefits. Do a search ,and buy organic, eg Bragg’s.

          Also, not sure if you saw, but this may help you find someone. http://acam.site-ym.com/search/custom.asp?id=1758 Even if they have never treated a floxie, you might do well with someone who has treated Lyme. We share many side effects, and treatments can be similar

  47. Henk Noordhuizen March 4, 2018 at 3:40 pm Reply

    Kantarion tea;Never heard that name. here it’s called Sint John’s Wort.

  48. Don Mowers March 5, 2018 at 12:59 am Reply

    I have no idea if they would help and this is NOT a recommendation but one might look into Aangamik DMG. Aangamik DMG (dimethylglycine), or vitamin B-15, is a natural compound known for supporting circulatory health, cardiovascular function and the immune system. DMG also promotes muscle health, endurance and recovery through its effect on lactic acid. Caution with it though. HIGH DOSAGES repeated over several days could cause irritability, insomnia, restlessness, and heart beating faster or heart rhythm disturbances, therefore it is best to use the lowest dosage that works.
    Also D-Ribose 11 Incredible Health Benefits of D-Ribose – with Side Effects https://www.selfhacked.com/blog/d-ribose-health-benefits/
    But be aware of these side effects. By inducing protein aggregation and rapidly producing AGEs (advanced glycation end products), D-ribose may be involved in cell dysfunction and cognitive impairments [R, R].
    Long-term oral administration of D-Ribose induces memory loss with anxiety-like behavior and also elevates Aβ-like deposition and Tau hyperphosphorylation associated with Alzheimer’s [R].
    Would they be of any benefit? One must look at them and decide for themselves.

  49. L March 5, 2018 at 11:36 am Reply

    Well, I was going to leave a referral for someone on this site for an integrative MD and was unable to get it. However, I was directed to the site. OF course it is always best to try to get a referral from someone who has already worked with a doctor, but if you can’t, here a search for integrative doctors that was sent to me by the office that was closing. http://acam.site-ym.com/search/custom.asp?id=1758

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