Floxie Hope


This site is to give HOPE to those who are suffering from Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome as a result of being poisoned by fluoroquinolone antibiotics – Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox, Floxin, etc.  It contains stories of healing.

Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox and all other fluoroquinolones are dangerous drugs that can have devastating effects that cumulatively I’ll refer to as Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome or Floxing.  Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome/Floxing includes damage to connective tissue (tendons, ligaments, cartilage, fascia, etc.) throughout the body, damage to the nervous systems (central, peripheral and autonomic), and more. The damage done by fluoroquinolone antibiotics can destroy a person’s quality of life or even kill them. Certainly, there is a time and a place for drugs with dangerous side effects. If you find yourself in a septic shock induced coma, fluoroquinolones may save your life. Unfortunately, these drugs are not being reserved for life or death situations. People are being prescribed them for urinary tract infections, suspected prostate infections, upper respiratory infections, as a prophylactic for travelers’ diarrhea, ear infections, pink eye, etc. Thousands of people have suffered needlessly from the devastating effects of fluoroquinolone antibiotics, when another, safer antibiotic could have, and should have, been used.

The damage done by fluoroquinolones is largely unacknowledged by the medical establishment and an accurate diagnosis, compensation and relief are difficult to come by. There is no known cure for Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome/Floxing.  However, many people continue to LIVE after being poisoned by fluroquinolones.  They find healing, recovery, perseverance, compassion and hope.  These are their stories.

This site is meant to give hope for healing to those who are adversely effected by fluoroquinolones.  It is no way meant to disregard the pain of those who are chronically suffering from the horrifying effects of Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox or the other fluoroquinolones.  There are people who don’t recover.  Their stories are real and they matter.  There are also people who are able to recover and I share their stories with the hope that they inspire others, or at least give hope that recovery is possible.

Here is a New York Times article about the dangers of fluoroquinolone antibiotics – http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/10/popular-antibiotics-may-carry-serious-side-effects/?_r=0 – more news stories, research papers and other resources can be found on the “Links and Resources” page.

Here is a Facebook group that is a great resource for those going through Fluoroquinolone Toxicity – https://www.facebook.com/groups/floxies/

Featured post – I’m floxed. Now what?

The Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Solution Ebook has helped many Floxies to recover, including DanielCindy and Ruth.  As a bonus, you will also receive The Floxie Food Guide – a book of diet guidelines to help you through fluoroquinolone toxicity:

flu tox get help you need banner click lisa




25,867 thoughts on “Floxie Hope

  1. bjacob131 November 24, 2015 at 8:25 am Reply

    Lisa, in post-flox cases, how are the symptoms of Fibromalgia, CFS, diabetes, etc, differentiated from toxicity v actual disease?

    • Lisa Bloomquist November 24, 2015 at 8:08 pm Reply

      That’s a very good question, and it’s a difficult question to answer. There is a huge amount of grey area and overlap between fluoroquinolone toxicity and the diseases that it resembles – basically all chronic diseases of modernity from Lupus to Alzheimer’s. It would be nice if the lines between diseases, and the lines between fluoroquinolone toxicity and various diseases, were more clear and solid. Unfortunately, they’re not. I know people who have been diagnosed with fibromyalgia and autoimmune diseases (Lupus and M.S.) post-flox who blame the fluoroquinolones for bringing on their diseases. I also know people who reject the disease label and consider themselves to be “just” floxed. Which one is right? It’s difficult to know. It’s especially difficult given that there are no tests for fluoroquinolone toxicity, and the tests for various multi-symptom, chronic illnesses are not as reliable as most people would like them to be. Honestly, the symptoms of FQ toxicity and the symptoms of, say, fibromyalgia, can be identical. So, it’s difficult to tell whether a person has FQ toxicity, fibromyalgia, or both, or neither. I really, really, really wish that tests were better for the “mysterious” diseases that are out there.

      Psychologically, I think that it’s best not to identify with any illness label – including fluoroquinolone toxicity. You are not your illness, no matter how you, or your doctor, defines your illness.

      • Deborah November 24, 2015 at 10:36 pm Reply

        Just recently diagnosed with Fibromyalgia and Osteoarthritis. Added to the Peripheral Neuropathy diagnosed last year. All due to taking Levaquin. Also, had some other issues which I believe related. This is so overwhelming to someone who had hbp prior. And most disturbing doc will not talk about other than to say lots of folks get PN….ugh!!

        • Tricia November 25, 2015 at 6:20 am

          Hi Deborah
          I’m sorry to hear about all your dealing w as far as symptoms. how far out are you? I am exactly year out and have also been diagnosed w very minor arthritis on my c4 vertebrae. I’m 35:and got 2 different opinions. Both doctors said it is “very minor” and common. I don’t agree as 13 months ago I never had any aches or pains to speak of 😦

        • Bruce December 3, 2015 at 9:41 am

          Last week my doctor sent me to a neuropath for numbness/loss of strength in both hands. After neuropath ran test she told me I had to get diagnosis from primary doctor which he concluded I has carpal tunnel in both hands. He ask if I wanted him to set up appointment with orthopedic surgeon to have surgery. I said NO. It is sad that these doctors went to school and made a pledge to help heal people but have succumb to greed and corruption.

        • Stephanie December 3, 2015 at 10:07 am

          For hand weakness I can tell you from my experience that the IVs have helped me a lot in that area. I still get tremors and spams in fact I am constantly finding ways to get around my spams I have found different tools o help open bottles when I am having a bad day. But I can hold cups now and sometimes can open water bottles on my own. I take a bunch of supplements too. I alsmost had my neck sliced open but thankfully the surgeon looked at me and said I refuse to perform surgery on you. Stay positive it will get better with time.

        • Deb December 3, 2015 at 10:20 am

          Which supplements do you take for the shaky and tremors? Thanks!

        • Stephanie December 3, 2015 at 11:23 am

          Hey Deb,
          I couldn’t tell you which are for shakes and tremors. I feel best on days with my Iv treatments and supplements. Here is the list of supplements that I take I take one a day of each. D-5,000, ubqh(which is a special mix only made by intergrative therapeutics), basic b complex, lipoic acid, acetyl l-carnitine
          I cannot tell you what helps for what and I’m not going to guess. I am under care of my ND and he monitors everything. I don’t know what dosages are good for you I would suggest taking this information to an ND and have them help you with what may work for you. Best with this. I hate spasms they blow I don’t know what’s worse spasms or nerve pain.

        • Linda December 3, 2015 at 10:49 am

          It IS sad. Don’t feel bad though—my neurologist said I was delusionsal—and 11 out of 12 refused to believe Cipro could cause all this damage. (If they would only just look at the info from the manufacturers.) I had excruciating mid-upper back pain—deep in the bone. A doctor told me it was arthritis. Overnight???? Well, after a month or so of twice weekly IVs the pain was completely GONE. So much for that diagnosis.

      • SM November 29, 2015 at 6:31 pm Reply

        Lisa- Great reply. Personally, I tend to reject the disease label. But that’s for my own case and that may change over time. I’ve seen lots of people who have all the classic PN symptoms, for example, but test normal even with skin punch biopsies. So, do they really have nerve damage or is it just something disrupting the nerve signals? Not sure…Just my 2 cents. I’ve probably stayed away from the disease label because for me it has some implication of permanence that I’d like to avoid (mentally).

      • Bruce December 1, 2015 at 1:55 pm Reply

        I have a couple of questions that I need some answers/advice on. I took Levofloxacin twice in July 2015. When I had my first flox symptoms I started blood test, MRI and seeing different doctors to find problem. I was in great shape but lost 30 pounds. My blood test came back with high levels of inflammation and high arthritis levels. I had some 75mg Indomethacin (anti-inflammatory) that he recommended I start taking to get inflammation down and set up appointment with Rheumatologist. A day later I found Floxie Hope and all the pieces started to fall in place. I called my primary doctor to tell him what I found and he discounted levofloxacin as the cause. The rheumatologist said I has “some type of highly inflammatory arthritis” and prescribed Methotrexate (which I did not take). I started detoxing but have been stayed on Indomethacin (2 – 25 mg daily, down from 2 – 75mg) but know I need to wean myself off this. I have tried to stop taking indomethacin but my joints start locking up and tendons/muscles start aching. Question1: Do I stay on this med and buy time or do I need to go cold turkey??? My wife has seen what my first 6 weeks of being floxed was like and thinks I should wait and try to flush as much of this levofloxacin out of my body as possible and stay on indomethacin. Question 2: I live in Mississippi and wondered if there are any Doctors/Specialist in this area that are helpful.

        • Linda December 1, 2015 at 7:09 pm

          Hey Bruce, if it were me I would try to get off all pharmaceuticals. They all have side effects and you want your body to start being able to heal itself. As I have mentioned before, what helped me the most were nutrient IVs from a naturopath. If you look back on my posts you will see the different IVs I took. You also want to make sure to get enough magnesium in an easily absorbed form, take a good probiotic (so much is connected to the gut as far as wellness.) I don’t know how far the place is from you, but I found this: http://www.mississippihealthcenter.com/

        • Linda December 1, 2015 at 7:10 pm

          And no fluoride!!

        • Bruce December 2, 2015 at 8:14 am

          Thanks for the reply and info Linda!!! Also thanks for Floxie Hope website Lisa!!! Even though my local doctor (who I told about my thoughts of levaquin) agreed with the rheumatologist diagnosis of arthritis crap, he did advise me to start detox with probiotics, fish oil, magnesium, resveratrol and indomethacin for inflammation. The same day I started my detox was the day I found Floxie Hope and started reading about Nsaids and steroids. The indomethacin gave me instant relief so I stayed with it. I plan on making it my New Years resolution to get off it. Now a question about steroids/fluoroquinolone, I was given 1st dose (10 500mg Levofloxacin and Decadron shot) and followed it up 2 weeks later with 2nd dose (10 500mg Levofloxacin and Methylprednisolone 4mg Dosepk), did this combo have a effect on my condition???
          I have so many questions and so few people to ask. Thanks for input and advise!!!!

        • Linda December 2, 2015 at 10:22 am

          In a word Bruce, YES! I believe the reason I got hit so hard was that I was prescribed both Cipro and prednisone at the same time (and had been on prednisone already for a couple weeks.) Although the black box warnings relate the combination specifically to ruptured tendons, it is well known that steroids exacerbate fluoroquinolone toxicity. No more steroids for me EVER. (Hopefully no more pharmaceutical drugs ever.)

        • jwinn December 2, 2015 at 11:56 am

          Lisa and Bruce, my doctor gave me Cipro, Levaquin AND prednisone inspite of the warnings. I was on Prednisone for a entire year. It almost killed me. Lisa, do you know if the oral glutathione would help me?

        • Linda December 2, 2015 at 12:06 pm

          Jwinn, it makes me crazy how indiscriminately steroids and flqs are prescribed, as if they were completey benign. As for glutathione I did a fair amount of research on this early on, and most sources claim that oral glutathione is just throwing your money away. By the time it makes its way through the GI system it has little to no value. The best is IV because it bypasses GI and goes right into the blood. There seems to be controversy over whether liposomal glutathione, which comes in a liquid and is encapsulated to “protect” it as it goes through your system, has value. It’s expensive…around 60-70$ for a small (tiny) bottle. I went through several in the beginning and can’t say it did anything for me. I have recently just heard about using glutathione (comes in a special form) with a nebulizer, which I may look into.

        • Stephanie December 2, 2015 at 1:13 pm

          Can I just echo what Linda said about no steroids ever. After my floxie issues popped up a stupid DR told me to take steroids and holy heck. All the muscles in my face wouldn’t stop moving. It was scary and annoying and made me so sick. It also made my whole sensitivity to bring able to maintain my body heat very hard. Before I found my current amazing ND I was given so much drugs it’s not funny. I made my self a promise never to take pills from walgreens cvs or any other pharmacy ever again

        • Dani December 2, 2015 at 1:49 pm

          Hey Stephanie I am looking into seeing a ND what does he or she do for you? Prescribe for you?

        • Stephanie December 2, 2015 at 1:53 pm

          My ND gives me weekly IVs and vitamin supplements. He also does blood tests when he needs to. Most importantly he listens to me.

        • Bruce December 11, 2015 at 5:17 pm

          Went to see Dr. Brad Frezza ND in Memphis yesterday. Came out with tons of info (3 hr. Q&A) and a brighter outlook. He suggested all organic suppliments (Probiotics, organic Mutli-Vitamin, 3-6-9 Blend of oils with flax, sesame and other oils, organic Magnesium and Iodine (which he put a lot of emphasis). I also am taking CoQ-10 which he said was ok. He also has an intense detox program that I may do after the 1st of the year. It was truly a breath of fresh air!!!!!!!!!

        • Linda December 11, 2015 at 7:33 pm

          I know how you feel, Bruce. After seeing a dozen MDs, feeling hopeless, barely alive…I finally saw an ND and had the first glimmer of hope. Best decision I made, just would have done it sooner had I known……. And sounds like you are in good hands

        • Bruce December 11, 2015 at 7:58 pm

          He stressed diet and doing his own juices but also was willing to share knowledge and answer all questions. He has a neat website ahe4life.com.

        • jwinn December 11, 2015 at 8:07 pm

          Good news for you, Bruce! I am so happy for you! Do you mind sharing more specifics on the Iodine he suggested that you use?

        • Bruce December 11, 2015 at 9:31 pm

          First thing is to do iodine patch test by painting a 1nch by 2 inch square with the red liquid iodine on the inside of your forearm and let dry. If the red square disappears (absorbs into skin) within 8 hrs – 24 hrs you are most likely iodine deficient. My red patch almost completely disappeared in about 5 hrs. The next morning I could not tell where I had painted the patch. I purchased a bottle of 12.5 mg of Iodoral (Iodine/Potassium Supplement) from my ND and take 1 tablet per day for 1st week, 2 tablets a day the 2nd week, 3 tablets a day for 3rd week and 4 tablets a day for 4th week. You can maintain the 4 tablets until iodine level becomes sufficient. You need to do iodine test every 3-4 weeks. If iodine does not absorb into skin after about 24 hrs you are iodine sufficient.

    • Linda December 6, 2015 at 2:17 pm Reply

      and I wonder too, how many of these “modern diseases” are actually side effects of pharmaceuticals in general.

      • Jason December 6, 2015 at 2:36 pm Reply

        In the words of my good friend Walter Last, who has been in the Health Industry for 40 years:


        “I am now fully convinced that most diseases are indeed caused by the medical system, and in the following I want to state my reasons for this conclusion.”

        I agree with him, as a very old wise Man once said, “Disease goes in through the Mouth”. Food, Medicine & Water are the big 3 causes of Disease in my own opinion

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 2:38 pm

          I’ve said it before, I love this guy. 40 years of research, here is what he thinks:

          “Basically all drugs are more or less toxic, the more so, the more ‘powerful’ they are”

          Him and I share a LOT of the same opinions, and no wonder as the longer you research, the more the truth becomes obvious. That whole article is a good read

        • Linda December 6, 2015 at 3:14 pm

          well, I am in good company!

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 5:52 pm

          Actually when I said big 3, I really left out 2 so its more like “big 5” (well 4, 1 falls under the other)

          Toxins (Metals, Medicine, Halides, etc), Food, Water, Viruses/Bacteria/Fungus

      • Stephanie December 6, 2015 at 8:28 pm Reply

        I feel like all of them are. The more I read the more o just think that all of them are. Slowly shrinking the population big pharma laughing and watching thei pocket books get bigger. I have seen pics of deformed babies thanks to gmos in other countries their leaders don’t care because they can afford safe food

  2. Mark S November 24, 2015 at 10:11 am Reply

    Can anyone who has had achilles issues on the lowest part of the leg advise how long it took for them to start to feel better? And what you did to help it recover? I can’t tell if I’m making it worse by icing it or not.

    • Lucy Sky November 24, 2015 at 12:35 pm Reply

      I Hi Mark
      I don’t want to start a mutiny etc but I have just received an e mail from the People’s Pharmacy in which there is an article about too much Vit D can cause leg pain.

      I am not suggesting in any way whatsoever that this is the cause of what has happened to us because what has happened to us is obviously due to the horrendous fluoroquinolones BUT just thought that I could pass the info on for general information and in case anyone wishes to research this further in depth.


    • Lisa Bloomquist November 24, 2015 at 8:12 pm Reply

      Hi Mark,

      I’m not sure about the answer to your question about whether or not to ice your Achilles, but I did want to point this out:

      http://www.biomedcentral.com/1472-6882/15/217 “These results showed that TOL19-001 counteracts most of CIP and IL-1β induced-effects on tendon cells.” CIP is ciprofloxacin. TOL 19-001 is made up of spirulina, glucosamine sulfate, ginseng, selenium, sillicium, iron, vitamin E and zinc. It’s available through a French company – http://cicatendon.com/

      I haven’t tried the TOL supplement specifically, but I did take many of its components as supplements throughout my FQ toxicity journey. I think that they helped.


    • Lucy Sky November 29, 2015 at 3:42 pm Reply

      Hi Mark
      I was just wondering if you had even had any Statins?

  3. Lucy Sky November 24, 2015 at 11:32 am Reply

    In a word physio by an experienced physio. Went for treatment yesterday.

    Manual traction helped me .

    It is important to check all medications for the side effects of peripheral neuropathy and also any acidic foodstuffs drinks. I think fluoride toothpaste causes the burning to go worse almost immediately.
    My physio told me to walk and not to sit for long periods of time. Important to keep the joints from seizing up.
    Also advised to get some sketchers shoes to support fallen arches of both feet.

    This is the advice I was given ad may not suit others. I do not know .

    Good luck.

    • Danilea November 24, 2015 at 2:31 pm Reply

      I love that website !

      I am getting really good results for pain and stiffness from acupuncture. It also knocked out the asthma I had a couple of years ago. The dizziness seems intractable, alas.

  4. Mike November 24, 2015 at 4:34 pm Reply

    Lucy. I agree with you the vaccination thing is ridiculous. If you cannot tolerate the vaccine you can get a note from your doctor that will excuse you but you will have to wear a mask every day, all day long until late spring. This started a few years ago for us. I’m still not happy about it. I may end up wearing the mask next year.

  5. Lucy Sky November 24, 2015 at 4:57 pm Reply

    Hi Mike
    I have only ever had one flu jab and it made me ill. Obviously that deterred me from having any more. I know the sulphites and other preservatives are damaging but I avoid as much meds as possible now after being floxed. I am in a lot of pain with peripheral neuropathy. I am having a bad day today I am afraid.
    with the mask thing Is that for your protection!

  6. rich November 26, 2015 at 5:58 am Reply

    Jason – peter yes I have been twitching for a year… all over at the start now mainly in lower legs…. when im sitting in certain office chairs they pump all day having their party…. pump pump twitch

    • Dann December 2, 2015 at 1:52 pm Reply

      Hi Rich, after 6 months I am experiencing shaky hands and twitching shoulders and legs. Do you take any supplements or anything to help that or do you just deal with it?

    • Lucy Sky December 5, 2015 at 7:58 pm Reply

      My physio told me not to sit for longer than 30 minutes at a time. This is to avoid postural stress. Have to keep the circulation going to avoid swelling and pressure on the nerves. Also advised by countless people to take vitamins B12 , C, D.

      Selenium, zinc, magnesium, probiotics.
      Also been advised to get checked out for Lyme Disease, SLE, shingles.

      I am also proposing to get an adrenal fatigue stress index test plus urinary thyroid hormones done. I am having my ferratin level checked as well as ESR nd CRP , these tests should include the creatinine kinease test to check for muscle damage by these detestable fluroquinolones.
      Please excuse the rant.

  7. Stephanie November 27, 2015 at 8:42 pm Reply

    just saw the commercial for a concussion movie about the NFL players. Was thinking maybe someday someone will help us and make a movie about us. But am just getting discouraged. Trying really hard not to but it’s hard when people who are supposed to stand up for the little guy don’t even care about us.

    • Linda November 27, 2015 at 9:29 pm Reply

      omg, we are so on the same wavelength. earlier I saw a commercial for football players to call a law firm about being compensated for head injuries, and I thought WHEN IS IT OUR TURN??? We weren’t damaged while pursuing something we love, for big bucks. We were just following doctors orders.

      • Stephanie November 27, 2015 at 11:33 pm Reply

        Lmao Linda yes we are. That’s exactly what I was thinking too. Oh and thank you for your other help btw. My hands are super crampy and I’m in between my nightly spasms for some reason spasms get worse for me at night so this will be short. But yes we weren’t trying to make big bucks by putting our bodies on the line. I think if I ever get a chance to talk to these people I would use that line. I swear someone has to care about us. I mean I see a lot of NFL players blow out their calves and Achilles I wonder if any of them are floxies. Well I’m out to try to relax and watch my spasms. Feel like a little kid. I have a time limit to when I can converse with others it’s like having bedtime again. Lmao 😢😳

  8. Lucy Sky November 28, 2015 at 8:41 am Reply

    Physio has helped manage the spasms but not cure them.
    My physio says ‘I you don’t use it , you will lose it’

    However as we all realise we are all different and each case must be judged on an individual basis and assessed and advised accordingly. I have tried inter differential treatment, this seems to help .
    At least it is better than pain killers and gives a mental break away from pain. Physio also said that the collagen build up around the area of inflammation and the body responds by going into the natural inflammatory process . This means that muscles swell pressing on nerves. Swelling is due to columns of collagen building up then irritating the tissue and nerves.
    So in my case movement is encouraged to disperse the columns of collagen that have built up.To mobilise to de stiffen the joints.
    Advise to myself from MY physio is not to sit for longer than 30 minutes at a time. To walk as much as possible but not to overdo it.
    To wear correct footwear. He recommended Sketchers.

    Hope this helps .

    • Bob November 28, 2015 at 10:24 am Reply

      i’m 30 months out and still have a lot of pain in my legs. I thought it would be a good idea to take collagen to help rebuild tissue but if it builds up and irritates the nerves maybe not.

    • Bob November 29, 2015 at 5:50 pm Reply

      Lisa, At one point you were taking kraton, cordalis and kava for pain. Were these in a single formula or separate? Do you remember wher you got them? TYhe pain in my feet is intense and I need to get something.

      • Lucy Sky December 5, 2015 at 8:06 pm Reply

        Has anyone assessed your feet?
        Have you seen a neurologist or a podiatrist?

        Have you had a mineral and vitamin screen?
        Have u tried Vit B12, D and C? Have you been checked for diabetes? I do not wish to cause any stress but it is important to rule out certain conditions.

  9. dan hedrich November 28, 2015 at 12:11 pm Reply

    can anyone please please have an antidote for nausea and dizziness. thanks.

    • Linda November 28, 2015 at 1:42 pm Reply

      wish I did. For the first time in 9 months of floxing I have vertigo and nausea. been several days. if it’s any consolation, it does feel like it is going away (too slowly) on its own.

    • daniela November 29, 2015 at 7:42 pm Reply

      I feel less dizzy when I strictly avoid any grains. Not only is there a wheat belly book, but also a grain brain one, so I can’t be the only one.
      Acupressure points in the middle of the forehead and the crown of the head.
      Yoga positions are the standing balancing poses (mountain, tree, eagle) but also plough.
      Meditation – I don’t know why this is the hardest thing for me to get around doing, but when I do it’s like a miracle. There are nice guided meditations on Youtube.
      Is your dizziness related to travelling in a car, do you feel better riding and significantly worse after a trip? If so, limit travel.
      The acupuncturist wipes out any pain that arises, but the dizziness is almost impossible to improve. Sometimes it’s related to tinnitus and sometimes not.

      • Lucy Sky December 4, 2015 at 6:49 am Reply

        I thought I would clarify what happened to me re feeling nauseated and dizzy.
        I was prescribed co codamol for a dislocated shoulder, I was very careful about the dose taking one or two a day then later just 3 to 4 a week.
        I was ok on this BUT several weeks later started to have severe headaches, nausea dizziness etc.

        As u will see from a previous posting I was told it was due to the codeine.

        However to cut a long story short it later transpired that the problems were caused buy a change of brand of co codamol.
        The pharmacist spotted this. The drug that caused t problems was Zapain.

        I do not know if you are taking any meds or supplements but the fillers/binders can cause problems as well as the drug itself.
        I hope that you feel better soon. Just hang on in there.

        It may be worth while keeping a food diary plus an account of any meds or supplements and any reactions. I am intolerant to wheat, gluten, maize starch/corn/cows milk, yeast, amaranth , aspartame etc.

        I had a food intolerance test carried out by a nutritionist.

        Hope the above helps.

    • Lucy Sky December 4, 2015 at 6:31 am Reply

      Hi Dan
      When a brand of a medication was changed I had the same problem with nausea and dizziness.

      Some of the fillers and binders can cause a bad reaction apart from the drug itself.

      • jwinn December 4, 2015 at 7:25 am Reply

        Dan, I used Ginger Root for the nauseau. Can’t say it took it completely away, but it did help. I still don’t get hungry…I eat to keep going, and unfortunately, because I am in pain, I don’t usually eat the right (healty) things. I eat what is easiest to grab and put in my stomach. One day, I hope I’ll fell like actually shopping for healthy foods! I keep Ginger Root on hand, as well as magnesium. Hope this helps.

    • Carla December 5, 2015 at 11:04 pm Reply

      I’m glad ginger was mentioned. I have found it to be the best treatment for nausea of any kind — including motion sickness and morning sickness. I always carry Gin-Gin chews when I travel, and usually end my day with a cup of ginger tea.

      I’m having a lot of trouble with my feet and ankles as a result, I think, of Cipro given me intravenously in the hospital while I was being treated for an injury. I recently read an article about chronic magnesium deficiency, and I’m finding that supplements of magnesium and potassium are helping relieve burning pain in my feet.

  10. Lucy Sky November 28, 2015 at 2:33 pm Reply

    Sorry if this posting is a bit bitty.

    My neurologist said the headaches and dizziness were due to taking co codamol for pain. I was only taking 3 to 4 a week, yes a week. He said that that was more than enough to cause an analgesic induced headache plus dizziness. Codeine also causes the eye to swell.
    Codeine lowers the pain threshold.
    l can also do the same.Tramadom

    According to the pharmacists I have spoken to the main cause of dizziness etc is due to the additives, binders and fillers particularly in the generic brands of medication.
    Things like soy, maize starch/corn, zapain caused headaches, nausea.


    • dan hedrich December 7, 2015 at 3:19 pm Reply

      lucy, thanks for your reply on the nausea and dizziness. its better now but i am still dealing with a host of other symptoms 18 days after stopping levaquin. dan.

  11. dan hedrich November 28, 2015 at 5:44 pm Reply

    hi, linda what other symptoms have you had prior to 9 months?

    • Linda December 1, 2015 at 7:19 pm Reply

      Sorry dan–just saw this ( I usually just check the ones I get replies to that come in my gmail.) So—here is what I have experienced: blurred vision, huge floaters, numb fingers and toes, eviscerated GI system with 32 lb weight loss in two months with muscle waste, extreme breathing problems (not lung related), choking sensations around the neck, excruciating mid-upper back pain, electrical zaps in knee and hip and popping in back, insomnia (ZERO sleep for the first month and then 3-5 hours even with a sleeping pill), extreme anxiety, suicidal ideation (not sure if that was a side effect or because of the suffocating breathing problem I experienced), swelling over the ulnar nerve on the wrist—started golf ball sized and then went down from there, but there is still a small swelling 9 months later), bladder pressure and retention, brain fog, hives, hyperosmia (this was truly nightmarish–wouldn’t have been able to live with it. Olfactory damage so severe that ALL things smelled asphyxiating to me. Even a couple drops of dish soap–DILUTED—would choke me. That is about 90% better, but it has been replaced with olfactory hallucination—usually smells like cigarettes or dirty ashtrays. Gross, but apparently not that unusual for nerve damage.), pericardial effusion (fluid around the heart.) I think that’s about it.

      • Lucy Sky December 4, 2015 at 6:57 am Reply

        Linda I have just seen this. I am sorry that you are having all these signs and symptoms. I have been thru this and to a certain extent am still enduring these horrid signs and symptoms.
        Apart from being floxed I was later also diagnosed with a thyroid disorder. A multinodular goitre was found as an incidental finding on a CTPA scan done to exclude a pulmonary embolism. If you can get a thyroid screening done it would be helpful in order to exclude this as the cause of your signs and symptoms.

        As you know the fluoroquinolones attack the thyroid. I do not wish to cause any alarm but what’s the point of putting up with these signs and symptoms when something may be able too be done to help you.

        No one should have to go thru all this.

        Best wishes

      • dan hedrich December 7, 2015 at 6:12 am Reply

        linda, thanks for your reply. i wish you a 100% recovery. do you know of any good naturepath in jersey? i am also looking for your older posts on iv nutrient therapy and what was in it. thanks dan.

        • Linda December 17, 2015 at 5:29 pm

          sorry Dan. just saw this and not sure if I had replied. Don’t know any in NJ but I would try to find one that does nutrient IVs.

  12. Michael Teeter November 29, 2015 at 9:16 am Reply

    Hello everyone,
    I am sorry if this was answered already. If it was I must have missed it.
    I have been officially diagnosed with a variant of Adult Autoimmune Enteropathy. I was wondering if anyone else here has been diagnosed with something similar or not.
    I have to head to Cleveland Clinic for treatment seeings that adults with this syndrome or decease is very rare. Some of the medical personal said this was brought out by the Cipro Floxing me. A Chain reaction and now my immune system is in attack mode.


    One of the Meds they treat this with is Tacrolimus.

    Anyway I have to run.
    Hang in there gang!
    never give up never surrender.

    Mike Out.

    • daniela November 29, 2015 at 7:44 pm Reply

      Wasn’t it the plaquenil which set this off ? Why would they give you stronger immunosuppressants ?
      Please take care ((((()))))

    • Jason November 29, 2015 at 9:24 pm Reply

      Hi Mike. They might just be right. I have actually researched this for many years and its been something I have been meaning to write more about, and now looks to be a good time since it likely applies to you.

      Many experts in the Alternative Health World have reported that Leaky Gut is one of the main causes of MANY different kinds of Autoimmune Diseases (if not all of them), and Cipro WILL give many people a Leaky Gut, Gluten is one of the other main causes of Leaky Gut itself although there are more. So in the case of Cipro, good bacteria in the Gut is destroyed, the gut ends up inflamed, this inflammation spreads body-wide (shows up as Arthritis, Brain Fog, Muscle/Tendon Pain, much much more) AND it also allows the bad bacteria in the body to start “taking over”. Left unchecked long enough, Candida will cause Intestinal Permeability otherwise known as a Leaky Gut.

      Once this happens, all hell can break loose in the body, things that should NEVER end up in the blood steam, do now because of this, causing an autoimmune response. Candida is already bad enough and has a large array of very terrible symptoms that can make and keep people very sick, Leaky Gut opens the door (literally) to much much worse problems, including the body “attacking itself” which is known as an Autoimmune Disease, such as Lupus, IBS, MS, Rheumatoid arthritis, type 1 diabetes, list goes on.

      There are MANY books and studies out there on this, but of course the Medical World is WAY behind as usual, and in the words of one expert, “When a person develops intestinal permeability, there is a whole list of health problems that take place. Most people in the conventional world don’t know about leaky gut syndrome or intestinal permeability, yet. This will change shortly because drug companies are now working on a drug to treat intestinal permeability. Once they develop a drug, everyone will know about it.” – LOL, surprise, not. Some of them do know, and here’s what another article says about it, ” Ironically, some of the drugs used to treat autoimmune diseases themselves can produce leaky gut syndrome.” LOL, surprise again, not. Drugs as usual are not the answer, and never will be the best answer, to any Medical problem.

      So knowing what I do about Leaky Gut, and then looking up Autoimmune Enteropathy, there was not a moments hesitation in the thought that came to my mind, it looks to be a classic case if there ever was one. Celiac disease itself IS an Autoimmune Enteropathy, where the immune system’s response to gluten exposure results in chronic inflammation and destruction of the GI tract. Gluten was ruined by Humans (like many things) and in the opinion again of MANY experts, is not fit for consumption by ANYONE.

      Here is what DR. FASANO, one of the top experts in the field, MD, Director of the Center for Celiac Research & Treatment has said after decades of research, “every autoimmune disease has three basic ingredients: a genetic predisposition, an environmental trigger, and a leaky gut. You need to make a clear distinction between celiac disease and the immune system’s attack on other tissues, like the thyroid. Gluten (or more specifically, “gliadin”) is inflammatory because it cannot be digested by any human (read more here). If gluten is ingested, it causes a leaky gut**. If the gut doesn’t heal after ingestion of the gluten, it starts a war that has collateral damage of some kind. If that war is confined to the intestine, then the distress is in the function of the intestine.

      So, to reiterate the critically important point he made besides the important Gluten one, “every autoimmune disease has three basic ingredients: a genetic predisposition, an environmental trigger, and a leaky gut.” So in the Allopathic Medical World, as usual, we have them treating everyone’s SYMPTOMS, the Autoimmune Disease whichever one they happen to have, with drugs, which can often make them worse and/or cause new problems, sometimes they can suppress the symptoms, but they NEVER address the root cause, that is key for Big Pharma, since the problem will most often persist unless the true ROOT CAUSES are addressed, which almost never are, by them.

      Here is one good short article with some key points outlined in it, there is a ton of info out there on this: http://draxe.com/4-steps-to-heal-leaky-gut-and-autoimmune-disease/

      • Jason November 29, 2015 at 10:26 pm Reply

        I will also repeat what I have said before here too, in my estimation MANY Floxies are suffering from Candida, and some undoubtedly have a Leaky Gut with it. These things alone WILL be a HUGE reason why some people take a long time to heal and suffer a lot, and why some people don’t seem to heal at all. The list of symptoms mimics FQ Toxicity in many areas, here are just a few:

        – Chronic diarrhea, constipation, gas or bloating
        – Nutritional deficiencies
        – Poor immune system
        – Diagnosis of chronic fatigue or fibromyalgia
        – Headaches, brain fog, memory loss
        – Excessive fatigue
        – Skin rashes and problems such as acne, eczema or rosacea
        – Allergies or asthma
        – Food allergies or food intolerances
        – Cravings for sugar or carbs
        – Arthritis or joint pain
        – Depression, anxiety, ADD, ADHD
        – Autoimmune diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, celiac disease or Crohn’s

        Tip of the Iceberg only, and of course people don’t need to have all these to have it.

        Experts now contend that Candida overgrowth has reached near epidemic levels in “society” (not just Floxies folks, but of course they are VERY susceptible to it). Here is a quote from one article, “Fueled by a fast food, high sugar diet, extensive use of antibiotics, steroids, oral contraceptives, high stress and a weakened immune system, the overgrowth of candida yeast has reached epidemic proportions in America. Knowledgeable experts estimate that 60 to 80% of all Americans, men and women, are afflicted.”

        Those are not even all the reasons, there are many more why Candida is literally out of control. Something else, again in the opinion of experts, that has reached epidemic levels is Chronic Inflammation. Inflammation most often starts, you guessed it, in the GUT. To me, its not a coincidence this is where Candida resides, peacefully, until given the opportunity it needs to start taking over. Its also not a coincidence that both of these things are at “epidemic” levels….

        Where do we see inflammation today usually?

        – Appendicitis
        – Alzheimer’s
        – Arthritis
        – Asthma
        – Autism
        – Autoimmune Disease
        – Bursitis
        – Cancer
        – Celiac
        – CFS
        – Colitis
        – Crohn’s
        – Cystitis
        – Dermatitis
        – Depression
        – Diverticulitis
        – Fibromyalgia
        – Hepatitis
        – IBS
        – Lupus
        – Parkinson’s
        – Phlebitis
        – Prostatitis
        – RSD/CRPS
        – Rhinitis
        – Tendonitis
        – Tonsillitis
        – Vasculitis

        Not even close to a full list, notice how many are actual Diseases too, note that most of these ones are considered to be “Inflammatory Diseases” (note also I am not saying Candida is behind all of these, there are other causes of inflammation). Here’s another well known fact, a huge amount of Floxies suffer from Inflammation. Time for a “Gut check”? (punn intended of course… 🙂 )

        • Jason November 29, 2015 at 11:20 pm

          Since I am on this topic, again there are MANY causes of Leaky gut here too not just Candida or Gluten. Here is one many people don’t realize:


          “Lectins – What Foods Contain Them?

          The short answer here is basically all plants and animal products to varying degrees. Nonetheless, lectins are concentrated more in some sources than others. Foods with the highest lectin activity include: grains of all kinds (especially wheat), legumes (especially soy), nuts, dairy, and nightshade plants (e.g. eggplant, tomatoes, potatoes, peppers, etc.). Add to this list the oils and other derivative products from these food sources. And yet another, lesser known category: GMO food, since lectins are often spliced into modified varieties in order to enhance “natural” pest and fungal resistance.

          What Do They Do To The Body?

          Let’s go back to the intestine again. (Some field trip, eh?) Lectins’ stickiness allows them to bind with the lining, particularly the villi, of the small intestine. The result? Intestinal damage (with impaired cellular repair potential), cellular death as well as compromised intestinal villi, which means reduced absorption of other nutrients, including minerals and protein. Add to this altered gut flora, which can allow certain harmful bacterial strains like E. coli to run rampant. Furthermore, because the body is now responding full-time to the needs of the injured gut lining, proteins and other resources are redirected from other basic growth and repair processes. Furthermore, lectins have been associated with leptin resistance, a pre-diabetic condition linked to obesity.

          Perhaps the most insidious impacts lectins can leave in their wake is this: Leaky Gut. Leaky gut is a term for the breach in the intestinal lining created by lectins hand in hand with other antinutrients. Once the intestinal breach exists, lectins and other particles (like partially digested food, toxins, etc) can “leak” into the bloodstream.

          Once lectins open the door, so to speak, out of the small intestine, they and other fugitive particles are now free to move about the body and bind to any tissue they come across (anything from the thyroid to the pancreas to the kidneys). Of course, the body reacts to these invaders by directing an attack on these particles and the otherwise perfectly healthy tissue they’re attached to. Enter autoimmune mayhem. That’s why lectins are linked with autoimmune disorders like IBS, Crohn’s, colitis, thyroiditis, fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue syndrome, and arthritis”

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 12:22 am

      • Linda November 29, 2015 at 10:29 pm Reply

        and now I see an ad for drugs (xiaxafin) for IBS that—“good news”—these antibiotics work directly in the gut!!! FDA approved!!! OMG! Are you kidding me??? And as I was looking for info on this I found this little exchange on NIH site: (are you sitting down?): G&H Which other antibiotics might prove beneficial for treating IBS?

        DD Ciprofloxacin, levofloxacin, neomycin, and metronidazole can all be effective for the treatment of bacterial overgrowth associated with IBS, but they have not been fully tested for IBS per se. One advantage of rifaximin is that it has no systemic effects; other antibiotics are absorbed systemically, but rifaximin works only within the gastrointestinal tract.

        More complete disregard for people’s health, courtesy of big pharma and the FDA.

        • Stephanie December 1, 2015 at 1:41 pm

          Lol Linda that drug is so terrible others drugs can increase the amount of the drug that’s in your body and push it to toxic levels so every drug you take has to be checked. I have IBS and I just take flora that my naturopath gave me it helps a lot.

        • laura November 30, 2015 at 8:59 am

          I watched the dr axe webinars on leaky gut and essential oils. Has anyone ever bought either of his programs? were they worth the money?

      • Terry November 30, 2015 at 8:51 am Reply

        After reading all the references and attachments, there isn’t much left for me to consume. I’m trying to maintain weight. I’m eating all the time, yet weight barely stay’s the same. Stools are not loose, yet not much is excreted. So, I believe the body is using everything. Maybe Mito took a hit and is using it all. The protein powder does have soy, I will find something else. I do have oral thrush and the nystatin didn’t take care of that. I have a script for fluconzole that I have yet to pick up due to fear of what reaction I may receive. I did a lot of research on natural ways to rid the candida. Yet, it doesn’t appear to be effective from what I read. It is hard to know if my symptoms are partly due to leaky gut or Cipro. Because they mimic each other. My digestion isn’t painful or bloating. My only real symptom is the candida. And knowing that Cipro probably killed the good flora. I have been taking mega probiotics and sauerkraut for a month. The natural yogurt that is suppose to help with flora appears to add fuel to the candida. Three months out.

        • Jason November 30, 2015 at 11:37 am

          Fluconzole contains Fluoride, I don’t think I have to say anything more about that, however it is also an otherwise toxic chemical based drug (every drug is toxic) and Floxies are suffering from, and trying to recover from toxin overload, so drugs of ANY kind are not going to be helpful in those terms.

          Once again in the case of Candida and Leaky Gut, the Allopathic Medical World is almost completely ignorant, and the very few toxic answers they currently have are almost completely useless, and in most cases are actually detrimental

          I’ve said it before that Candida can be a real bastard to get rid of, it is NOT something that can be taken lightly, and most people are going to need to do LOT of research and/or work with a Naturopath to help get it back under control. Leaky Gut can be even more difficult, because the root causes need to be known AND if Candida is one of them which it often is then you have to eradicate it AND heal the Intestinal Permeability as well.

          Many people including Floxies take Probiotics and do a couple other things and think this is going to help, and in most cases it will be NO where near enough. Candida once it has taken a foothold, also becomes even harder to eliminate in people who have elevated levels of Heavy Metals, unfortunately this is a lot of people.

          This starts getting a little complex, but I will outline the basics for those who may be interested:

          – First anyone with it and serious about eradicating it should purchase Biotin and Molybdenum to help alleviate the Herx effect aka Die-off symptoms when killing it, as well the Liver should be supported with things like Milk Thistle, etc (Nettle Leaf Tea is something else that might help with Die-off in beginning, as well as Saunas, ). Vitamin C should be taken as well as other Vitamins and Minerals, noting that the ones mentioned are needed moreso, as well as Magnesium, Zinc, Vit A, Vit D, Vit E, and Iodine. A proper Liver Flush is also a good idea during this time. Also helpful throughout the whole process is to consume a glass of warm water first thing in the morning and last thing at night, with Bentonite Clay and Psyllium, 1 hour away from any supplements. Psyllium can be hard on things, so probably should only be used for a week or two and then substituted for something else high fiber like Ground Flax. Also helpful throughout the process is taking Digestive Enzymes and HCL.

          – At the same time these are started, the diet will need to become EXTREMELY limited, with extra emphasis on the extremely. What has to be done is beyond the scope of this post, there is a lot of information and misinformation on the Internet, look around, take notes, then take what is suggested and make it even MORE strict

          – Absolutely NO Sugar, none, nunca, nada, this also includes natural Sugars, including in Yogurts, Fruits of ANY kind, etc, etc, etc, etc and etc. This is its favourite food. This also means absolutely NO simple carbs, since these are processed into Sugar in the body, no Potatoes, No Pasta, Rice, Bread, etc, etc, etc AND etc. NO Processed Foods, none, nada and nunca. NO Gluten, Grains, Lectins, or anything else that can irritate the Gut, etc, etc, etc

          This is the hardest part of killing this son of a *****, and where many many people fail. Its also where many websites on the Internet mislead people into thinking that some of those things are okay to eat, when they are not going to be in most cases. The more strict someone is, the more chance of success they have, and vice versa, not strict enough, more chance of failure. Unfortunately in my estimation many people once they get an overgrowth of Candida, even if they are able to get in back under control, now become much more susceptible to having it take over again, and this is multiplied probably 25 times over if they have higher levels of Toxic Metals.

          What is left to eat? Again this is large topic, but not much sums it up. If you are thinking even vegetables have natural Sugars in them, you would be right. What I will say again is there is a lot of info out there, and after looking at enough of it you will come to realize what makes sense, and what doesn’t given what I have said here. The veggies the lowest of the Glycemic Index with ALSO a low Glycemic Load is what people are going to mainly be after here. Then after some time Organic Chicken, Eggs can be added in, and slowly some other things that make sense.

          So ffter taking Moly & Biotin & Milk Thistle for 4 – 7 days & using the warm water drink, and after having been on an extremely strict diet, someone can then start adding in the other Vitamins and Minerals and also rotating Anti-Fungal supplements/oils, using one at a time for roughly up to 2 weeks max in each case, then switching to another one. They can also start eating natural anti-fungal foods (which don’t need to be rotated), a little at a time, and using Natural Anti-Fungal supplements a little at a time; all these anti-fungal things need to be added SLOWLY at the beginning or the die-off will make someone VERY sick in some cases, especially if they doing this correctly by being very strict on diet, which in and of itself will kill off some Candida.

          Some examples of Natural Antifungals that do not need to be rotated are: Virgin cold-pressed Coconut oil, Undecylenic Acid (SF722), Garlic, and other foods like Brussel Sprouts, Rutabaga, etc.

          Some examples of Antifungals that need to be rotated are: Oil of Oregano, Caprylic Acid, Thyme (Red oil hard to find supposed to be good, others will be helpful too), etc.

          After about 20 days, high quality Probiotics can be added, preferably with the DDS-1 strain in it, and when these are taken Prebiotics should also be taken and/or consumed. Prebiotics are things like: Chicory Root, Jerusalem Artichoke, Dandelion Greens, Brown Rice Bran, Yucca Root, Raw Onions & Leeks, Cooked Onion, etc

          Essentially those are most of the basics IMO. How long someone needs to do this is highly variable to the Individual and many other factors, the absolute minimum in my mind is a month, but 3 months is a better plan, and some people will have to remain on a “fairly” strict diet much longer than that, some maybe even indefinitely, again highly variable, Metal factor, etc. Doing a “Cleanse” in the first week is often recommended and a good idea, many ways to do this.

          Again I will direct people to this website as a “starting point” to learn more about all this: http://www.thecandidadiet.com/candidasymptoms.htm


          I will stress again the seriousness of this issue, the treatment, AND the timing of such things when talking about Floxies, all of this should be discussed with an extremely knowledable Naturopath.

        • Linda November 30, 2015 at 12:10 pm

          Terry-I had dropped 32 lbs in two months and it was so hard to gain weight back. I initially was having smoothies with added avocado, coconut oil, protein powder, etc. I was able to gain about 12 back but it is still a struggle to even hold on to that, esp trying to eat “right.” (organic gluten/soy/dairy/gmo free.) But what I most wanted to say was, for oral thrush. Open a probiotic capsule and mix with a bit of water—swirl it around your mouth for about 20 seconds and then swallow. Mine went away with a day doing this (advised by my ND.)

        • Terry November 30, 2015 at 1:37 pm

          Linda, thank yo for the suggestion. I have tried that.

        • Lucy Sky December 5, 2015 at 8:45 pm

          A friend suspected from his signs and symptoms that he had a leaky gut/dysbiosis.
          He also some pain, burning and tingling and numbness in his feet , heels and tendons.

          He had a test for H .Pylori under the NHS which came back negative.

          However the signs and symptoms continued so he was referred by a nutritionist to Genova Diagnostics for a full parasitology and H Pylori testing . This time the result was postive for H Pylori. His cortisol levels were found to be raised.
          He refused the usual antibiotic treatment for the H Pylori and instead went on a Gluten Free diet, took Vitamin D, probiotics, avoided caffeine.

          When his Vitamin d level rose all his signs and symptom disappeared.

          He introduced gluten back into his diet with no apparent ill effects.

          He continues to take his Vitamin D plus other supplements and is quite an authority n the subject of vitamin and mineral deficiency etc.
          .His GP had told him that men do not get candida!!

          Fortunately my friend disregarded this erroneous pearl of wisdom and had his stool tests done privately.

        • Michael Teeter December 6, 2015 at 4:36 pm

          After my last trip to the hospital I was down to 124 pounds. I was 168 before that and before i was floxed i was 187. I am 6’2”. What i did when I returned home is I started eating pea protein powder I mixed it in my broth soups both beef /bone and chicken. I ate carrots and rice and potatoes. I consumed rice milk and I took a product from standard process called Nutrimere made from sea conch. I also took one called Protefood. I drank a bit of chlorophyll and I had an amino acid iv.
          My weight went back up to 165 in less then 2 months.

        • Terry December 6, 2015 at 4:42 pm

          Thanks for the reply! I hope your feeling better!!

        • Jason February 14, 2016 at 12:43 am

          I’m just posting an update here close to the more or less protocol I posted above as several people are now taking “Colostrum” and getting great results as it is an effective Candida killer AND it heals Leaky Gut. Its something I read about years ago but never actually tried, and now after others have I’ve done more research on it and many many people are getting results with it out there so looks to be a great addition to anyone’s Gut healing program and can be used together with many of the things I listed above (everything but the things that need to be rotated)

        • Jason February 14, 2016 at 12:46 am

          Also here is another good article from one of the “GUT” experts” on Herx die-off and what can be done, how important diet is when dealing with Gut issues, and much more like what I told Linda recently, that it is VERY very likely that all the people who got severely Floxed by taking a Steroid with the Cipro are that way because of the extra damage that happens to the Gut when these 2 things are taken together, and same goes for NSAIDS as well as Lisa found out when taking Advil 2 weeks after the Cipro which is what set the Floxei Bomb off, GUT GUT GUT


          Quote – “Yeast overgrowth can happen in response to improper diet, poor immunity, difficulties in digestion and antibiotic use. Poorly digested food can lead to putrefaction (rotting) and encourages the growth of organisms. Antibiotic use destroys the normal balance of gut flora and leaves an open field for bad bacteria and fungi to move in. Hormones and steroids can make this condition worse, too. Most importantly, over-consumption of simple sugars & refined carbohydrates will feed the yeast. If the immune system is weakened or there are not enough probiotic (“good” bacteria) to combat the yeast, then it begins to grow unchecked and cause symptoms, such as “leaky gut”.


          Lots of great tips in the article for dealing with die-off toxins, less the coffee (sorry, but that is OUT for Floxies)

      • Lucy Sky December 5, 2015 at 7:04 pm Reply

        I found your posting about leaky gut, candida overgrowth, diet very interesting.
        I have suspected that I have a leaky gut.
        Your posting has motivated me to go and get the relevant tests done now to see if I do have the leaky gut syndrome. So thank you .

        I wondered if I could beg a massive favour. Since being floxed my interest in everything has reached rock bottom especially where food is concerned.

        Even thinking about food is enough to cause a panic attack which I experience on a daily basis thanks to BIG PHARMA AND THE FLUROQUINOLONES.

        I need your help urgently Jason.I feel panic stricken and stressed out when it comes to food. I feel the anxiety level rapidly rising as I type the word food.

        I am taking warfarin and need to avoid high intake of vitamin K.

        The ACC said to avoid cranberry juice/D Mannose but I can eat a moderate amount of vitamin K each day and they will titrate the dose of warfarin around it.

        To complicate matters I have an intolerance to corn, yeast, soy, wheat, gluten, amaranth, aspartame,cows milk, almond milk.
        I expect that you know that even gluten free products contain wheat due to cross contamination.

        I just do not know what to eat anymore. It is like being in a nightmare 24/7.

        I am begging a massive favour from you Jason.

        I would be extremely grateful if you could possibly spare the time to send me a menu of suitable foodstuffs that are safe to eat in the leaky gut syndrome which I believe is the root cause of my condition.

        I know that this is time consuming but I cannot face the daunting task of preparing a menu.
        I just feel burnt out where food is concerned. I try my best to get interested but it is futile.

        I cannot face cooking, preparing the food etc. I try very hard to eat properly then I give in and tend to eat the first thing just to get eating over and done with.
        There is no pleasure left anymore in anything especially in eating. Even fancy foods do not appeal to me.
        This has been going on for two years now which is when all these signs and symptoms started after taking the detestable fluroquinolones – CIPRO this caused peripheral neuropathy and tendonitis.

        I also have an annular tear between L4 and L5 plus bulging cervical and lumbar discs. In addition I have throbbing pains in my Achilles tendons, my knees, ankles and feet.

        I have been having manual traction at a private physio. This has helped the back pain and the neuropathic pain caused by the damn fluroquinolones but the relief wears off after approx 8 hours and the pain and burning returns.

        I cannot get comfy and feel as if I am sitting on rocks.
        I can’t begin to tell you how much money I have spent on buying chairs and a sofa only to have had to dispose of them as the pain increased and the furniture that was relatively comfortable and suitable was no longer comfy and so had to be changed.

        The facet joint in a thoracic vertebrae is stiff and the tissue surrounding it is inflamed.
        However the physio ‘pummels’ this area and it is very painful. This cannot be avoided and after a couple of treatments the acute pain subsided I would liken the pain to having a trapped nerve in the neck. However as stated previously the physio said it was a stiff facet.

        I had a dislocated shoulder three years ago with a rotator cuff tear. No surgery, no physio was offered. I had to go privately . This is the state of the decaying, shambolic NHS.

        I apologise for this very bitty posting but I felt I had to get these things off my chest and also bits of info in the posting may help others.


        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 12:39 am

          This whole website is pretty good from what I have seen, and she wrote up some good stuff on Leaky Gut


          Be sure to read PART 2 and PART 3

          Quote from part 2:

          How Accurate Are These Tests?

          “Because testing for leaky gut is still being developed, I believe that we will see an increase in the accuracy of testing over the next decade. In the meantime, these tests can be useful for identifying more severe cases of leaky gut. However, since leaky gut can exist in differing severities, has different causes for different people, and because addressing even mild leaky gut is beneficial for your health, these tests have limited usefulness at this time.”

          This is my opinion as well, testing might help confirm severe cases, but can likely miss confirming less than severe cases.

      • Lucy Sky December 5, 2015 at 7:46 pm Reply

        Hi Jason Very good posting.

        Just thought I would mention that Cephalexin causes C. Diff and some hospitals and GP’s will not prescribe it. Pity the same drs and hospitals continue to prescribe the crappy fluroquinolones!

        Rather illogical not to prescribe one type of antibiotic yet continue to prescribe the other group especially when they are KNOWN to be so dangerous!!

        Still when did logic ever come into the thought processes of the medical profession let alone BIG PHARMA.

        Now prescribed lyrica for the peripheral neuropathy. Side effects include loss of vision, throbbing of the joints, muscle damage, suicidal ideation etc, etc, etc……

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 12:03 am

          Hi Lucy. I’m sorry for all your going through, and I feel your pain on Food, Cooking, and the whole shebang there. Healing from Leaky Gut can be a VERY tall order, and somewhat complicated unfortunately. Having a Leaky Gut means significant damage has been done, in order to heal ALL potential root causes should be eliminated, diet changed accordingly, and supplements should be taken to give the body the best chance to heal.

          The Doctor Axe link and the Candidadiet links above, combined with the other links and everything I have written gives quite a bit of info on this. The Doctor Axe video also links to this article which gives more helpful advice: http://draxe.com/leaky-gut-diet-treatment/

          Note however he advises fruits are okay, I disagree with this. Most of all the other advice is good, including diet stuff to eat, to avoid, and supplements (note L-Glutamine is thought to be the most important, but it can cause Floxies issues with Brain Fog and/or Anxiety) to take, however, he omitted things to help kill the Candida if they are part of the problem (and often are, he mentions antifungals in another article he wrote on Leaky Gut however) so his info needs to be combined with mine above, in my opinion of course.

          What I did to heal from this before was first and foremost went on EXTREMELY strict diet, after 4 days of that and Moly/Biotin/Vit C then started anti-fungals etc etc all as I have outlined above in one of the posts. THEN, after 3 weeks of that, I then started adding supplements to also start healing the Leaky Gut. This was a 3 month process, and in the end I felt WAY better (this was 2.5 years ago and pre-Flox, my Gut was already a mess, has been my whole life really).

          Food is generally my enemy, I feel great most times as long as I don’t EAT! Eating f**ks me over (sorry now I am bitty) ALL of the time, so my diet has become extremely limited, and when I step outside of those boundaries, cheat a little, eat in a restaurant etc I often end up paying a price, sometimes a HUGE price, depressing truly.

          So someone’s diet is highly personal, and very dependent on MANY factors including what their Goals are; having said that though there are some general guidelines I think all Floxies should be following. I have noted these more or less in posts above and in reply to Tricia near bottom of the page, No Sugar, No Gluten or Wheat and most Grains, No Dairy, those are the big three. Then, someone can eat a basic Paleo type diet like the Wahl Protocol, being careful to focus on Alkaline and Anti-inflammatory foods to help heal from Floxing and reduce pain. Also, anything that can irritate the Gut should be avoided, Spicy foods, Alcohol, Caffeine, drugs, GMO’s, Lectins, etc, and they can focus on “soothing” healing things, like Aloe Vera, Fiber, Bone Broth, Healthy Fats, etc. (There are some soothing Supplements to take here too, lots of info in Internet Dr. Axe did not list them all, Marsh-mellow Root, Slippery Elm, etc)

          Again though it really depends on goals, and where someone is in them on. What I did was start out on veggies only (no raw carrots they cause Gas and irritate the Gut), Coconut Oil and organic Eggs. Once Candida starting coming under control I added Organic Chicken, Unsweetened Coconut Milk, Protein shakes, Fish once in awhile, Brown Rice and maybe a couple more things but not much. Then after 3 months and I felt Gut was healed a good bit I slowly started added more foods a little at a time, which ended up biting me in the ass I would learn later. Its an ongoing battle for me, I am sure Antibiotics ruined my Gut 30 years ago and it has never recovered, of course all the Alcohol and Drugs I use to use back then also did not help surely. I also believe I am missing some key Genes that make my Gut weaker, my Mother also has a bad Gut, so does my Brother and at least one of his children.

          Anyway, eventually a “normal” person should be able to add SOME limited fruits back in, but honestly there isn’t much food “SAFE” to eat anymore, its a HUGE problem IMO the state of the food supply, water supplies, even the air is toxic. ALL processed food is utter garbage, that is 85% of what is in the store, all that is left is fruits, veggies, fish (watch the toxins) and meats really, and there off-shoots, its like someone told me many many years ago, when shopping you have to stick to the “outside” aisles only, the moment you veer from that you’re screwed. This means everything has to be “homemade”, and its a lot of work and huge pain in the ass, but it is what it is. Restaurants are not safe for people with Gut issues, Processed food is crap, and the saddest part of all, many of the “healthy” foods are now being ruined as much as possible by Monsanto’s and the like. So we have to buy Organic, and hope it truly is, hasn’t been cross-contaminated, and then even then very disappointingly there are still some potential pitfalls and not everything can be eaten, like my own trouble with green shakes now making me tired 😦 I am a bit of an extreme case, tons of things give me Brain Fog or irritate my Gut, but I imagine many Floxies are not far behind me sadly.

          I’ve said it 100 times on here, Diet is absolutely critical and pivotal to healing from something like FQ Toxicity, and in my estimation many Floxies have trouble healing because they do not put enough importance on this. Many of the people I have seen heal quickly were on strict diets, but of course diet is not everything either, so many other factors can affect healing, but IMO this is near top of the list.

        • stephanie December 6, 2015 at 12:22 am

          I am going to have my ND test me for leaky gut next week. I am doing a little test right now that I think will prove that I never had diverticulitis and I had leaky gut and was given antibiotics for it. I seriously weep for state of western medicine. LOL

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 12:34 am

          This is a pretty good website for Gut issues, and Diet etc


          Quote, “Chronic, system-wide inflammation and leaky gut is a huge beast to tame…”


        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 12:41 am

          Ooops, Steph please see my post abotu 6 up at December 6, 2015 at 12:39 am I meant for that to also show up down here.

    • Linda November 29, 2015 at 10:38 pm Reply

      Hey Mike, I can’t help but wonder how many of us, given the same physician, would also be diagnosed with AAE. (My gut has been a mess since being floxed) I found this article from UCLA, and they say it is treated with steroids….something a floxie needs to avoid like the plague. I wish you could find an integrative doctor or ND to see for this. http://www.med.ucla.edu/modules/xfsection/article.php?articleid=720

  13. Lucy Sky November 29, 2015 at 3:40 pm Reply

    Hi Mike et al
    I had an MRI scan which questioned an encephalopathy but auto immune tests were negative. I had already had anti nuclear antibodies done which were positive being 1 in 80. EBV was also pos . I will enquire about the encephalopathy you have mentioned .

    Someone sent me an email this evening in which he mentions the statins. There is a reference in the e mail written by Dr John Biffra called the The Truth about Cholesterol.

    If someone else has already made a reference to this on the Forum I apologise.

    The latest propaganda about the Statins is that they are now being pushed by Big Pharma as a query way of controlling seizures!

    I discovered today that drugs are not researched on women. Therefore their dangers , of the drugs, cannot be evaluated on females!!

    Joan Wade.
    Joan Wade was badly affected by the statins suffering polyneuropathy . Joan is on Face Book which gives in depth details on the DANGERS OF STATINS. These cause muscle damage, wastage,



  14. Mike November 30, 2015 at 2:47 pm Reply

    You had a brain MRI scan? In my research to find out what has happened to my eyesight I ran across a floxie that had ptc (pseudotumor cerebri) which caused his eye problems (optic neuropathy/neuritis) You need a lumbar puncture to verify increased intracranial pressure. Sometimes headache upon rising in the am and pain in the back of your eyes when you look around are symptoms of this. It usually happens to obese pregnant women but apparently fluoroquinolones may cause this too.

    • Lucy Sky December 1, 2015 at 3:25 pm Reply

      I had a headache over the front and top of my head plus throbbing in my right eye. Ohthalmological examination revealed dry eyes and concretions and a posterior vitreus detachment

      I had an ultra sound scan of my yes plus retinal photography to exclude anterior arteritis.
      A lumbar puncture was unnecessary because intracranial pressure presents with other signs and symptoms.

      I was diagnosed with a thyroid problem in May 2015.

  15. Marçal William December 1, 2015 at 6:22 am Reply

    Marcal William Conceição Santos, 26 years.
    In February 2014, were the first symptoms. I started to present a picture of pain in the groin and pain in the lower back. So I looked for a infectious disease doctor, who prescribed some tests such as urine culture. Upon receiving the test results, the only result “abnormal” was a bacteria in the urine. Then I looked for a urologist which in turn has prescribed an antibiotic called levofloxacin 500mg, one a day for 28 days based on the result and with suspected prostatitis.
    Having just ingested four tablets felt strong fatigue and malaise as if with virus. Because of this I came to seek medical infectious disease specialist who recommended change to the antibiotic ciprofloxacin 250 mg two daily for 14 days. With the use of this medication, as well as fatigue, I felt burning in the legs, I started having insomnia, irritability and pain in his right leg.
    Even before finishing the medication, I felt strong pain of stomach and went to emergency, where the GP advised me to come back to take another 7 days levofloxacin up going to another urologist.
    The new doctor said it was not prostatitis.
    From there, the left side of antibiotics, but continued with pain in his right leg same time after you stop taking the antibiotic.
    Two months later, I went to another urologist who referred me to a battery of tests, including the espermocultura pointed out that other bacteria. The doctor diagnosed again as prostatitis and said that all the symptoms were explained by this. Then again prescribed levofloxacin 500mg each day for 28 days. I did not realize at the time it was the same medication before because the trade name changes.
    In the beginning of the ‘new’ treatment did not feel prominent symptoms, only the pain in his right leg that bothered much.
    Until one day, during treatment, my leg was paralyzed, I ended up going to the emergency room again. Where this was not associated with the antibiotic. Then continued treatment.
    Then I came to have difficulty swallowing and there were blisters on my calf. Still not associated to the antibiotic. Associated symptoms of a possible disease. Because I had never heard about side effects like those caused by a ‘simple’ antibiotic.
    Until the 22 days after treatment had severe diarrhea with mucus where my belly was very swollen. I tried to treat it, but not solved with conventional remedies.
    Anyway I associated the symptom to the antibiotic and researched about it.
    Found that fluoroquinolones cause severe diarrhea because of a bacterium called Clostridium Difficile. And I could also have acquired a colitis.
    Already tired of going to doctors and distressed by the situation, I decided to treat myself on my own against bacteria and bought Florax and metronidazole.
    After four days the diarrhea has passed, but the nightmare began there, other symptoms began to appear after discontinuation of the drug: muscle wasting, chronic insomnia, burning in the legs and arms, numbness, muscle spasms, irritability, panic attacks, psychosis, anxiety attacks, dry mouth, constant cleft lips, metallic taste in the mouth, coating the tongue dorsum, dry skin, sore eyes, fall of the eyelids (ptosis), constant itchy eyes, dry and red eyes at night , constant sickness, pain and weakness in both legs, pain in the tendons, reddish urine, blood in the stool, constant diarrhea, allergy to the sun, back pain, pain in the teeth, redness and severe scaling (fungal infection) in the scalp, shut cold (electric shock), chronic fatigue, small red spots on the skin (fickle), rashes, constant tingling in two fingers, intracranial pressure, jaw pain, excessive sweating, pain in the ankle and heel, swelling inside the nails, slow metabolism, sudden weight gain (10 kg), memory loss, poor concentration, blurred vision, dizziness, constant pain in the throat and urinary incontinence.
    After some time unable to sleep, I had a psychotic break, but kept aware enough to realize that my situation was the limit and that tended to worsen. So I tried suicide. But I was rescued in time and hospitalized.
    I was right. I had completely lost control of myself and my life. I was experiencing a symptom called ‘depersonalization’, which was slow and air all the time. So they decided to treat me psychiatrically.
    Time passed and I keep almost all symptoms.
    Considering the high amount, variety and complexity of these symptoms is difficult and analyze their processes and their effects. However, the fact is that 1 year and 6 months later, most of the symptoms remains debilitating, limiting and destroying my quality of life.
    I am convinced that all this did not occur or occurs to everyone who takes this antibiotic. Myself after finishing the first treatment did not feel much. And after the second, virtually all the effects of the medicine label and others who just found out a lot about researching broke out all over my body.
    People around me were slow to understand what was happening to me, even I only dived in depth on the subject after many months. He hoped that all effects would pass and tried to lead a normal life.
    We arrived at a point where I realized all my physical limitations and decided to collect me. I thought about giving up and tried suicide again. Because of this I interned in a psychiatric clinic. Of course it did no good. Except for the friendships I made and the rehabilitation that had even a not so friendly environment.
    After all this, I put aside the psychiatric treatment, take only one remedy to sleep (Rivotril) and I am dedicating myself only study to find a solution or solutions pros symptoms that purchase.
    There are reports, news, medical testimony, documentary, book and even scientific articles describing and detailing the danger of this drug and the irresponsibility with which it is prescribed.
    I sincerely feel that I have lost my youth and I’m afraid to grow old with all of these symptoms. My situation is dramatic, I was a young healthy, happy and dreamy. Today I am weak and can not do anything I liked and planned to do.
    I am currently treating me with an orthomolecular doctor and following the guidelines of the book: “The Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Solution”.

    • Bob December 1, 2015 at 8:29 am Reply

      Marcal, I took cipro 30 months ago and am not yet recovered but I have had some up periods that give me hope. I just hope you don’t try to commit suicide again. I believe you have a good chance to recover. Try and visualize yourself as recovered until you can get into the emotion of it. Read “You are the Placebo” by Dr. Joe Dispenza. The mind and emotions have a powerful effect on the body. It is incomprehensible that it is legal to do this to people but it is. The AMA trained doctors cannot be trusted.

      • Marçal William December 1, 2015 at 5:11 pm Reply

        Hello Bob, I’m trying not to think about suicide but it’s hard …
        Adverse effects dominate my emotions …
        The only thing I have done in traditional doctors are doing tests to prove my symptoms. Still think of entering a lawsuit against Bayer.

        • Linda December 1, 2015 at 7:30 pm

          Marcal, I hope you took the actual brand name one from Bayer, because if you were given the generic, you will not be able to file suit, unless you are in another country? There is a catch 22 and only the state of Alabama has allowed a case to go through where someone took the generic. It’s crazy, but you can’t sue the original mfr because you took a generic, and you can’t sue the generic lab because it is an exact copy of the original! The deck is stacked against us. Even more so in CA where I am wanting to sue the doctor for giving me prednisone at the same time, and a “failure to inform” re the side effects. But here in CA no attorneys want to take such a case because of a cap the state put on “pain and suffering’ which is where most of the money is. There are also proof requirements, eg you HAVE to produce expert witnesses–and who can afford that? Plus in most negligent cases you use the standard of what a “reasonable person” would do. But her in CA for medical negligence, it is what would a fellow physician do—and we all know that they give this poison out like candy!

          What ever you decide, start trying to find an attorney now, and research what your statute of limitations is for filing. IF you have passed it, you have no legal recourse. (However, in most cases, it is not only when you were given the drugs, but also when you realized the drugs were the cause of your injury.)

        • jwinn December 2, 2015 at 8:54 am

          Virginia has already blocked the suit in our state. I tooke the generic brand of cipro, but the real Levaquin.

        • Lucy Sky December 5, 2015 at 7:38 pm

          Hi Marcel
          These drug Companies are nothing but a set of ruthless bastards.

          I have been through the same as yourself except that I did not have psychiatric ‘help’ .

          I too have contemplated suicide as a means of escaping this horrendous nightmare of pain, anxiety and depression.
          I thought that I was having a mental breakdown when all this started.

          However the timing of the acute onset of the same signs and symptoms which you have so eloquently described indicated that these signs and symptoms were caused by the crap antibiotics.

          These antibiotics also attacked my thyroid gland causing the thyroid to malfunction. I felt as though I was going out of my mind.
          It wasn’t until april 2014 that an incidental finding of a multinodular goitre was found n a CTPA scan done to exclude a blood clot in my lung.
          Anyway to summarise it all the thyroid disorder plus being flexed was/is the cause of the multiple signs and symptoms . It is incredible to realise that an antibiotic can cause all this damage.

          However Marcel I am determined to fight these b……… .
          Why should I end my life due to a bunch of greedy morons who should be locked up and the key thrown away.
          I want to stay alive and see these ‘people’ sent to prison. I want to stay alive and thwart these ruthless drugs Companies. If I topped myself do you think these cretins would even bat an eyelid !
          Well we know the answer to that question don’t we.

          Of course they would not care. In fact they meaning the drugs Company involved would be relieved, delighted at the potential risk to their greedy, grasping, psychopathic existence being permanently removed.

          So I keep myself going by telling myself that tomorrow I may feel better. I may even be cured.

          I am determined to fight these creeps.To see them squirm, to embarrass and show then up.
          I intend to keep alive just to annoy these bastards.

          That is my coping mechanism. I also go to physio to try to get the cipro stiffened tendons and joints de stiffened. To ease the pain.

          Big Pharma can stick their toxic concoctions where the sun don’t shine.

          So can drs and trick cyclists,

        • Marçal William December 7, 2015 at 7:39 am

          Hello Lucy, thank you so much for the answer.It’s hard to watch our own bodies, our health disintegrate.I am Brazilian. I sent my story to ANVISA (which corresponds to the FDA in the US), see the respondents:

          “According to his account, it is understood that the table can be related to an adverse reaction tomedicine. According to definition of the World Health Organization, an adverse reaction to medication is RAMcharacterized by a harmful and unintended response to the use of medication and occurring at doses normallyused in man for the prophylaxis, diagnosis or treatment of diseases. The RAMs are therefore partrisk associated with the use of a medicament. As described in leaflet, several adverse reactions, serious orno, can occur with the use of Ciprofloxacin. It is for the professional prescriber assess whether the expected benefits inuse of a drug outweigh its risks because as with any medicine, there is an associated risk toits use. At this time, the benefit-risk profile of Ciprofloxacin remains favorable, i.e., the beneficial effectsthe drug outweigh the risks associated with its use. However, this profile can change at any time andhealth actions can be taken by ANVISA.”

          Unbelievable is not it? “The benefits outweigh the risks.” For them to kill a bacterium is more important than running the risk of living with symptoms spread throughout the body throughout life.

          Anyway,The only thing I’m doing now is studying the enemy, look for natural solutions and gather evidence against these criminals of the Pharmaceutical Industry.You will file a lawsuit against them? If it is, keep me informed want to learn how to take legal action against these miscreants.

        • Lucy Sky December 6, 2015 at 8:11 pm

          Hi Marcel
          I agree with Bob and think that you will get better. Age is on your side. I agree with the sentiment that Bayer deserve to be sued . I would love to sue them and also see them in prison . Perhaps I will sue them in a class action when I am fully recovered.

        • Bob December 6, 2015 at 8:15 pm

          Lucy, If you are going to sue you have time limitations based on your state to bring an action. If you didn’t take a generic, which I did, you can get in on the class action suit by Barron and Budd going on now.

      • Lucy Sky December 6, 2015 at 11:10 am Reply

        Hi Bob You mentioned that you ‘had some up periods…….’
        What do you attribute these ‘up periods’ to?

        What changed? What was different in your life at the time or preceding these up periods?

        Did you eat or drink something that triggered off another bad period? Did something change in your private life? Were you less stressed?
        I hope that you do not mind my asking these searching questions.

        I am seeking some guidance and hopefully answers on how to manage these adverse reactions to these horrendous antibiotics that are so freely dished out by uncaring and incompetent medics.

        I will never stop fighting for justice .

        Why are these drugs still being manufactured? There is something highly wrong and corrupt at a very high level that allows this situation to continue to fester.

        I feel that we have to keep pressurising the Politicians globally to ban these fluoroquinolones in particular.

        • Bob December 6, 2015 at 7:18 pm

          Lucy Sky, I also have leaky gut, and celiac. If I went off a strict diet before cipro I did not feel good. After cipro if I go off the diet I have a terrible relapse. Also I think working too hard sends me back.

    • Linda December 1, 2015 at 10:28 am Reply

      Marcal, I am so so sorry for everything you have been through. I have experienced almost everything you did/have including suicidal thoughts and severe, suffocating breathing problems. I will tell you what worked for me–literally saved my life–was getting nutrient IVs from a naturopathic doctor. Where you live, are there any naturopaths or integrative doctors? The ones I took were high dose vitamin C, phosphatydilcholine, H2O2, “Myers” and glutathione. I got a push of glutathione with all except the H2O2, because the fluoroquinolones rob your body of that and magnesium. We all need lots of magnesium, in the most bio-available form you can get. All of the above are natural, not chemical drugs. They help detox, help rebuild you collagen (THe C) and immune system and help with nerve damage (the Phosphytydilcholine).

      It makes me so angry to hear the doctor switched you from levaquin to cipro!!! From one evil twin the the other. Glad you hung in there, and I have not used “The fluoroquinolone toxicity solution” myself but others on this site swear by it, so I am glad you found your way here.

      • jwinn December 1, 2015 at 10:55 am Reply

        Marcal, my doctor did the same thing to me. He switched me from Levaquin to Cipro. It ruined my life. That was 5 years ago. I am so sorry that you are experiencing these problems. All of us here have experienced the same pain and emotions that you are experiencing. I do not live withint 200 miles of a naturopathic doctor. I wish I did, because that is where I would go. It is my opinion that a naturopathic doctor is the best hope you have at this point. AMA trained doctors do not understand. I went to 18 different specialists, and none of them helped me. They just took my money…what little I have. I agree with Bob, they cannot be trusted. I hope you are able to find a good naturopathic doctor. Prayers and blessings be with you for better days ahead.

        • Linda December 1, 2015 at 11:31 am

          Jwinn, sorry there are no naturopaths near you. Have you tried searching for an integrative doctor? These are usually regular MDs who have become disenchanted or at least see the limitations of allopathic medicine and added natural treatments as a compliment to their regular western medicine practices. I have actually found an integrative internist, dentist (Huggins trained—the gold standard), and even a cardiologist! (Still searching for a gynocologist…)

        • jwinn December 1, 2015 at 1:36 pm

          Thank you, Linda. I live 120 miles from Richmond, Virginia and have searched for naturopaths there and none give IV treatments. I have not searched for an integrative doctor. What I know of natural supplements, I have learned from this website. I appreciate hearing from people who have gone through this experience, because NO ONE knows how it feels but people who have been floxed. My closest friends thought I was just having a nervous breakdown and was imagining things. I honestly thought I was going to die. I got my things in order, and pulled out my life insurance policies so my family didn’t have to search for them. I can atleast walk now, but it is 5 years in and it is all I can do to make it through the day. I go home each day, and crawl into bed with my dog. Thank God for my dog!!!! She has kept me going! I am taking various supplements that I have learned about from this website. I don’t even tell my GP what supplements I take, because she discourages me from taking them if I discuss the topic with her. She knows how sick I was, but would never diagnose what caused it. She just did the typical insurance proticol and sent me to every specialist under the sun. I couldn’t walk, muchless drive, so I had to pay someone to take me to all of these doctors 2 hours away. Of course, I didn’t fit their critiria for their specialty either, so NO ONE has helped me. I read the posts on this website, and do the best I can. I appreciate the information I have gotten here. I don’t talk to anyone about how bad I truly bad I feel, because they just think I am crazy.

        • Stephanie December 1, 2015 at 1:55 pm

          It’s a crime what has been done to you just as it ha been done to all of us. I know it’s hard I know people think we are crazy but it’s just because the media has done a wonderful Djibouti brain washing people. It’s not you it’s them. Dogs are amazing mine never leaves my side. I swear she knows when I don’t want to move or am going to lose it. My doggie knows when I’m dizzy and will lick my face. Hehehe

        • jwinn December 1, 2015 at 3:16 pm

          Thank you, Stephanie. My dog is 13 yrs. old. I don’t know what I will do without her. I have such a hard time with pain in my joints. She licks both of my arms every night when we go to bed. I know she knows I am in pain. I love her sooo much! She has been by my side through all of this!

        • Stephanie December 1, 2015 at 3:24 pm

          Awww what a sweety your doggie knows you need love so they just have a way of giving it to you when you need it the most. Mine is warming up my legs right now. They are so amazing!!!

        • Linda December 1, 2015 at 6:59 pm

          Jwinn, I too thought I was dying for a couple months (and actually wanted to for much of that). It is so frustrating when people don’t understand, but how could they. When I think back to my absolute worst, gasping for breath, vision a mess, in extreme pain, and totally eviscerated GI system—I can hardly believe it myself! So glad you have the dog. I actually had been hoping to move out my little studio just so I could get a dog, but this has been so financially devastating on top of everything else, that’ not going to happen. Hope you can find someone to give IVs –that really turned it around for me.

        • Marçal William December 1, 2015 at 5:02 pm

          Jwinn, thank you by force. I’m going in Orthomolecular. He’s helping me, although not fully believe that antibiotics are the cause of my problems. I’m still trying to convince him. I also hope for better days.

      • Marçal William December 1, 2015 at 4:51 pm Reply

        Hello Linda,
        Thank you so much for their solidarity. Thank you also for treatment advice. I’ve jotted down and take you to the doctor who is treating me Orthomolecular. I’ve done infusion Glutathione once. Not given any results yet. But I will keep trying.
        It is unfortunate that doctors do not have more information on the effects of these antibiotics.

        I will do what I can to get my life back.


        Marçal William.

        • Linda December 1, 2015 at 7:03 pm

          It will take a while for you to notice difference. I was rotating several different IVs and each one (except for H2O2) was followed with a “push” of glutathione. I didn’t start noticing a different until a month or so in, and that was going twice a week. I ended up doing that for about 6-7 months. Now I go about once a month (but am now doing acupuncture and chinese herbs…the timing was right.)

        • Lucy Sky December 6, 2015 at 6:32 pm

          Hello Marcel

          You will/are getting your life back.
          I believe that what has happened to us has happened for a reason.

          I am not a vindictive person however I hope that those who are responsible for doing this to innocent decent people will get their just desserts and be sent to prison for a very long time.

          After all it is obviously in the Public Interest that the scandal of pushing dna destructive drugs onto the innocent and vulnerable public be exposed at every given opportunity.As someone else has recently pointed out what has happened to us is criminal.

          Bayer that was started by an ex Nazi deserves to be shown up and exposed.

          How could these drugs companies be allowed to manufacture such detrimental drugs?
          It beggars belief and all logic.

        • Bob December 6, 2015 at 8:09 pm

          No one will go to prison for these crimes. The pharmaceutical and medical profession have been killing thousands of people every year for a very long time. The Nazis didn’t lose WWII. They were brought to the US in Operation Paperclip. The German people lost the war. Another Nazi weaponized the tick with spiroketes on Plum Island under the guise of research on animal diseases. it’s now called lyme disease. Medicine is now just for profit. That is why treatments that work are not covered by insurance. It doesn’t need to work. It needs to make money.

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 9:18 pm

          Yeah that is the sad truth for sure Bob, really everything you said there. I secretly (or in some cases, not so secretly) hope that Terrorist will target them, because I don’t see any kind of true or fair justice being done any other way

        • Linda December 7, 2015 at 10:08 am

          They are themselves terrorists, indiscriminately torturing, maming and killing innocent people.

    • Lisa Bloomquist December 1, 2015 at 2:50 pm Reply

      Hi Marcal,

      I am so, so, so, so sorry for everything that you’re going through! To start out with pelvic pain, and end up where you are, is horrifying. It is also bizarre and unthinkable and wrong. This shouldn’t happen.

      Know that you are not alone. There are people on this site, and on the facebook support groups, who understand what it is like to have a bomb go off in your body and mind. They know what it is like to have your sense of self stolen. They “get it.” They can help you through.

      The stories on this site are from people who have been through the horror of FQ toxicity, and they have recovered. I hope that their stories give you hope that recovery is possible and I hope that I will someday be able to add your recovery story to this site.

      There is also lots of good advice in the stories and comments. The Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Solution has helped many people, and I hope that it helps you too! As Linda mentioned, IV therapy can also be helpful.

      It’s a difficult journey, for sure. Know that you are not alone and try to believe that it will get better. It will.


      • Marçal William December 1, 2015 at 4:16 pm Reply

        Hello Lisa,
        Thank so much for solidarity. My situation is quite complicated. But I keep fighting. I also hope that I can heal. I’ve done an infusion of Glutathione. Has not yet made greater effects. But I will keep trying.


        Marçal William.

  16. Dann December 1, 2015 at 2:20 pm Reply

    Hello all, 6 months out from Cipro. My anxiety is out of this world. And now my shoulder will start to spasm randomly. My hands when I hold them up and try to keep still are extremely shaky! Its almost like a weird vibrating sensation. My hands and legs go tingly or numb very easily. Its very unsettling I hate not being in control of my mind and body. My lips and skin are very dry. I thought with time things would disappear not get worse. If anyone has any suggestions for supplements or anything, please let me know. I am currently talking 250 mg magnesium at bedtime as it makes me sleepy.

    • Lisa Bloomquist December 1, 2015 at 2:56 pm Reply

      Hi Dann,

      I suggest that you take a look at Ruth’s story, and all the comments on it for suggestions of supplements to help you with anxiety and your other symptoms. https://floxiehope.com/ruths-story-cipro-toxicity/. I also wrote this about fluoroquinolone-induced anxiety – https://floxiehope.com/2015/06/22/treating-fluoroquinolone-anxiety/. Though I obviously think that the longecity link is helpful, I think that some of the things that they recommend against can be useful. For example, I took Kava during a time of intense anxiety and it helped. It’s only for short-term use and you should keep that in mind as you take Kava or other supplements that affect GABA receptors. They can help, but don’t become dependent on them.

      Getting as much magnesium into your body, in as many forms as possible, may help. It is recommended that you get your kidney function tested before doing this, because if your kidneys aren’t healthy, you can do damage to them with too much supplementation. Overall, more floxies have been helped by magnesium than hurt by it. Just be aware and be careful.

      Meditation helped me immensely and I recommend it.

      Hang in there. It will get better.


      • Lucy Sky December 6, 2015 at 10:53 am Reply


        Do you know if lyric attacks the Gaba receptors ?


    • Lucy Sky December 9, 2015 at 11:50 am Reply

      I may have suggested this previously. If so I apologise. Have you had any thyroid screening and antibody tests done? These stinking fluroquinolones attack he thyroid gland.

      Also be very wary of being prescribed the latest massive money spinner for our friends at Big Pharma namely LYRICA and Neurontin. These drugs cause extremely serious side effects.
      To hit back at Big Pharma refuse all drugs. What else can we do.

    • Lucy Sky December 9, 2015 at 11:52 am Reply

      Meant to mention that your signs and symptoms remind me of those of a thyroid disorder.

  17. Lisa Bloomquist December 2, 2015 at 11:06 am Reply

    For those with breathing difficulties, this article is interesting – http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/howard/howard-magazine/ph-mg-ho-salt-sanctuary-maryland-20150930-story.html Something to look into. 🙂

    • Linda December 2, 2015 at 11:55 am Reply

      I had actually heard of salt caves years ago, for asthma. (Being claustrophobic the thought of any “cave” is difficult) but I did try a salt pipe. Can’t say it did anything for me. I also have purchased salt lamps. Not sure if they are strong enough for help breathing, but they are supposed to add negative ions to the air (an adjunct to “earthing”) and the glow they give off is so pretty.

      • Tom Marsella, Fresno December 2, 2015 at 1:44 pm Reply

        Doc had me on 2 inhalers for asthma and trace of COPD. Went to Hymalayan salt pipe and salt lamp by bed and living room and don’t use inhalers hardly at all. Maybe twice a year due to dirty air in San Joaquin Valley. Plus use of Product B herbal blend.

        • Linda December 6, 2015 at 3:07 pm

          That’s great! Yeah, the air in Fresno is not great for lung problems.

      • Marçal William December 4, 2015 at 11:04 am Reply

        Hello Linda, unfortunately I’m not afford to do all treatments at the same time. I’m going slowly. The important thing is to stop not score. Every day I do something to get rid of these symptoms.

        • Linda December 6, 2015 at 3:10 pm

          Yes I have been devastated financially. How screwed up is our “healthcare” system that treatments that help and don’t hurt are not covered, but those that mask symptoms and injure, are.

  18. Mike December 2, 2015 at 11:34 am Reply

    I am going for a glutathione injection tomorrow. My Dr. doesn’t offer the vitamin C injections, only a meyers. I remember that some people have said stay away from calcium (which is in a meyers along with vitamin C) I’ve also seen some floxed that have gotten meyers and improved. Any thoughts on this? I might just wait until I can get a pure vitamin C injection.

    • Linda December 2, 2015 at 11:58 am Reply

      Great Mike! As for vitamin C, for high doses you would need testing first anyway. However, the Myers has a fair amount of the C in it anyway. I wouldn’t worry about the calcium (wasn’t aware it was in there). The myers also has a lot of magnesium, which is great for floxies and well as B vitamins so good for nerve damage. Plus it is great for the immune system. I am still getting Myers once a month or so.

    • Bob December 5, 2015 at 4:53 pm Reply

      My first glutathion iv helped me greatly.

      • Lucero Rojas December 5, 2015 at 7:08 pm Reply

        Hi Bob

        Happy to hear you first glutathione iv went well. I am doing Myers without the calcium and vitamins b. Just the vitamin C w mangnesium. That’s what I have been doing for the past 2 months and a half. For the first week I did the ivs twice a week now I only do them once a week. But also use ancient minerals cream and oil everyday. I want to try the glutathione push but I am scare tk have a bad reaction to it.



  19. Mike December 2, 2015 at 12:52 pm Reply

    What kind of testing for Vit C?

    • Linda December 2, 2015 at 4:34 pm Reply

      There is a small percentage of the population that cannot get high dose vitamin C. The (blood) test is called G6PD

  20. Mike December 2, 2015 at 12:54 pm Reply

    Marcal, did you take the brand or generic Cipro?

  21. Mike December 3, 2015 at 9:36 am Reply

    I’ve never had anemia and all of my g6pd genes are negative (normal) on my 23and me results. I should be good to go.

    • Linda December 3, 2015 at 9:39 am Reply

      Good news….the Vitamin C is great for many things, esp collagen repair

  22. Tricia December 4, 2015 at 10:25 am Reply

    you might have already mentioned this in one of your posts so I apologize in advance, but is Borax and boric acid the same thing? and how long is one supposed to supplement w borax? So far I’ve been doing the 1/8tsp per day. I feel as though most of my pain has left my legs and feet and his migrated to my back, spine 😦

    • Jason December 4, 2015 at 12:37 pm Reply

      Hi Tricia. Glad to hear about legs, sorry about back. 😦 Borax can cause a little “Herx” effect in some people when starting on it, usually this will pass, hopefully that is all this is

      Please see the last page, and start with my post on November 19, 2015 at 12:29 pm in reply to Mike, then there were 6 follow up posts as well. Also, not sure if you seen these but on last page again please see my very long reply to you on November 21, 2015 at 8:48 pm, and then the one short follow up right after. (you can use to the Internet Browser’s “search the page” feature to easily find these)

      I am pretty sure someone is NOT supposed to take Boric Acid, I think it is a poison, and a quick search would seem to confirm this. Only Borax (source of Boron), or Boron itself (or both is what I did, and still do).

      I think I learnt about it from the Earth Clinic where MANY natural Health cures are discussed, and in the case of Fluoride, Arthritis etc Borax/Boron is one of the top recommendations.

      Here is another link (some last page too) to 18 pages worth of discussion, here you’ll find some info and see how people are using it, for what, and in some cases for how long etc


      How long will be highly variable for sure for each person, I still use it 10 months later even though I am ~95% healed, not all the time but often to try and counter my Fluoride intake from Showers, and Candida that likes to prop up in me from time to time. My joints were destroyed from Cipro, as was my Collagen in general in tendons etc; they are now better than they were pre-Cipro by quite a bit

      Inflammation is a HUGE issue for Collagen, thus Joints, Arthritis, Tendons, etc, really for the whole body, and Cipro causes huge amounts of it. If the Gut is imbalanced it starts here and spreads to the rest of the body (see my replies to Mike Teeter above), it also strips the body of Minerals which make the body (unhealthy in general) Acidic, Acidity is one main cause inflammation, etc. So to properly combat all of this, someone needs to: (to do a PILE of things, here are a couple big ones) Heal their Gut if it is not, try and stick to anti-inflammatory foods, alkaline foods (often the same thing), and remineralize their body just for starters. Gluten, Dairy, Sugar are the big 3 that have to be eliminated, along with many other things to give the body a fighting chance to heal. This is why you can see some people say, “I took Borax but it never healed me”, etc (substitute “X supplement” with Borax) Healing from a complex injury like what Cipro does, or even just Arthritis w/o Cipro requires a multi-prong approach for the best chance of success, all “Root Causes” need to be addressed.

      Here is what happens to a LOT of Floxies in my estimation (not saying this is you, but I think this is important so I want to repeat it here):

      – Cipro Destroys Good Bacteria, toxins wreak havoc, oxidative stress, inflammation, multiple damages occur etc
      – Cipro Strips Body of Minerals, makes body VERY acidic and deficiencies cause issues, inflammation ensues, when chronic it can do damage and damaged tissues don’t heal
      – Candida develops
      – Inflammation from Gut that spreads to entire body
      – Possibly Leaky Gut develops, and “Leaky Brain” (BBB)
      – People that don’t correct these things, have a lot of trouble healing, especially if Diet is not adjusted according
      – Arthritis Develops
      – Brain Fog
      – Chronic Fatigue
      – Fibomalygia
      – Tons of other problems, some “unseen” until they get worse later….(Chronic inflammation is a VERY bad place to be, I know too well)

      There is a LOT more to it than that, there is DNA damage, Mitochrondria damage etc etc, BUT, the above things are one aspect where I see a lot of people suffering in my estimation, and where very concrete things can be done to help.

      • Jason December 6, 2015 at 12:17 am Reply

        I want to note here again, the importance of AVOIDING HEAT as much as possible for anyone with Inflammation issues, and doing cold water treatments. Having HOT Showers and/or Baths is going to promote MORE inflammation, conversely, trying to stick to warm water only, and ending in COLD water will help chill the inflammation fire out, literally. Someone can also dip the affected parts (if arms, lower legs, feet etc) into a cold water sink, with ice if wanted, to again help alleviate some of the Inflammation. This strategy combined with a proper anti-inflammatory diet and even some supplements like Fish Oil can work wonders for some people, it did me.

  23. Stephanie December 6, 2015 at 12:37 am Reply

    Can leaky gut cause wierd ulcers to form that are normally seen in colitis patients?

    • Jason December 6, 2015 at 1:23 am Reply

      HI Stephanie, Doctor Mercola thinks so:


      “Most often, leaky gut syndrome is associated with inflammatory bowel diseases like Crohn’s and ulcerative colitis, or celiac disease, but even healthy people can have varying degrees of intestinal permeability leading to a wide variety of health symptoms — and this can be influenced heavily by the foods you choose to eat.”

      • Stephanie December 6, 2015 at 9:04 am Reply

        Do you know no one else has been able to figure out my stomach issues which caused me to get floxed. The original er dr who gave me flagyl and Levaquin together was a dick and used air quotes when I went in for stomach pain he said “tummy ach” they saw all this stuff in my intestines assumed it was diverticulitis and went crazy giving me antibiotics. Three doctors did that and I kept saying is that I feel worse. Then they did the colonoscopy and my gi dr found an ulcer and two pre cancerous polyps removed the polyps and biopsied the ulcer he said I can’t explain why you have an ulcer it’s only in people with colitis. Great job ass. I have had stomach issues my whole life. People always say why are you always complaining your stomach hurts it can’t hurt all of the time. Yes it does. Lol

        • Jason January 12, 2016 at 11:01 am

          Here is a good article showing the importance of some different stool testing to getting to the bottom of Gut issues, like Ulcerative Colitis and more


        • Terry January 13, 2016 at 2:47 pm

          I sent you a message but, I don’t believe you read it. Not that it’s a big deal but, the conversation you were having on the other site, is with a scientist who’s speciality is nutrition.

    • Jason December 6, 2015 at 1:39 am Reply

      Here is a pretty good LONG informative article, though the treatment section leaves a LOT to be desired, and I don’t think it properly lists all the causes here and for things like Leaky Gut etc either, but I recommend everyone read it all, lots of important info


      Some quotes:

      “There are three primary reasons for rotting food persisting in the digestive tract:

      1. We kill our friendly bacteria
      2. Acidification of the body decreases enzyme production
      3. Mucoid plaque in the intestinal lining halts peristalsis

      So probiotics (friendly bacteria) are extremely important. The whole key is balance. Problem is, our friendly bacteria are constantly being killed off. How? Same culprits as cited in the ALLERGIES chapter:

      – Antibiotics we take,
      – antibiotics given to the animals whose meat we eat,
      – antacids, like Zantac, Tagamet, Prilosec, etc.,
      – NSAIDs, like Advil, Tylenol, Excedrin, Motrin, etc.
      – other prescription and over the counter medications
      – white sugar
      – carbonated drinks
      – antihistamines
      – chlorinated water
      – fluoridated water
      – coffee
      – other toxins

      (ME => not a full list)

      Without friendly probiotics, the final stage of digestion can’t take place in the colon. Debris rots in there. Opportunistic bacteria and Candida albicans start taking over. Bernard Jensen, on the relation between the bad bacteria and the undigested food

      Candida albicans, the opportunistic yeast, can be both a cause and a result of Leaky Gut Syndrome. Once Candida gets a foothold in the gut, it puts down “roots” through the gut wall, causing openings through which large molecules and toxins can leak. Candida cells can themselves be introduced into the bloodstream in this same fashion.


      This is a bit technical, It involves pH. That means acid/base balance. You know, like soap is basic or alkaline, and oranges are acidic. Now in the body certain places only operate correctly if they’re at exactly the right pH. The stomach lining for example has to be alkaline in order to counteract the acidic digestive enzymes. Otherwise we’d constantly be burning holes in the stomach lining. All phases of digestion are totally dependent upon a delicate acid/base balance.

      The problem is, most foods in the Standard American Diet – Big Mac, fries, coke, pizza, etc. are acid-forming. That means they lower the pH of the body: too acid. The balance is disrupted: many enzymes can’t operate. Digestion is inhibited: food sits there and rots.”

    • Jason December 6, 2015 at 1:53 am Reply


      Apparently it might be possible for either, to cause the other:

      “Common Causes of Leaky Gut, Crohn’s disease or Ulcerative Colitis”

      “Leaky Gut and the Connection to Autoimmune Disease

      Leaky gut syndrome is almost always associated with autoimmune disease. In fact, reversing symptoms of autoimmune disease depends on healing the lining of the gastrointestinal tract. Any other treatment is just symptom suppression. An autoimmune disease is defined as one in which the immune system makes antibodies against its own tissues.

      Diseases in this category include lupus, alopecia areata, rheumatoid arthritis, polymyalgia rheumatica, multiple sclerosis, fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue syndrome, Sjogren’s syndrome (dry eyes & dry mouth), vitiligo, thyroiditis, vasculitis, Crohn’s disease, ulcerative colitis, urticaria (hives), type 1 diabetes and Raynaud’s syndrome.”

      Let’s repeat this part, because it is key IMO and I noted as much above somewhere:

      “Leaky gut syndrome is almost always associated with autoimmune disease. In fact, reversing symptoms of autoimmune disease depends on healing the lining of the gastrointestinal tract. Any other treatment is just symptom suppression.”

      Any other treatment is just Symptom Suppression, EXACTLY what I said above, that all MD’s would do for this, if they treat it at all, drugs for symptoms, nothing about the Root Causes, thanks Docs, for the toxic concoctions… (Why a ND is better in many cases)

      • Stephanie December 6, 2015 at 10:25 am Reply

        So true although I don’t think many know about leaky gut. Thank you very much.

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 5:49 pm

          Very welcome Steph. Sorry to hear you are also a long time Gut issue sufferer, and have also basically had your time wasted by Doctors, who unfortunately also ended up making you very ill (this happens much more than most people realize, I read something the other day that Western Medicine in general was the #3 cause of death, behind Heart Attacks I think and don’t remember the other, probably Cancer. Sad thing is #1 and #2 are often ALSO caused by #3, proving Walter Last’s theory that WM is the true #1….)

        • Stephanie December 6, 2015 at 8:39 pm

          Thanks Jason,
          Yeah western medicine totally causes both of those. I’m just tired I’m really just spent emotionally mentally and physically tired. It’s become a 50/50 shot if my boy friend can understand me when I talk. There are days like today where inside I want to go for a walk I look on Facebook and see active people and I can’t do any of it. It all was stolen from us. I get to say I made it when I walk up 10 stairs to my apartment with my boyfriend behind me in case I fall. I’m so sick of this crap. I’m sick of this for everyone. We all got screwed because we were all trained go to these freaking doctors they know what they are doing. BS BS BS. Everyone of us have been jerked around and then charged. I’m sorry for being a downer I’m just so weak and tired. I gain weight and barely eat. I try not to even eat anymore. I miss pre floxie life. I know it could always be worse. But there are days where I just hate it

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 8:57 pm

          I hear you Steph I really really do, I have been fighting for 30 years, so I know suffering even if it wasn’t “horrible suffering” like these can cause. I have fought through on and off 30 years of: Anxiety, depression, chronic heartburn, chronic Diarrhea, chronic Gut issues, Chronic Brain Fog, chronic inflammation, Chronic Fatigue, Chronic Adrenal Fatigue, Chronic a whole bunch of other stuff but maybe most importantly CHRONIC FRUSTRATION and ANGER!!!!

          I know this sounds cliche, but hang in there Steph it will get better! You are a fighter, you fought back once and were doing better, and you will get there again I am sure. It sounds like you have a good Doctor and support, so this is key for sure. Please don’t avoid eating, this will not be good for healing in my opinion, eating very selectively can help heal for sure, of course if there are Gut issues those are a top priority, lots of info on this page now to talk to your Doctor about.

        • Stephanie December 6, 2015 at 9:17 pm

          Thank you Jason I took notes to tell my doctor about. I am making a pack for him to look at thought it would be better that way cause I get so dizzy. I just seriously have had stomach issues for like 20yrs given so much crap for it then one arrogant doctor who didn’t know what he was looking at messed my life up. I just am sick of the whole drug industry. I’m just scared because I did fight back to health and now I’m just getting worse everyday. I am a fighter but it’s hard really hard and expensive. I hate depending on others I hate feeling like a sympathy case. Its not pride it’s enjoying the small things like going to a store and not feeling like curling into a ball because your holding on for dear life to the cart while assholes are coming into the store not letting me walk out when it’s obvious that I have issues. I remember when I was healthy I always helped others who looked like they need it.

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 9:15 pm

          Steph where are you in the USA? Given the severity of your Gut issues, which undoubtedly is causing your Flox journey to be worse IMO, maybe think about doing what Mike is doing if you can afford it (but maybe you can’t afford NOT too…) going to the Cleveland Clinic, I would bet Mr. Hyman would help you get to the root of your Gut issues and help heal them.

        • Stephanie December 6, 2015 at 11:16 pm

          Hi Jason,
          Thank you so much but I live in Washington state I’m on 60% of my pay and cannot work due to spasms where my eyes roll in the back of my head and turrets along with constantly being tired. Is there any way that doctor can contact my ND? I had to save up money to keep just to travel to so cal soon to finish my divorce. It’s all just a mess. I think my ND would be open to talking with him. I just cannot afford to go to Cleveland. Do you think he would talk to my ND?

        • Bob December 7, 2015 at 10:15 pm

          Washington state is very progressive. You should be able to find a functional medicine doctor there and they may be covered by insurance. Dr. Hyman is very expensive and he does a lot of tests.

        • Jason December 7, 2015 at 12:18 am

          Hi Steph damn I see you are very far, in fact I am not that far being in Toronto Canada, and I am sure there is at least one species living in my Gut, that shouldn’t be hmmm (and probably many more, I’m feeling pretty good these days but my Gut is not quite right I don’t think, and the more I think about it, the more I want to eradicate whatever the hell is in there…)

          I think its possible, I’m sure Mr. Hyman is extremely busy but maybe if your N.D. reaches out to him to let him know your extreme Gut issues, Mr. Hyman could at least let your Doctor know the proper tests that should be carried out, and maybe even then the relative treatment options. Hopefully your ND could also read up on all this if they not aware of some of the Root Causes, Treatments etc and help you heal from this very important issue.

        • Jason December 7, 2015 at 12:26 am

          Steph you may even want to look into whether or not Washington has the equivalent type Clinic, or at least a Functional Medicine Doctor who also specializes in the Gut (not sure if you have talked Gut with your ND, I imagine you did though), Gut health is so important, really one of the most important aspects IMO it is pivotal to many things in the body as all the info on this page would show, and there is much much more too. Either way someone other than regular MD’s who is very schooled or specialized in the Gut, knows what the Root causes are and how to identify them, and uses Supplements not Drugs, should be very helpful for you.

        • Stephanie December 7, 2015 at 12:48 am

          Thank you Jason I will reach out to my ND and see if he can reach out to him. I have been to two stomach Drs one just gave me a ton of antibiotics and then freaked out when I stopped going to him. The other one who did the colonoscopy was like oh I don’t know what that ulcer is that seems odd but good news it’s not cancer good luck with that. So I am scared of going to a stomach specialist. I am scared to spend money on another western medical dr that will just mess me up. I’m just going to mention this all to my ND. Thank you so so much for all of the information. It’s giving me hope that this is part of what’s wrong with me and probably has been for years. This is kind of gross but do you get the chills after you have a bowl movement? I do really bad sometimes I wrap myself in a blanket and curl up into a ball cause it hurts so bad. All I’ve heard is oh that’s strange and oh when I press hard on you intestines they seem really inflamed. They shouldn’t be this hot odd have a nice day. Stupid doctors with their stupid pills. I swear you know more than a lot of the doctors I have been to. 😜 That’s why I love my ND he always tells the truth.

        • Jason December 7, 2015 at 9:42 am

          Yes regular Doctors are a complete waste of time for anything other than mechanical or complete organ failure, a broken bone or bleeding to death, thus I have not studied those things since its about all they are good at, and have “useful” knowledge about. Practically everything else, which are all the most common ailments, diseases, prevention etc, they are truly useless for, and thus where I have spent my time studying “useful” information, like true ways to heal root causes, and what they are etc. So I believe you are right in your knowledge assessment at least when it comes to “useful knowledge” that truly heals, and sometimes I seem to know more on some things than the ND’s do.

          So note I am not suggesting a “regular” Stomach Specialist, I have been to those too, and for things like mechanical failure, and in your case the polyps and Ulcers they had some use, however that use is likely now over for them. Naturopaths should be aware of most of the stuff on this page, at minimum Candida, Leaky Gut, what the common root causes are and how to treat them, maybe I wrong here but I don’t think so, this seems like some of the most basic knowledge when it comes to Gut Health. However for something like Ulcerative colitis which it seems like you may have, or something similar to it, again I think in this type of case a Functional Medicine Doctor (not an Allopathic or Western Doctor!) might actually be the most useful, at least a good knowledgeable one who will choose Natural ways to heal and Supplements where possible, and that possibility is there almost all the time (Some Naturopaths ‘might’ even be up to speed on some of these kinds of Digestive Disorders but they don’t have the Diagnostic Equipment, etc that the F.M. Doctor does). See my reply to Bob below on December 6, 2015 at 8:41 pm if you have not on why a F.M Doctor is different than a “Regular” Doctor, so a F.M Doctor who also Specializes in Gut Health would be an amazing find for you I think.

          I do not get those “Chills” (Important Symptom for sure, sounds like Fever likely because your body is fighting off possibly infection of some sort), however I sometimes I get really tired after, usually though I generally feel better. I did a little reading on Ulcerative colitis, and have done a LOT of reading on other related conditions and they all have many things in common, including Inflammation, as I guess one person mentioned to you. My “quick advice” other than finding out and addressing the true Root Causes is to avoid all the common triggers mentioned on this page, eat Anti-inflammatory and get enough Fiber, and if you can tolerate them take some Anti-inflammatory Supplements like good quality Fish Oil, Probiotics, EFA’s, Turmeric, etc. You can also take some other basic things that are very healing to the Gut mentioned in some of my posts here as well; at least doing some of these things should help it to heal a little and hopefully not get worse before you get to address it specifically with hopefully an Expert of some kind. Given everything you have now said about your Gut, the pain etc this in my opinion is top priority for you and can help you heal from a lot of the Cipro related crap, likely your last downcycle irritated the Gut too. Keep the faith Steph ALL these kinds of things can be healed, just like the Cipro crap!!!

        • Stephanie December 7, 2015 at 3:30 pm

          Hi Jason,
          Thank you thank you thank you!!! I will look into one by me. Western doctors should be called injury fixers lmao😜

        • Jason December 7, 2015 at 1:19 pm

          Hi again Steph. I just found something in Walter Last’s book “Heal Yourself The Natural Way” and wanted to share it with you, some very helpful info here for many people, possible Links to Lucy’s Thyroid condition, Ulcerative colitis for you, the arthritis Links again, etc Gut is so critical:

          “Lack of energy, digestive disturbances, arthritic joint pains, skin disease, menstrual problems, emotional instability, and depression are all symptoms of what I call the antibiotic syndrome. This is a condition that has greatly increased in incidence in recent years and, on further examination, more symptoms of this syndrome may be discovered. In this condition, most of the gastrointestinal tract is tender when pressed on the body’s surface, especially the small intestine, liver, and gallbladder. There may have been a gallbladder operation that failed to improve the condition, sometimes worsening the symptoms. As part of this syndrome, there could be a history of thrush or oral, anal, or vaginal itching. When these are present, the diagnosis of Candida overgrowth is obvious, but it may also be present in the absence of these manifestations, and that can be confusing.

          The fungus Candida albicans thrives during antibiotic treatment and I regard it as reckless negligence to prescribe antibiotics without simultaneous fungicides and replacement therapy with lactobacilli afterwards. I believe that this practice has greatly added to the numbers in our chronically sick population. However, the antibiotic syndrome is not just due to Candida. I regard it more generally as a dysbiosis in which the wrong kind of microbes inhabit the intestinal tract; it’s not just Candida and other fungi, but many types of pathogenic bacteria including E. coli bacteria, which are normal in the colon but become disease-forming when they move into the small intestine.

          If the problem has existed for years, there is usually a lack of gastric acid, which then allows the stomach to be colonized by microbes, causing inflammation with pain and, later, ulcers. The toxins released by the microbial overpopulation cause chronic inflammation of the liver, gallbladder, pancreas, and intestines. This can have other health repercussions. I regard it as likely that a chronic inflammation of the pancreas is a major contributing factor in the development of insulin-dependent diabetes.

          Bacterial Attack: Specific types of pathogenic bacteria appear to cause or contribute to specific autoimmune diseases. One variety of coliform bacteria, for instance, produces a molecule very similar to insulin. When the immune system becomes activated against this molecule, it may then also attack related features at the beta cells of the pancreas. Another type of bacteria, Yersinia enterocolitica, induces an immune response that attacks the thyroid gland and leads to Grave’s disease with a serious overproduction of thyroid hormones.

          Ulcerative colitis is linked to overgrowth of pathogenic microbes, as are Crohn’s disease and ankylosing spondylitis. In ankylosing spondylitis, the vertebrae of the spine fuse together, causing stiffness and pain. Other joints may in time become affected. Klebsiella, another type of pathogenic bacteria, produces a molecule that is similar to a tissue type found in people with this disease. When Klebsiella numbers in the gut decrease, related antibodies in the blood decrease and the condition improves.

          Rheumatoid arthritis is linked to a bacteria called Proteus. Proteus is also a common cause of urinary tract infections. Women suffer urinary tract infections as well as rheumatoid arthritis twice as often as men, while men usually have higher levels of Klebsiella and three times more ankylosing spondylitis than women have. In addition, microbial overgrowth damages the intestinal wall so that only partly digested food particles can pass into the bloodstream, causing allergies. In this way, it appears that all autoimmune diseases can be linked to dysfunctional intestines and food allergies.

          Other autoimmune diseases that have so far been linked to intestinal dysbiosis are psoriasis, lupus erythematosus, and pancreatitis. When remedies are given that bind bacterial endotoxins, these conditions usually improve. A further consequence of dysbiosis is susceptibility to food poisoning, as with Salmonella bacteria; in contrast, a healthy intestinal flora prevents these from multiplying and causing trouble.

          In summary, in the 1940’s, Candida overgrowth was found in only three percent of bodies autopsied, but now the figure is nearer 30 percent. There are, of course, other factors that can cause dysbiosis – the contraceptive pill, steroids and other drugs, radiation treatment, chemotherapy – but the main culprit is without doubt antibiotics.”

        • Linda December 7, 2015 at 1:57 pm

          I don’t think I have that problem, but out of curiosity I tried looking up what can bind bacterial endotoxins and found little, except for one 1940s study with smilax sarsparilla and another said honey…..

        • Stephanie December 7, 2015 at 3:40 pm

          Very helpful thank you so much

        • Bruce December 7, 2015 at 3:59 pm

          I found this ND in Memphis, Dr. Bradley Freeza. Website is ahe4life.com. I’m going to pay him a visit and see what he says.

        • Stephanie December 7, 2015 at 4:05 pm

          Let me know how it goes fingers crossed.

    • Jason December 6, 2015 at 2:44 am Reply

      Here’s a bunch of info from someone who has been evaluating patients for Leaky Gut Syndrome for over twenty years:


      “Conditions that Can Signal Leaky Gut Syndrome:

      several types of arthritis
      pain in multiple joints
      a chronic skin condition
      chronic fatigue syndrome or fibromyalgia
      inflammatory and infectious bowel diseases
      chronic liver disease
      pancreatic disease
      chronic diarrhea or abdominal pain,
      chronic depression
      general malaise
      a feeling of being infected but your doctor can’t find the infection

      (not a full list, and you don’t need all of them of course to signal you have it)

      Recent research from Belgium confirms my observations about Leaky Gut Syndrome and chronic fatigue syndrome and suggests a treatment plan that can alleviate chronic fatigue and also major depression (2, 3, 4). The Belgian researchers found that people in their study with either chronic fatigue syndrome or major depressive disorder showed laboratory evidence of Leaky Gut Syndrome, when compared to a healthy control group. More importantly, they demonstrated that treatment with diet and specific nutrients not only reversed laboratory signs of the Leaky Gut Syndrome, but also improved symptoms of fatigue, malaise and depression (5). ”

      Once again folks ALL drugs are toxic:

      “Leaky Gut Syndrome can also be caused by the treatment for another disease. In rheumatoid arthritis, for example, the drugs used to relieve pain and inflammation can damage the intestinal lining, leading to Leaky Gut Syndrome within two weeks.”


      Note he links to another informative article of his in this article, called, “Leaky Gut Syndromes: Breaking the Vicious Cycle” where he lists 150+ references, and includes some good info like this (where he somewhat stresses treating the root causes [often infection] diet, and then supplements as adjuncts only):

      “Many naturally occurring substances help repair the intestinal mucosal surface or support the liver when stressed by enteric toxins. Basic vitamin and mineral supplementation should include all the B vitamins, retinol, ascorbate, tocopherol, zinc, selenium, molybdenum, manganese, and magnesium. More specialized nutritional, glandular and herbal therapies are considered below. These should not be used as primary therapies. Avoidance of enterotoxic drugs, treatment of intestinal infection or dysbiosis, and an allergy elimination diet of high nutrient density that is appropriate for the individual patient are the primary treatment strategies for the Leaky Gut Syndromes. The recommendations that follow are to be used as adjuncts:

      Epidermal Growth Factor
      Saccharomyces boulardii
      Lactobacillus caseii var GG
      Essential fatty acids
      Gamma oryzanol
      N-acetyl- glucosamine”

      • Lucy Sky December 6, 2015 at 7:42 am Reply

        Hi Jason again
        I just came across this link and thought you may be interested in it.


        I haven’t read it yet but it is to do with bacteria in the brain and communicating like neurones!!
        Hugs and best wishes

      • Jason January 15, 2016 at 8:50 pm Reply

        Here is a very important study showing the connection of Gut to Brain and how Gut affects GABA in a big way, heal your Gut Floxies and many things will get better:


        Big long study there here is the intro:

        γ-Aminobutyric acid (GABA) is the main inhibitory neurotransmitter in the body and hence GABA-mediated neurotransmission regulates many physiological functions, including those in the gastrointestinal (GI) tract. GABA is located throughout the GI tract and is found in enteric nerves as well as in endocrine-like cells, implicating GABA as both a neurotransmitter and an endocrine mediator influencing GI function. GABA mediates its effects via GABA receptors which are either ionotropic GABAA or metabotropic GABAB. The latter which respond to the agonist baclofen have been least characterized, however accumulating data suggest that they play a key role in GI function in health and disease. Like GABA, GABAB receptors have been detected throughout the gut of several species in the enteric nervous system, muscle, epithelial layers as well as on endocrine-like cells. Such widespread distribution of this metabotropic GABA receptor is consistent with its significant modulatory role over intestinal motility, gastric emptying, gastric acid secretion, transient lower esophageal sphincter relaxation and visceral sensation of painful colonic stimuli. More intriguing findings, the mechanisms underlying which have yet to be determined, suggest GABAB receptors inhibit GI carcinogenesis and tumor growth. Therefore, the diversity of GI functions regulated by GABAB receptors makes it a potentially useful target in the treatment of several GI disorders. In light of the development of novel compounds such as peripherally acting GABAB receptor agonists, positive allosteric modulators of the GABAB receptor and GABA producing enteric bacteria, we review and summarize current knowledge on the function of GABAB receptors within the GI tract.

        • Jason January 15, 2016 at 8:51 pm

          More about Gut, Gaba & Serotonin:


          Gut bacteria significantly influences the communication between the brain and the gut. When the gut is full of healthy bacteria, it has the potential to regulate mood and positive feelings. Beneficial bacteria in the gut will increase GABA receptors in the brain to alleviate mood disorders like chronic depression. (<=ME – Anxiety, Insomnia, etc)

          Scientists have discovered in the past several decades that there is direct communication between the brain and the gastrointestinal tract. In fact, 90% of the serotonin produced in the body is found in the gut, a neurotransmitter responsible for regulating appetite, mood, sleep, and relaxation.

          This is from a Mercola article on same topic:

          In short, the probiotic Lactobacillus rhamnosus had a marked effect on GABA levels in certain brain regions and lowered the stress-induced hormone corticosterone, resulting in reduced anxiety- and depression-related behavior. When they severed the vagus nerve, GABA receptor levels and the animals' behavior remained unchanged after treatment with L. rhamnosus, confirming that the vagus nerve is most likely the primary pathway of communication between the bacteria in the gut and your brain.

  24. Lucy Sky December 6, 2015 at 6:31 am Reply

    Hi Jason
    Hope that you do not mind my writing to you to say wow another excellent posting from you.

    Many years ago as a teenager I was very ill with parathyphii B. I have a medical report to substantiate this which I can send to Lisa.

    I was treated with chloramphenicol.

    My gut/body has never been the same since and I blame the paratyphoid for my ill health except for the occasion when I was floxed 2 years or more ago.

    I was wondering what drugs you are referring to that are enterotoxic.

    I know about the steroids , the NSAIDS, pantoprazole,the antibiotics of course!! However I wondered what other drugs come under the umbrella of enterotoxic.
    I was wondering what you had for your breakfast, lunch and evening meal and what snacks you have.
    I am intolerant to corn, wheat, gluten, amaranth, aspartame, cow and almond milk, soy,


    • Jason December 6, 2015 at 6:47 pm Reply

      Hi Lucy. You know I was a little worried about posting that article just because I figured someone might focus in somewhat on these particular drugs (I was going to put something in my post about it!) I really don’t see too much info about them on Internet in quick search like a list or anything, Wikipedia has some info about them, Wiki is a terrible source for information generally but can suffice here a little. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enterotoxin

      I think more important that his VERY narrow focus on that one drug, is the list from another source I quoted above:

      “So probiotics (friendly bacteria) are extremely important. The whole key is balance. Problem is, our friendly bacteria are constantly being killed off. How? Same culprits as cited in the ALLERGIES chapter:

      – Antibiotics we take,
      – antibiotics given to the animals whose meat we eat,
      – antacids, like Zantac, Tagamet, Prilosec, etc.,
      – NSAIDs, like Advil, Tylenol, Excedrin, Motrin, etc.
      – other prescription and over the counter medications
      – white sugar
      – carbonated drinks
      – antihistamines
      – chlorinated water
      – fluoridated water
      – coffee
      – other toxins”

      So while some of these might not be quite as bad as those drugs, some of them are, and by Definition it would seem to me that Antibiotics are enterotoxic drugs since they affect the GI system.

      Well I put a long post above about Diet I hope you seen it. I am really not a good example I have had to cut out so many things due to Brain Fog that I am sure is unnecessary for many. I basically Eat Paleo, at least that is the closest description probably to my own diet. NO bad stuff, no Sugar, Dairy, No Wheat/Gluten and limited other Grains, No processed foods (though I cheat a little, to my own detriment). No Caffeine, drugs (B.P concoctions), Alcohol, etc, very limited restaurant visits, you eventually find some “safer” ones you don’t react too, and learn to stick to them.

      So what does that really leave? As I told Terry, “not much”. Sad really.

      I eat some a little fruits, lots of veggies, organic eggs, and organic chicken, occasional Fish. Really that is the bulk of my own extremely limited diet, and it is lacking in some areas like Proteins, and Fats (lots of Vitamins and Minerals). There are proteins there, and I do eat Organic Beef once in awhile, and I do eat some Sunflower Seeds, Nuts (to my detriment, Lectins…) Coconut Oil, Olive Oil, Butter (Butter and Eggs are two Dairy things I can tolerate, and are “mostly” Healthy), so I am getting some Fats and Proteins, just not int he percentages I should be probably.

      I can’t tell you how often I am hungry, look around the house for something to eat, and there is NOTHING quick and easy to eat, this is the reality w/o processed foods, though some fruits and veggies, nuts, very low sugar protein bars (most are sickly high), Unsweetened Coconut Milk with homemade Granola Cereal, these things suffice but there is NO WHERE NEAR enough variety in my diet. IF I HAD A COOK, I know I could eat healthy and like a King, but having to make everything homemade and do it myself, well it just doesn’t happen as much as it should unfortunately. Oh, I have now found Yeast-Free Gluten-Free bread, it isn’t very good, expensive as hell, and the loaf is small and barely suitable for sandwiches, but I do eat a lot of Tomato Sandwiches. (I have become intolerant to Yeast due to it stimulating Candida).

      • Jason December 6, 2015 at 6:48 pm Reply

        Here is a quick list of DO’s and DONT’s for Paleo

        Click to access Paleo-Diet-Food-List-PDF.pdf

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 7:00 pm

          Here is close to a 200 page guide

          Click to access paleo%20cookbook.pdf

          Note that I am not saying Paleo is necessarily the best way to go for Floxies, it works for some, but it depends again on the state of the GI tract, and if Candida and Leaky Gut are issues then most if not all fruits are NOT a good idea as I posted about a few times already. (and many other factors come into play, allergies, etc)

          Generally I think Paleo is one of the healthiest ways of eating out there, and for people that have their Gut healed, a good way to eat generally IMO. However, some recommend a crazy amount of Meats, which is NOT balanced and like so many things in life balance is so important, and IMO diet is one of them. I think generally speaking in my opinion again the Wahl Protocol is a good way to eat too, which IIRC is generally Paleo, and I think she puts the balance into perspective. I don’t remember what percentages she recomends, but I think it is something like 50% veggies and fruits, 30% Protein, and 20% Fats. I could be off here on what she recommends (been awhile since I read her excellent book), but essentially those percentages are what I feel make a good diet (but I am NO expert here!)

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 7:10 pm

          I should not that 188 page guide has a TON of recipes in it, like this homemade “no-Oatmeal” which is very similar to something I eat:

          1 small handful of walnuts
          1 small handful of pecans
          2 tablespoons ground flax seed
          1/2 –1 teaspoon ground cinnamon
          1 pinch of ground nutmeg
          1 pinch ground ginger
          1 tablespoon almond butter
          1 banana, mashed
          3 eggs
          1/4 cup unsweetened almond milk (add more if you prefer it
          a little runny)
          2 teaspoons pumpkin seeds
          1 handful of goji berries or fresh berries

          The only differences in my own, are:

          I add in Hot Water
          I add Oatbran (not oatmeal, which I can react too)
          I add Quinoa “Flakes”
          I add Coconut Oil
          I add Protein Powder
          I use Coconut Milk not Almond Milk
          I add a little Stevia
          Sometimes I add a little pure Cacao or Pure Vanilla
          No Banana
          No Eggs

          Also, I NEVER use a Microwave, and believe no once else should either

          Oh I think it mentioned it somewhere but JIC I eat Quinoa and Brown RIce for Grains, you have to be careful with Brown Rice though much of it is highly contaminated with Arsenic, and my Hair Test shows I am excreting Arsenic at a somewhat elevated level so I limit it.

        • Terry December 6, 2015 at 7:15 pm

          Jason, I like the oatmeal idea! I wonder if wild rice is ok. Not the commercially grown from California. But, the rice from the Native Americans. I have a couple of bags to use up.

        • Jason December 6, 2015 at 7:59 pm

          Hi Terry. I hope you download the188 page book above and find more ideas, its a free book afterall! (well, I found a free source, at least…)

          I love Wild Rice myself, and should probably eat more of it. It seems EVERY damn food has pitfalls, even some of the healthiest ones like Spinach and Kale, which floored me when I recently learnt about the Goitrogens (there is a lot of controversy about this currently, many say they are not an issue, yet many people get tired after eating them in a shake, go figure, me included)

          Whatever the Cons are for Wild Rice, my bet is that they are outweighed by the Pros, however this article may disagree with that somewhat:


          “Gluten-free” has become a synonym for “health food” on grocery store shelves, but gluten is far from the only reason for avoiding grains. Pseudograins and non-gluten cereal grains like corn and rice do still contain several other chemical compounds that can cause serious digestive and immune problems.”

          Lectins are special proteins that exist in many types of foods. Only certain types of lectins are toxic – unfortunately, the lectins in grains and pseudograins fall into this group. Gluten is the best-known lectin, but far from the only one: non-gluten grains contain other lectins that many people react poorly to. Lectins disrupt your digestive process, and contribute to leaky gut syndrome, because your gut doesn’t realize that they aren’t simple sugars. This prompts the cells in your gut to pass the lectins through your intestinal wall into your bloodstream, which causes inflammation and can also provoke your body into an autoimmune response.”

          Saponins are another problematic element of pseudograins and seeds – like lectins, these compounds are designed to protect the seed so it can survive to pass on the plant’s genetic line. Like lectins, saponins also contribute to leaky gut syndrome by damaging the enterocytes, the cells that line your gut and control what passes in and out of it. Many foods contain saponins, and some might even be helpful (small amounts of saponins in fruits and vegetables may help you absorb the nutrients), but pseudograins contain too high a dose of saponins for your gut to handle.

          Protease inhibitors are the seed’s last line of defense: even if it does get swallowed, these compounds will prevent your digestive enzymes from properly breaking down the proteins in the seed. Unfortunately, they also prevent you from breaking down the proteins from everything else in your gut at the time. Protease inhibitors are especially damaging to the pancreas, which produces the digestive enzymes that they neutralize. Chronic consumption of protease inhibitors can cause the pancreas to swell and eventually become cancerous.

          Phytic acid. Also found in nuts, phytic acid is a compound that humans can’t digest: essentially, it binds to the minerals in the food and prevents us from absorbing them. No matter how impressive a food’s Nutrition Facts panel looks, none of those nutrients will do you any good if the phytic acid in the food is preventing your body from using them. Phytic acid can also interfere with digestive enzymes and otherwise irritate your gut.


          GOOD GRIEF RIGHT!!! I mean, once you get into this, there is next to NOTHING left to eat!!! We just have to use some common sense, and balance, and keep away from the worst possible offenders for the issues that we EACH have, so variable person to person.

          Oh there is a little good news there too, proper preparation is thought to often reduce a lot of the potential toxic effects to many foods, including these, Kale, etc

          “As detailed above, pseudograins certainly have their drawbacks. Nevertheless, proper preparation methods can minimize their antinutrient content. The Weston A. Price Foundation details how to prepare grains according to traditional methods, which maximize nutritional availability while reducing the phytate/phytic acid and content by activating an enzyme called phytase. This enzyme is why cows and other ruminants have no trouble eating grains: they produce it naturally. Humans, on the other hand, have to introduce it through special preparation methods. These methods include germinating or sprouting grains, roasting them, and soaking them in an acidic medium (water with a splash of vinegar or lemon juice works well). The best solution is traditional sourdough fermentation – when done properly, this can eliminate phytates almost completely.”

          I’ve read Lectins can be somewhat removed by “soaking”, like with Nuts etc (though when I tried it, I ended up with “Moldy Nuts”, oh, great that is better thanks…but really there must be a good way to do it its mentioned all the time)

          I do eat a little white rice (restaurants), brown rice and brown rice flour, and Wild Rice, but maybe it is to my own detriment (I do think Wild Rice is the best of the bunch, but I could be missing something). Whether someone should eat it or not is dependent on some important factors and their goals, and where they are in those goals. I am feeling pretty good these days so I eat it, but if I still had an active Leaky Gut I would not (and who knows, maybe I do have a little LG probably, its very common unfortunately, and my Gut is one of the biggest problems I’ve had, and to some degree still have, its still not “right”)

  25. Daniela December 6, 2015 at 11:11 am Reply

    Delta Airlines WARNING:
    No wheelchairs were provided to ANYONE at a major airport this week, with employees saying it’s like that all the time. Quote: “Ha, no one’s going to help you here.” Not the holiday weekend, low season between the holidays, perfect weather. People were forced to run to catch missed connections and encouraged by staff to blame and berate the elderly and the disabled for being in their way. Holding area full of the elderly, people with babies, disabled, who could not run the gauntlet and jump the hoops. Again, employees confirmed that it’s like this all the time. We went through this on a number of consecutive days, thinking each time was a one off, but the same experience was repeated.

    Some of you will probably say you had wonderful experiences but just because it didn’t happen to you doesn’t mean it doesn’t to others. It also didn’t happen to me but I have a little bit of empathy for my fellow human beings.

  26. Linda December 6, 2015 at 11:17 am Reply

    Just want to throw this out there. Again, first, I have to say, I am not an attorney, and as a paralegal I cannot by law give legal advice. I also believe our society in general is too litigious. Having said that though, I want to suggest, especially for those of us who took a generic and through some legal nonsense are unable to sue for our injuries—go after the doctors and pharmacies. Was there “informed consent?” Did your doctor advise you of the black box warnings and other major side effects? Did the pharmacy explain the same to you? Were you given a steroid at the same time?

    I think if enough physicians were sued, they might eventually realize that they have been fed a load of crap by big pharma, and the doctors themselves might actually grow a pair and take on big pharma themselves.

    I was unable to get an attorney to take my case in CA because in the 1970s they proposed laws that make it difficult if not impossible to sue doctors and hospitals, including a cap on what you can collect. So I am going on alone. It is daunting, and not something I would recommend without assistance of some kind, but at the very least, the doctor and pharmacy are now on notice of what they have done through their negligence.

  27. Michael Teeter December 6, 2015 at 4:40 pm Reply

    Hello again everyone,
    I had a real good day today. I have not felt this good in a long time. I hope it is a sign of good things to come. Doing some new things. They want to send me to Cleveland Clinic soon. Functional medicine coupled with some other stuff.


    • Laura December 6, 2015 at 6:32 pm Reply

      R u from the Cleveland area? Have u seen anyone from the ccf functional medicine before?

    • Bob December 6, 2015 at 7:41 pm Reply

      Michael, If you go to the Cleveland Clinic for functional medicine you will probably see Dr. Mark Hyman. He has become quite well known. My daughter is seeing him for celiac and auto immune. He is a good doctor.

      • Jason December 6, 2015 at 8:41 pm Reply

        VERY knowledgeable Doctor indeed, and the Director of the Cleveland Clinic Center, I’ve read a lot of his articles.

        Even though he is a MD officially, something I generally loathe, because he is in Functional Medicine the MD title is more of a backdrop. The great thing about Functional Medicine in Hymans’ own words,

        “FUNCTIONAL MEDICINE is the future of conventional medicine–available now. It seeks to identify and address the root causes of disease, and views the body as one integrated system, not a collection of independent organs divided up by medical specialties. It treats the whole system, not just the symptoms.”

        Root causes! There it is again. Apparently they will still use drugs though in some cases, but they also use botanical medicines and supplements. (Hyman is big on supplements from everything I have read, can’t recall him even mentioning drugs)

        Functional, Integrative, and Naturopathic are all somewhat similar, and in their focus on prevention through nutrition, diet, and exercise, will use things like Supplements, promote Detox, etc which is all a BIG leap away from traditional Western Medicine practices for the most part.

        I think Mike will be in good hands indeed, here is one such article he wrote:


        Nine Steps to Treating Autoimmune Disease

        – Check for hidden infections — yeast, viruses, bacteria, Lyme, etc. — with the help of a doctor, and treat them.
        – Check for hidden food allergens with IgG food testing or just try The UltraSimple Diet, which is designed to eliminate most food allergens.
        – Get tested for celiac disease, which is a blood test that any doctor can do.
        – Get checked for heavy metal toxicity. Mercury and other metals can cause autoimmunity.
        – Fix your gut. For details, see my blog on irritable bowel syndrome.
        – Use nutrients such as fish oil, vitamin C, vitamin D, and probiotics to help calm your immune response naturally.
        – Exercise regularly — it’s a natural anti-inflammatory.
        – Practice deep relaxation like yoga, deep breathing, biofeedback, or massage, because stress worsens the immune response.
        – Tell your doctor about Functional Medicine and encourage him or her to get trained


        And from another similar article he wrote, a couple more additions:

        “Eat a whole food, anti-inflammatory diet. Focus on anti-inflammatory foods including wild fish and other sources of omega-3 fats, red and purple berries (these are rich in polyphenols), dark green leafy vegetables, orange sweet potatoes, and nuts. Add anti-inflammatory herbs, including turmeric (a source of curcumin), ginger, and rosemary, to your diet daily. Eliminate inflammatory foods such as refined, omega-6, and inflammatory oils, including corn, soy, and safflower oils.

        Fix your gut. About 60 percent of your immune system lies right under the single-cell-layer lining of your gut. If this surface breaks down, your immune system will get activated and start reacting to foods, toxins, and bugs in your gut. The easiest way to begin healing your gut involves eating a whole food, anti-inflammatory diet and removing gluten and other food sensitivities.

        Sleep for 8 hours every night. The research is clear: Lack of sleep or poor sleep damages your metabolism, causes cravings for sugar and carbs, makes you eat more, and drives up your risk of numerous conditions from diabesity to autoimmune disease. Getting enough sleep and sleeping well are essential for vibrant health and reversing inflammation. ”

        How about that, TRUE healing techniques. Let’s hope Functional Medicine starts putting a dent into Allopathic Medicine, which usually harms people not heal them

  28. Marie December 6, 2015 at 4:55 pm Reply

    I was given Cipro for appendicitis in 2000 and have never been the same. I had tendonitis in every tendon. I started off with indomethacin; then switched to Vioxx and quit it because it gave me insomnia and constipation; then Celebrex; then ibuprofen; then Naprosyn. I have tried repeatedly to go off painkillers but then all my tendons from elbows to fingertips and knees to toes feel like they’re on fire. Eventually I recovered somewhat and was fairly functional by 2010; but in 2012 all my “new” tendon cells died out and it took a couple of years for them to be replaced. A few weeks ago I flunked a liver enzyme blood test (score of 74 for ALT) so I have stopped the Naprosyn and feel like I’m on fire.

    I believe that the reason I was susceptible to Cipro is because I have two genetic defects of the kidney: I throw out too much potassium and magnesium (Gitelman’s syndrome), and am subject to the salicylate-induced phosphate retention form of fibromyalgia as described by Dr R. Paul St Amand. As a result, I have highly alkaline blood chemistry, and the fluoro part of the fluoroquinolones were able to make it into my tendon cell nuclei and churn them into a pulp. I need to be very careful about my electrolyte balance and take potassium supplements three times a day, calcium at noon, magnesium morning and night. I need to avoid green tea because it’s high in fluoride and blows my electrolyte balance.

    Can I suggest: if you believe you have fibromyalgia, it is worthwhile trying to determine if you have the variety that responds to the no salicylate/guaifenesin protocol. In my case, and in the case of people with genetics similar to mine, when a salicylate ion attaches to a receptor site on the renal cell, it stops throwing away used phosphate produced in the Krebs cycle. The Krebs cycle screeches to a halt (“fatigue”) and the phosphate gets stowed away in various inappropriate places everywhere (“pain”). Salicylate is a natural plant antibiotic and is present in just about all plants except C.R.O.W.S: core rice oats wheat soy. The mint in my toothpaste was giving me fibromyalgia, because it is absorbed through the skin, gets in the blood, goes to the renal cells, and screws up phosphate elimination. FOR ME. Because I have the genes for this. I absolutely cannot use any aloe-containing lotion (soaps, etc.), herbal-extract- or salicylate-containing lotions (chap stick, ben gay, capsaicin, aspercream, sun block, witch hazel, Caladryl, any soap except Ivory, herbal shampoo, Listerine, dish soap, most cosmetics, sap from weeding in the garden without gloves, etc….). However if I manage to avoid all these things and clear out the salicylate, then guaifenesin corrects my renal function and I throw out the used phosphate.

    I started with the protocol in 2000 (found out about it while researching my cipro tendonitis problem!) and cannot begin to describe how well it works for me. My fibromyalgia only appears on the rare occasions when I accidently get aloe on my skin (e.g. ultrasound gel).

    If you have this version of fibromyalgia, then if you successfully follow the no salicylate / guaifenesin protocol, you will have a lot less pain (from THAT, anyway), and a lot more energy available to fight your other problems. Wish I knew what to do about the tendonitis, but knowing about the alkaline-blood connection may end up being a clue to why I was susceptible and what might be a direction to investigate for some relief.

    Also, thank you all for all your comments. The only way we’re going to get help is by sharing information with each other. My doctor two weeks ago said “I know all about fibromyalgia” when I was trying to tell her why I take guai – doctorspeak for “shut up and stop bothering me”. Great.

    • Linda December 6, 2015 at 5:21 pm Reply

      …and THAT’S when I became determined to never seek allopathic care again, unless absolutely necessary (eg car accident.) Glad you were able to figure out your problem. I am going to ask someone with similar “joints on fire” side effects to read your post. Thanks.

  29. Lucy Sky December 6, 2015 at 4:58 pm Reply

    Hi Mike
    That’s great!
    It is very encouraging news indeed and proves that this ‘thing’ can be overcome.

  30. Debbie Leyhew December 6, 2015 at 8:30 pm Reply

    Has anyone used therapeutic grade essential oils to ease the symptoms of this poisoning? It would seem that frankincense would support healing or the neuro systems. Also, Deep Blue has been incredible in easing back and joint pain. I take very few Alleve now, and use an allergy blend of lemon, peppermint, and lavender oils for allergies. No more antihistamines, Benadryl, etc. The oils are able to pass through cell walls to promote healing!

    • Lucy Sky December 7, 2015 at 5:45 am Reply

      I was wondering the same myself .
      Someone mentioned using essential oils but I don’t know if they are classed as therapeutic grade or not.
      What signs and symptoms are you having? My tendons are quite painful today.

    • laura December 7, 2015 at 6:22 am Reply


      I have been looking into using essential oils. Do you have any information on what you use, how u use it, etc? My only symptom left is pain in my ankles/feet. Please let me know as any information you have on essential oils would be helpful as I need some guidance. thanks.

  31. Jason December 7, 2015 at 10:26 am Reply


    This guy is a BIG advocate of Alkaline eating, Water, and their role in reducing Inflammation

    Here are some quick eating tips, DO’s and DONT’s from him, and how to help reduce Inflammation which can help a LOT of people on just this Floxie Hope page alone:


    • Jason December 7, 2015 at 10:29 am Reply

      A handy Alkaline Acidity chart PDF people can download:

      Click to access acid-alkaline-food-chart-1.1.pdf

      • Stephanie December 7, 2015 at 3:37 pm Reply

        Thank you this is soooo helpful. Where is apple cider vinegar on this list? I’m sending it to friends to help them too. You rock!!

        • Jason December 7, 2015 at 4:39 pm

          Very welcome, and good question, IMO it should always be mentioned, its very healing to the body in many ways (one of the most popular items for home remedies, along with Coconut Oil), and similar to Lemons where an acidic formula actually Alkalizes the body once it is inside.

          I should note here too that by Alkalizing one’s body, they have a good chance to reduce some pain, and vice versa, an Acidic Diet can easily make pain worse (and I can personally attest to this, like most things I post, I don’t just research this stuff I have LIVED it).

          Here are some quick tips I shared with someone recently to help anyone with pain (especially if their diet is part of the cause and/or acidity) This is not a pain “cure” by any stretch (unless of course that is the only issue) but many people find it helps with a lot of different things, pain included. (Alkalizing is an important strategy against Cancer as well for example)

          Apple Cider Vinegar – Braggs – You can fill a glass with an 2 inches of water, add 3 TBSP’s of ACV, and drink 20 mins before eating, noted to help with digestion AND acidity (some acid things make body more alkaline)

          Aluminum free Baking Soda – You can mix this with ACV (watch it, it will fizz alot) or just put 1/2 TSP into a glass of water and drink this in the morning. This is a temporary fix because it raises Sodium levels and can potentially unbalance Minerals in the body and cause other issues (For me I get Insomnia when I do this too often) so Lemons and Vinegar are better longer term IMO, but this can bring fairly quick relief for some and speed up the process.

          Lemon Water – Every morning you can squeeze the juice of half or one organic lemon into glass of water and drink. MANY benefits from this (liver detox, alkalizes, minerals, etc). You can mix Baking Soda with it if wanted, will fizz again.

          Lemon Chlorophyll Water – Chloropyll has MANY benefits again, what I do is drink this every 5 days or so, or after cheating on diet and starting to feel crappy. Here is what I do: Squeeze juice of 2 lemons and 1 Lime into emptry 2 liter bottle, add 2 pinches Himalayan Sea Salt, 2 pinches Borax, 2 or 3 TBSP Chlorophyll. Drink thoroughout the day

        • Stephanie December 7, 2015 at 4:53 pm

          Great info Jason!!! Thank you I am going to get some lemons on my daily store run. It’s my special outside time. Hahahahaha you’re amazing.

    • Jason December 7, 2015 at 10:32 am Reply

      An 86 page PDF of Alkaline eating including a BUNCH of recipes:

      Click to access alkaline-food-chart-4.0.pdf

    • Jason December 7, 2015 at 10:46 am Reply

      And finally from him this informative Video, showing how and why many Diseases start in the first place, and why the GUT is pivotal to a lot of them.


      He is selling a program at the end of that video, so anyone not interested can ignore the last 10 mins or so, and note I have not bought any of his programs so have no idea of the value or quality of them. What I do know is he shares good information, like in the links above and in this video


      In my opinion Chronic Inflammation is a part of many Diseases today, and is also something a LOT of Floxies are suffering from. Diet once again is pivotal here, and eating Alkaline is generally very similar to eating Anti-inflammatory (and is anti-inflammatory)

      • Jason December 7, 2015 at 11:17 am Reply

        I should note here that he is promoting a “Cleanse” program in that video, especially in the last 20 mins or so. There is a lot of good info in that video which is the only reason I posted it, and I just want to note that a “Cleanse” may not be a good idea for many Floxies, a lot of variables here need to be considered

  32. F December 7, 2015 at 8:11 pm Reply

    Somebody please tell me this neuropathy will go away. I am 8 months out and that is all I have is PN. It’s not getting better. My Neurologist says it won’t go away. I can’t live the rest of my life like this or worse. I joined a Small Fiber Neuropathy Chat on Facebook and there are many there that got it from Fluroquinolones. Many are in bad shape and have had it for years! How do I keep going! I have read everything I can on it and it all says it doesn’t go away. I am sorry. This is supposed to be a place of hope. Forgive me! I can’t live life like this!

    • Bob December 7, 2015 at 10:30 pm Reply

      F. I have the PN also and I am 30 months out. It is now worse than ever. I feel like you do much of the time but i KNOW everything can heal. Don’t listen to doctors. They know nothing about this. Nerves can regenerate. I am determined to find a way.

      • Stephanie December 8, 2015 at 10:21 am Reply

        I have it too and my ND says everything can heal. That some nerves regenerate after 7yrs. Keep up the IVs keep up the faith I’m 11months into this. It’s hard I know but you have to stay positive. We are all allowed poopy days where we feel upset and sad. But we need to go back to a positive state to heal. You need that mind set to heal. Please don’t lose hope. We are all here for each other

        • jwinn December 8, 2015 at 11:12 am

          Peter, I am almost 6 years into this. I started to get better, and had a severe relapse a little over a year ago. I have no idea what caused my relapse. I understand how discouraging and depressing it can be. I don’t even like looking at myself in the mirror, because it reminds me of how much I have aged from being floxed. I, too, wonder many days…’What’s the use of living life like this? I am not living, I am only existing…” However, I do know that I am better than I was a year ago. That is a positive that must remind myself of daily. As Lisa said in one of her posts, try to not compare yourself to who you were before being floxed. Try to take baby steps forward from where you are now…even though it may not be a very good place at the moment. Unfortunately, we may never be the people we were before being floxed. I used to travel the world and drive for hours just to enjoy the scenery and sunlight of the day…..I used to enjoy the company of many friends. I no longer do these things. I don’t know if I will ever do these things again. But, I do pray and hope each day that I WILL do these things again! I pray that your body will heal as well, and that you, too, will enjoy life again! That is my prayer and hope for us ALL!

        • Bruce December 8, 2015 at 12:30 pm

          Thanks jwinn!!! I pray every day for the floxie victims that they will not hurt and that they will heal.

    • Linda December 7, 2015 at 11:04 pm Reply

      F—and my neurologist said I was delusional. So, I’m with Bob. Don’t listen to the Dr. In fact, I would find a good naturopath. What has helped me as I have posted before was IVs, esp phosphatydilcholine (got 20 of those) and they are esp good for nerve damage. you might also try PEMF (Pulsed electromagnetic field therapy.) Sadly, none of this is usually covered by insurance—I am way in debt, but what is the alternative? What area are you in? Someone maybe could suggest an ND.

    • Jason December 8, 2015 at 12:08 am Reply

      It seems to be one of the longer lasting symptoms for many people, and indeed can be hard to heal, both similar to Tinnitus in those ways, but people can and do heal for either. I’ve posted some things in the past on PN, supplements, tips etc, and how it may be tied to Myelin Sheath Damage and Degeneration (and how important Methylation might be for some people not healing). Now I find this interesting article:


      A couple of quotes:

      “Degeneration of the Myelin Sheath is a chronic inflammatory autoimmune process of the central nervous system that affects the brain, spinal cord and optic nerve. In this process, the immune system attacks the covering of the nerves, called the myelin sheath. Consequently, the sheaths are damaged, and the damaged areas develop scarring that leads to either distorted communication or lack of communication between the nerve endings.

      Symptoms of myelin sheath degeneration depend on what part of the nerves have experienced demyelination. The most common symptoms or MS are listed here below. Keep in mind that toxic heavy metals like mercury and lead (which do cross the blood/brain barrier) can cause the same type of symptoms as associated with multiple sclerosis. See our page Is it Multiple Sclerosis or is it Toxic Metals?

      Episodes of dizziness
      Loss of balance and coordination
      Increased reflexes
      Eye problems such as blurred or double vision
      Feelings of tingling or numbness, especially in the extremities
      Extreme fatigue
      Loss of arm, hand or leg strength
      Difficulty speaking and slurred speech
      Muscle tremors
      Muscle stiffness
      Problems with thinking, concentration, memory and judgment”


      Geez anyone noticing a common thread here? Chronic inflammatory & autoimmune again.

      I wouldn’t have thought at first dizziness would be tied to the Sheath, but as it says I guess it all depends where the nerves have been damaged, and we know the drug gets right into the Brain and CNS. So it is talking about Degeneration, since in “normal” people who have not yet taken Cipro or been damaged from it, this is likely how most damage would develop, through Degeneration over time. With Cipro, you get to turbo charge the process in many cases, Geez thanks Bayer.

      So once again, Gut, Inflammation, Diet, likely critical here, and in your case Bob you already know you had/have trouble there. Let’s remember too Dr. Wahl cured herself of incurable M.S. largely through Diet, good story that one.

      • Jason December 8, 2015 at 12:16 am Reply

        Renee had PN in hands and feet (and a whole bunch of other crap), and got to 95/100% better, largely by following what Dr. Wahl did before her, a targeted diet.

        Here is her story, and I recommend anyone interested in the “Wahl Protocol” watch the 20 minute Terry Wahl TEDx video at the end of her story, where she gives the short version of her own story, and some details on how she healed.


        I also HIGHLY recommend her book, “The Wahls Protocol: A Radical New Way to Treat All Chronic Autoimmune Conditions Using Paleo Principles”, which has a LOT of great information in it not just on MS or Diet, but on a lot of other important stuff like Detox info, Supplements, etc, etc

      • Jason December 8, 2015 at 12:23 am Reply


        “Some peripheral neuropathies are due to damage to the axons (the long, threadlike portion of the nerve cell), while others are due to damage to the myelin sheath, the fatty protein that coats and insulates the axon. Peripheral neuropathies may also be caused by a combination of both axonal damage and demyelination

        Autoimmune diseases, in which the immune system attacks the body’s own tissues, can lead to nerve damage. Sjogren’s syndrome, lupus, and rheumatoid arthritis are among the autoimmune diseases that can be associated with peripheral neuropathy. When the tissue surrounding nerves becomes inflamed, the inflammation can spread directly into nerve fibers. Over time, these chronic autoimmune conditions can destroy joints, organs, and connective tissues, making nerve fibers more vulnerable to compression injuries and entrapment. Chronic conditions may alternate between remission and relapse. Acute inflammatory demyelinating neuropathy, better known as Guillain- Barré syndrome, can damage motor, sensory, and autonomic nerve fibers.

        Most people recover from this autoimmune syndrome although severe cases can be life threatening. Chronic inflammatory demyelinating polyneuropathy (CIDP) usually damages sensory and motor nerves, leaving autonomic nerves intact. Multifocal motor neuropathy is a form of inflammatory neuropathy that affects motor nerves exclusively. It may be chronic or acute.”

        Bunch of other info and root causes there too

        • Jason December 8, 2015 at 12:49 am

          Steph, Lucy, Tricia, Daniela, anyone else with multiples of those symptoms in either of those posts, I hope you all also see these posts, and really I doubt there is anyone on this page “immune” from the Gut issues now discussed all over this page (punn intended 🙂 )

          I think I have now conveyed the critical importance of all this; the what and how, and how it can cause many Cipro symptoms on its own, and most of those things its tied too, how it can prevent people from healing, what can be done, and some of the other points I wanted to make starting back from the first post in reply to Michael near the top of the page. I wish and pray for good healing to all of you

        • Stephanie December 8, 2015 at 10:15 am

          Thank you Jason!!!! Thank you so much

        • Jason February 5, 2016 at 9:22 pm

          I should post one more IMPORTANT thing on this page, well actually 2.

          First, people can try a product called “Colostrum”, I forgot about this product and read about years ago, seems somewhat similar to Kefir which is also supposed to be good, but I think Colostrum might be even stronger. Joanne is currently using it here and getting amazing results, it is a strong Candida killer that ALSO heals Leaky Gut.

          Second, some people, like myself, that have used too many “Drugs” in the past, especially Antibiotics, might have killed off just too many GOOD Bacteria over the years. I know this is true for me, my Immune system was never very strong, and when I would get sick enough to be suffering a lot and not healing (as usual) I would go to the Doctor and get Antibiotics, because, well that is what we were taught, Antibiotics are what you take to kill the “BAD” guys, only the F#*^ing arseholes NEVER TOLD US IT ALSO KILLS OFF THE GOOD GUYS.

          WHY this is important, is because despite someone’s best efforts, they might have a LOT of trouble healing if too many “good guys” are dead. Like me, you might even have success for some time, but then eventually “regress” again. I have killed off Candida numerous times, healed my Gut, only to have it come back again, and I have had SIBO on and off for as long as I can remember. One way to know if too many good guys are dead, besides taking too many drugs esp antibiotics, is if you have a weak immune system, takes you 2 weeks to fight off common cold etc. This is actually setting you up for disease, your Immune system is what protects you, and 80% of it IS IN YOUR GUT.

          So what to do then? FECAL MATTER TRANSPLANT. Yes its gross, BUT, its FREE if you do it at home, and people are getting MIRACULOUS RESULTS! People suffering for years and years with CFS, FIBO, ARTHRITIS, every damn thing you can think of, they do the FMT, and THEY HEAL! WHY, because it heals the GUT! It puts WAY MORE good bacteria back then any Probiotics can do. The important thing is to find a good healthy donor who has used MINIMAL drugs and antibiotics. For me, and others like me of which I know there are many here because Cipro quite literally destroys the GUT, I think this will be the only way I can get my full health back, I’ve been taking high quality Probiotics for years, and while they help, they can’t compare to FMT.

        • Linda February 5, 2016 at 9:49 pm

          He lives! (hadn’t seen your name in a while. glad to see you are alive and kicking.) And I think I heard something about fecal “capsules.”

        • Bruce Brannan February 6, 2016 at 7:21 am

          Yep he lives. Jason (AKA Wizard of Oz) is way over my head but I do read and appreciate his input. Also I do intend to ask for a new gut when I get to Oz.

        • Linda February 6, 2016 at 11:03 am

          Ditto. I’m also going to ask for a new right eye and something to stop the anxiety.

        • Jason February 6, 2016 at 10:03 am

          Now how did you guys find me…..seems you have some of your own Magic… 🙂

          The more I think about it, the more I think it is the only true answer for someone with a heavily damaged Gut, there is just no other way to get the good guys that are extinct back, and Science is finding out more every day just how critical all these are for the body, it really does seem they are tied to near everything in some way.

          Living with a heavily comprised Gut and Immune system, is no fun, let me tell you, after doing so for 30 years. I never knew most of that time, I only knew that “something was wrong”, where really I was “existing” not living (much like the Walking Dead), and I just never knew what that was. The sad part is there are thousands upon thousands of others like me, thanks to overuse of Antibiotics, all looking for answers, never usually finding one, sometimes finding things that help, only to regress again, and again and again. Something like just SIBO for example, is something where people can get it under control, but eventually relapse, and sometimes often. This was me I just never knew, and I am SOOOOO sick and tired of being sick and tired, even though I have been much better in the last 2 or 3 years than the 2 or 3 years before that, I think the FMT could just be the Silver Bullet to kill this Demon for good.

        • Jason February 6, 2016 at 6:49 pm


          In a pretty good book called, “The Good Gut”, there is a chapter called, “Eat shit & Live”. I’m not kidding, that is what it is called. I think people need to pay attention to this chapter to see the true gravity of the situation here that Floxies have found themselves in. This is going to be a LONG quote, because it is of CRITICAL importance, especially for those people who are having trouble healing. (and it includes a study of CIPRO damage to GUT)


          ANTIBIOTICS – THE INDISCRIMINATE KILLER – “Antibiotic” literally means “against life.”

          David Relman and Les Dethlefsen, two of our colleagues at Stanford University, were curious about what would happen to the microbiota after multiple rounds of the potent antibiotic ciprofloxacin (trade name CIPRO). Its mechanism of action is to inhibit a microbe’s ability to replicate its DNA, effectively keeping bacteria from proliferating. Because Cipro is broad spectrum, it is active against most types of bacteria, both infection-causing bacteria AND the friendly, mutualistic type living in the gut. David and Les wanted to determine how damaging a FIVE DAY course of Cipro would be to the microbiota, and whether it would fully recover.

          Microbial abundance and diversity in the test subjects’ guts PLUMMETED RAPIDLY upon starting antibiotics. There were TEN TO A HUNDRED TIMES LESS GUT BACTERIA after Cipro treatment, and the surviving community was MUCH less diverse than before. The microbiota was also significantly reorganized, with bacterial species that collectively made up 25 percent to 50 percent of the TOTAL organisms in the gut NEARLY WIPED OUT. These results should not be that surprising, although the scale of microbiota damage was even larger than many had feared it would be. Despite how critical our resident microbes are for health, there is still widespread (and often relaxed) use of broad-spectrum antibiotics, partly owing to the belief that the microbiota can regrow. But is the assumption that beneficial microbes can stage a comeback and repopulate correct? Not exactly. A few weeks after the Cipro treatment, one subject’s microbiota recovered to the pre-antibiotic state. The other two were not so resilient. One individual had a near complete recovery but still harbored visible antibiotic-induced damage. The third subject’s microbiota was struggling to regain its pre-antibiotic composition even two months after the Cipro treatment had ended.

          Many microbiotas have to endure multiple antibiotic exposures, often within a single year, so Relman and Dethlefsen tested what happens to these same individuals after a second round of Cipro. From the microbiota’s perspective, the damage was even more severe. Following the second course of antibiotics, again bacterial abundance decreased, the community shifted in composition, and diversity took a hit, just as it had after the first Cipro treatment. BUT this time none of the individuals escaped unharmed. All three test subjects had visible, LASTING Cipro-induced damage to their microbiota, even TWO MONTHS after the antibiotics were stopped. None of the study participants reported any gastrointestinal symptoms, despite the massive reorganization that was occurring in their gut. Clearly, symptoms are not a reliable gauge of how much damage the microbiota sustains from antibiotics. Much of this damage can take several weeks to repair and there are some species of bacteria that may never fully recover.


          Antibiotic use is one of the biggest risk factors for infection by C. difficile, a bacterial pathogen that can cause severe diarrhea and intestinal inflammation. Taking a round of antibiotics is like setting our microbial ecosystems ablaze. As in the aftermath of a forest fire, close inspection will show that while a few things survive, overall the landscape changes dramatically. After the fire, new seedlings that might not previously have had the space or resources to grow can now take hold. Some of these fledgling plants may be productive and healthy members of the rebuilding ecosystem, like mutualistic bacteria, but others may be invasive and detrimental, like pathogenic bacteria. C. difficile is responsible for the death of approximately fourteen thousand Americans each year; currently another ten times that number are battling C. difficile infections.

          Until recently, the treatment for recurrent C. difficile infection was more antibiotics—the equivalent of lighting a second forest fire. In 2013, a group of scientists and physicians at the Academic Medical Center in Amsterdam set out to test the idea that an infusion of beneficial bacteria could stop the vicious cycle of recurrent C. difficile infection. They performed a randomized, controlled clinical trial in which individuals with recurrent C. difficile infection were treated either with antibiotics alone or antibiotics followed by a fecal microbiota transplant (FMT), also known as bacteriotherapy or stool transplant. After a single FMT an astounding 81 percent of these recurrent infections were cured, compared to the 31 percent cure rate in the group that tried another round of antibiotics alone. A second FMT was performed on the remaining 19 percent of nonresponders and the overall cure rate climbed to 94 percent. This cure rate was so high that the researchers felt it was unethical to continue the study and abruptly terminated it and offered FMTs to all the participants.


          I think this info, read carefully, speaks for itself (those numbers are staggering), and the conclusion is pretty obvious too. As I mentioned before I do believe that some people’s GUT’s are probably too severely damaged to be helped by things like Probiotics, Kefir, Colostrum etc, but it does make sense I think to try these kinds of things first along with other Antifungals, clean strict diet etc.

        • Jason February 17, 2016 at 9:03 am

          I don’t think I have covered SIBO, another common Gut issue on this page and someone was just presenting symptoms of it so I should post some info here.

          IBS often has SIBO as a root cause, and can be common in people who’s Immune system (GUT) has been comprised by things like Antibiotics

          Here is one article on it to see if you think you might have it:


          There is some conflicting info online and even from different Experts on SIBO. Probiotics are NOT always helpful, some think they might help, others give a strict warning not to take them, IF someone thinks they have SIBO/IBS then I think not taking Probiotics until it is in remission is probably the safest thing to do.

          Like opinions, treatment recommendations vary too, many use Antibiotics and/or a combo of Herbal remedies, and of course a VERY strict diet, FODMAPS is probably the most important and commonly recommended one. SIBO can be notoriously hard to bring under control (and relapses are very common), even more so than Candida which is also a bastard (and both will cause a Leaky Gut which causes a massive amount of issues).

          The breath test for Sibo has a fair amount of reliability BUT is not definitive and will give false negatives, there is not definitive test but that is the best there is at the moment.

        • Jason February 17, 2016 at 9:03 am

          This site is a very good source of info for SIbo: http://www.siboinfo.com/herbal-antibiotics.html

        • Jason February 18, 2016 at 1:25 am

          I found a post online from someone who has done a bunch of research and it ties MANY things together really well and all relating to the GUT (he refers to IBS specifically because it was an IBS forum BUT it applies to many other things). I’m not completely sure of its total accuracy in every statement but many things are dead on for sure.

          Anyone that took Steroids with Cipro and had a severe reaction, extra GUT damage is almost surely why or a big part of it. Here is the post:

          MY IBS can effect my brain and my brain can effect my IBS. I have had this conversation with some of the worlds leading experts in IBS. Its physically not possible for gas to effect your brain, except through neurotransmission of nerve fibers in the digestive system. Its also how the system works. Its also what they are finding out in years and years of IBS research. FYI There are very complex connections to the gut and the brain and one part of this is the emotional motor system or Limbic system. This is also connected to the HPA axis or bodies stress system. The bodies stress system is also used to FIGHT INFECTION as well as the fight or flight responce. Constant activation of this system drains the body, like draining the batteries.”Emotion involves the entire nervous system, of course. But there are two parts of the nervous system that are especially significant: The limbic system and the autonomic nervous system.

          So the Limbic system (and Emotions) are connected to the autonomic nervous system that helps control digestion, heart rate and breathing among other things. This is one reason why emotions often effect digestion. Even subtle emotions.”The hypothalamus is one of the busiest parts of the brain, and is mainly concerned with homeostasis. Homeostasis is the process of returning something to some “set point.” It works like a thermostat: When your room gets too cold, the thermostat conveys that information to the furnace and turns it on. As your room warms up and the temperature gets beyond a certain point, it sends a signal that tells the furnace to turn off. The hypothalamus is responsible for regulating your hunger, thirst, response to pain, levels of pleasure, sexual satisfaction, anger and aggressive behavior, and more. It also regulates the functioning of the parasympathetic and sympathetic nervous systems, which in turn means it regulates things like pulse, blood pressure, breathing, and arousal in response to emotional circumstances. This is also one reason why a person can get hot and cold chills before an IBS attack as well as dilated pupils, increase heart rate and breathing etc..)

          The first is the autonomic nervous system. This allows the hypothalamus to have ultimate control of things like blood pressure, heart-rate, breathing, digestion, sweating, and all the sympathetic and parasympathetic functions. “Importantly it helps regulated “It also regulates the functioning of the parasympathetic and sympathetic nervous systems. This is how it breaks down: Central nervous system, The Autonomic Nervous System, The organs (the “viscera”) of our body, such as the heart, stomach and intestines, are regulated by a part of the nervous system called the autonomic nervous system (ANS). The ANS is part of the peripheral nervous system and it controls many organs and muscles within the body. In most situations, we are unaware of the workings of the ANS because it functions in an involuntary, reflexive manner. For example, we do not notice when blood vessels change size or when our heart beats faster. However, some people can be trained to control some functions of the ANS such as heart rate or blood pressure.

          The ANS is most important in two situations: 1. In emergencies that cause stress and require us to “fight” or take “flight” (run away) and 2. In non-emergencies that allow us to “rest” and “digest.”. The ANS is divided into three parts: The sympathetic nervous system, The parasympathetic nervous system and The enteric nervous system. The enteric nervous system is part of the autonomic nervous system and is often now called the “Gut Brain” and has 100 million neurons as many as the spinal cord, so note you have two brains: one in your head and another in your gut. This is really important in IBS and how some of it fits into IBS. This complex network of nerves lines the walls of the digestive tract form the esophagus all the way down to the colon. This little brain in the gut is connected to the big brain by the Vagus nerves, bundles of nerve fibers running from the GI tract to the head. All neurotransmitters, such as serotonin (ME => GABA, etc) that are found in the brain are also present in the gut. Dr Wood has discovered that this little-brain-in-the-gut has programs that are designed for our protection and which are very much like computer programs. They respond to perceived threats in the same way that the limbic system or the emotional brain does. So the threat of a gastrointestinal infection can activate the program that increases gut contractions in order to get rid of the infection. The symptoms are abdominal cramping and diarrhea.

          Also importantly there is a cell embedded in the gut wall that is directly connected to the HPA axis and the fight or flight. Dr. Wood has determined that the type of cell found in the body and the gut, called the Mast Cell, is a key to understanding the connection of the big brain in the head with the little-brain-in-the-gut. Mast cells are involved in defense of the body. In response to certain threats or triggers, such as pollen or infection, mast cells release chemicals, such as histamine, that help to fight off the invader. Histamine is one of the chemicals that causes the symptoms of an allergy or a cold. When an infection of the gut occurs, such as food poisoning or gastroenteritis, the mast cells of the gut release histamine. The little-brain-in-the-gut interprets the mast cell signal of histamine release as a threat and calls up a protective program designed to remove the threat at the expense of symptoms: abdominal pain and diarrhea. The brain to mast cell connection has a direct clinical relevance for irritable bowel syndrome and other functional gastrointestinal syndromes. It implies a mechanism for linking allostasis and the good stress response to irritable states (e.g., abdominal pain and diarrhea) of the gut. Mast cells can be activated to release histamine in response to perceived psychological stress, whether the stressor or trigger is consciously perceived or not.


          For anyone wanting to learn more about Mast Cell activation and why it is so important to Floxing, Lisa wrote up an article on it and I have added several comments at the bottom pertaining to it as well (This is now one of them):


        • Jason February 28, 2016 at 10:17 am

          IBS, SIBO, Candida and Leaky Gut

          More info on these there have been some questions coming up on all these


          This link does a fairly good job of trying to help distinguish between Candida and SIBO, they share many symptoms but have some distinct not always easy to discern differences, people should read through the link if they are confused. What the link does NOT do, is give full lists of symptoms however, Leaky Gut also shares many of these symptoms and has been outlined on this page, there is a link above somewhere for Candida symptoms (easy to find in google searches too), here is a VERY short list of IBS and SIBO symptoms from that website:

          SIBO Symptoms (Sibo is a bastard to treat because the diet needs to be even more strict than an already strict Candida diet):

          Abdominal pain and cramping
          Bloating and abdominal distension
          Diarrhea and/or constipation. (May alternate between the two or have one or the other.)
          Excessive gas (may smell like sulfur or ammonia)
          Excessive belching (may also smell like sulfur)
          Feeling full after just a few bites
          Acid reflux
          Headaches or migraines
          Joint and muscle pain
          Fatigue and/or weakness
          Steatorrhea (excess fat in stool)
          Histamine Intolerance

          Signs it might be Sibo and not Candida (though people can have both):

          more painful and symptoms in upper GI track can be severe
          psychological problems can be more broad and disruptive
          diet needs to be low in carbs, fruits, nuts.
          overall health of individual is more compromised
          symptoms are surrounded around the center of the stomach
          its noisy lots of gurgling moaning and squirting in mid section, Candida isn’t
          Acid reflux GERD, heart burn, indigestion and belching (lower in stomach near belly button).
          Gas originates in the upper abdomen
          plenty gas and it smells like sulfur or ammonia, very bad
          stool smells very foul as compared to candida only.
          dramatic improvement when antibiotics are taken
          symptoms get worse when taking a probiotic especially if it contains prebiotics.


          IBS is simply just how it sounds, an irritable (irritated) bowel, shows up like spastic butt, pains, Gas, etc, google it for a full list, its VERY similar to SIBO because it is just a “Symptom” where SIBO is the MOST common root cause. There are two types of IBS Characterized, IBS-D and IBS-C, one is Diarrhea and the other is Constipation, and unsurprisingly, there are two main types of SIBO, one is methane and the other hydrogen, and you guessed it one most often causes Diarrhea and the other Constipation.

          Candida symptom list is somewhere around a FIFTY to a HUNDRED, it causes massive amounts of issues, and gets especially nasty if it becomes systematic, which means it has spread body-wide. Again a quick google search will pull up many websites with piles of lists of these symptoms, from the Gut page I posted this link before which gives a very basic list of Candida Symptoms: http://www.thecandidadiet.com/candidasymptoms.htm

          Leaky Gut lots of info on this page and links to even more info, Expert opinions etc etc. Leaky Gut is also a Symptom that has a root cause, VERY often that is Candida or SIBO. Yet, Leaky Gut is ALSO a root cause itself to many things, and VERY often that is any number of Auto-Immune “Diseases”, where the body starts attacking itself due to all the “misplaced” inappropriate things floating around the Blood stream which I’ve been over, Arthritis, Sjögren’s, Lupus, MS etc etc many mimic Cipro Symptoms and by no accident IMO.

          WARNING – These “conditions” can be VERY subtle and insidious infections. You do NOT need to have many of the symptoms to have these conditions, and testing for them is sketchy at best with maybe SIBO being the more reliable test of the 3. This means sometimes Doctors (and patients) have to actually treat the symptoms, its not ideal, and resembles a failed Western Medicine model, but when testing is proven unreliable AND when other things have been ruled out this is resorted to at times. I can tell you that I “mis-diagnosed” myself many times for IBS and SIBO, because I had so few symptoms and most of the time they were relatively minor, or so I thought and I realized later that this has been a HUGE problem for me for a decade or more, intermittently, like a few months every year or two where I thought I was having trouble getting rid of a “food poisoning bug”, well I was 3/4 right, butt (see what I did there…lol) it turns out the “BUG” from food that is off can trigger a SIBO relapse, which explains why if my wife also got it she might be better in a week or less where I would still be having issues for months. AGAIN, these can be VERY SUBTLE, they fooled me, I knew I had Candida when I read off that list of symptoms (even though I only had about 10 out of 75 or so, in poking around further the 10 were some of the most common) but with only 3 or 4 SIBO symptoms that were seemingly often minor and would come and go, this was a tricky bastard to figure out, well of course I never fully dug into it like I should have, I did not have the “hallmark symptoms” and brushed it off and went on to the next probable cause, and that was a big mistake.

    • Lucy Sky December 9, 2015 at 11:39 am Reply

      Hi Jason , Steph, Linda, Tricia, Mike Daneila et al
      Re peripheral neuropathy.

      I have just read a book which may help to throw some insight into pain arising from the CNS etc.
      It is called called Back Disorders written by Professor Malcolm Jayson . Prof Jayson is a Professor of Rheumatology at a Back pain clinic in England.

      He advises about the importance of good posture , furniture, a supportive mattress etc.

      As the title indicates the book is aimed primarily at those with back disorders. However IMO it contains useful information for those affected by back pain as a result of neuropathic pain.

      AMONGST conventional treatments such as physiotherapy, exercise, acupuncture he recommends capiscium cream .

      I refuse to accept that nothing can be done about neuropathic pain!

      The body is a wonderful structure with great healing powers.

      How can anyone even a neurologist say that the neuropathy will not clear up? How does he or she know?
      Is it any wonder that we feel depressed when we are given statements like that from doctors. IMO the reason the dr is saying that is because it lets him off the hook for not exploring all avenues in order to effect or to try to effect an answer.
      what the dr is actually saying is ‘ I cannot cure you so don’t bother me.

      I know someone who had PN and managed to self diagnose the reason and treat it.

      In my case physio has helped. Also avoiding bending and sitting in a chair of the correct height.

      Vit B12 , magnesium, Vitamin D are advised to deal with muscular and nerve pain. The myelin sheath can rebuild.

      If we do nothing then nothing will be achieved. I personally am not prepared to give up .That is what Big Pharma wants. Obviously I will do the opposite to what these bully boys want and expect.

      So I intend to keep plodding on.

      Can I just mention here about alleged nerve pain analgesia.

      Everyone has the right to make their own decisions .
      However I intend to steer well clear of these drugs which incidentally are very, very expensive.

      Neurontin, lyrica and amyltryptilline.

      Each and everyone of them has very serious side effects indeed.

      For example loss of vision, muscle damage and wasting, suicidal ideation, suicide, severe depression. Calcium channel blockaging etc etc.

      The FDA has issued a warning about Lyrica as well.

      It made three billion dollars for Big Pharma one year.

      If you google Shame on You Ireland you will read a lot about the cover up job done in Ireland by a certain pharmaceutical Company.

  33. Peter December 8, 2015 at 5:41 am Reply

    So it’s been a month now of these sudden and random saliva problems and as usual with my life since the medicine, it’s only getting worse. I now have swelling under the tongue in what looks like the sublingual gland. My saliva still hasn’t returned and I still don’t know what caused it. It’s days like today where I question what’s the point anymore. This problem alone has reduced my sleep to a max of two hour intervals for some reason with miserable mouth dryness and bad breath through the night. With all the other issues that are ongoing and not getting resolved, my quality of life is depressing. I’m 2.5 years into this and I don’t see an end to the pain and problems in sight. I don’t think time will heal this unfortunately. Something would have improved by now.

    • Linda December 8, 2015 at 5:06 pm Reply

      Can’t remember who you have seen, but if at all possible I would try to find an integrative ENT doctor. Or ANY kind of integrative/holistic doctor, who will try natural treatments first. I know how frustrating and stressful this can be. I spent two agonizing months literally gasping for every single breath—on top of twenty other horrible side effects. I was lucky at one point to get an hour sleep.

      Something else that might be worth a shot is an integrative DDS, one who is Huggins trained. I found one in the midst of all this and she was familiar with many of the therapies my ND uses. https://www.hugginsappliedhealing.com/find-dentist.php

  34. Stephanie December 8, 2015 at 3:47 pm Reply

    Okay now I have heard everything. If this doesn’t prove the FDA will approve anything if paid enough I don’t know what will. There is a drug called prolia that I guess is supposed to strengthen bones but on the commercial one of the side effects was possible broken bones. Really this is shit that the evil FDA approves. I already promised myself no more pills that are not natural ever but seeing this just confirmed it

    • Linda December 8, 2015 at 5:01 pm Reply

      Well, the other osteoporosis drugs that are supposed to help build bone also have a possible side effect of necroses of the jaw. Your jaw disintegrates and you are left disfigured. Nice, huh? AND some of them actually increase risk of fracture in one of the leg bones (femur?) But hey, the people in the commercials all look so happy, so sign me up!

      • Stephanie December 8, 2015 at 5:45 pm Reply

        Lmao lmao Linda I swear you are hilarious but I mean if the people in the commercial are happy then it must be good. Who cares if my bones disintegrate who needs bones I mean they look happy in the commercials

        • Linda December 8, 2015 at 7:20 pm

          yeah, I don’t even have cholesterol issues, but damn, that woman is SO happy her
          numbers are down Crestor, I want some of that too! And the one for sleep, with the cat-like white and black animated animals. I want those too! Oh–I and I want the cute, goofy walking talking stomach. I better clear a shelf in my bathroom.

        • Stephanie December 8, 2015 at 8:32 pm

          Lmao the walking stomach is th best. Oh and I love it when they say don’t take the drug if you are allergic to it. Umm how do you know if you are allergic if you don’t take it that’s just ridiculous. Oh you what makes me want to take those drugs even more when the side effects are for the exact reason you are taking the drug or they say can cause death that’s amazing cause you won’t have the problem anymore if you are dead

  35. Mike December 8, 2015 at 4:27 pm Reply

    Bob if you ever find a way to get nerves to regenerate then let me know!! I had autonomic dysfunction prior to cipro and now it’s really bad. These drugs not only affect the peripheral nervous system but also the central.

  36. Linda December 8, 2015 at 5:28 pm Reply

    I was sent a link to this site where you can look up integrative doctors. It is NOT all encompassing. I know one who did not come up, but it’s a start. Also, be sure to check the box to increase the zip code area or you will keep bringing up no search results. http://www.anh-usa.org/find-a-practitioner/

  37. Morrison Bell December 8, 2015 at 6:47 pm Reply

    GREETINGS ………to every body , i am MORRISON BELL from LONDON(UK). I was once diagnosed with LUPUS in September 2014. I back than i was having skin rashes all over my body, this was very unbearable to me , then life was without meaning to me due to my health status , i tried my possible best to get cured but all seems in vain, So all through those period of my life, i was unhappy.
    I still kept doing research on possible cure for LUPUS since 2014 though i knew science has no cure for it yet, few years ago while i was on search in the Internet i came across different testimonies on how this great man called DR.ODIGIE has been saving souls with his herbal medicine , people recommended that he has been using his medicine to cure LUPUS and different disease permanently and they advice that anyone who haven’t get in contact with him should contact him now for help.
    So After reading several testimony from different people concerning DR.ODIGIE medicine for curing LUPUS , i said to myself that God could use any means to heal his servant , So without any doubt, i contacted him about my LUPUS Diagnosis treatment ,i explained my problems to him, without wasting time, he told me that he is going to help me , So he prepared a herbal medicine for me which he sent to me and he told me to use it according to the instruction that i will see on it, so i abide to him, before i know it, i was beginning to feel some changes in my body , the skin rashes i had on my body was gone and so i went for medical check up and to my greatest surprise, i was healed and cured from the disease i tut then can never be cured from my LUPUS but DR.ODIGIE gave me reasons to live , I am so very happy now as i am sharing my testimony and i want to use this medium opportunity to tell anyone who is having this sickness LUPUS or any kind of disease like HERPES, HEPATITIS B ,DERMATOMYOSITIS .HIV AIDS, Cancer, syphilis, gall stone and lot’s more should quickly contact DR ODIGIE on his email at:(drodigiesolutiontemple at yahoo.com) rewrite the email address in a right form before contacting him . His Herbal medicine is one of a kind and i believe he can also cure you too just as he has cured me..THANKS ……..

  38. Lucy Sky December 9, 2015 at 5:09 pm Reply

    How can we be sure that this herbal medicine is safe?

  39. Lucy Sky December 10, 2015 at 1:40 pm Reply

    Does anyone have any experience or knowledge about capiscain creams for getting rid of nerve pain?

    • jwinn December 10, 2015 at 2:08 pm Reply

      Lucy Sky, Yes, I have used capiscain creams for nerve pain. I can’t say that it helped all the time, but I don’t recall it hurting me in any way. Be careful not to rub around your eyes and wash your hands thoroughly after using, because it consists of cheyenne pepper. I have been using Traumeel, which is homeopathic. It hasn’t made a believer out of me yet, but it hasn’t hurt me, so I will continue using it until it is gone. Veteranians swear by it for joint pain. Since my Vet actually was the dr who finally diagnosed me (after 18 specialists shrugged their shoulders), I’m giving it a shot!

  40. Lucy Sky December 10, 2015 at 5:51 pm Reply

    Hi jwinnl
    Thanks for your reply about the capiscain cream.
    Prof Jayson recommends capiscain cream in his book Understanding Back Pain published in association with the British Medical Association.
    On page 83 he writes that you need to persevere and apply it two to three times a day for two days before it starts to be effective. He further states that after this time the nerve endings are depleted of the chemical substance causing the pain.

    I have not tried it yet.

    You said that it did not help you all the time. I am unsure what you meant by that .

    Do you know how long it took before it did help with pain relief?

    I am having pain in both Achilles tendons, the ankles, knees and soles of my feet. I can see the spasms in the tops of my feet.
    My legs, thighs and buttocks are also burning. Standing is very painful but I have to keep mobilising as my physio says if you don’t use it you will lose it!

    I just rue the day that I ever took an antibiotic. I have always felt very ill at ease when required to take any antibiotic but did not know why. Now I do.
    it is quite true these drugs are highly detrimental to the body and dished out too rashly and frequently by doctors.

    I was offered tramadol, nsaids, codeine, for the peripheral neuropathy but refused a prescription for the capiscain cream. I was told that it may not work. I replied well that applies to most drugs but I understand that the capiscain cream is a much safer option.

    Anyway I am willing to give it a try because I am desperate and unwilling to take prescribed toxic chemicals designed to cause further harm..

    I have to say that I am noting the increasing resistance to prescribing safer alternatives to antibiotics, opiates etc.

    Sorry for keep going on about it but I feel very upset with what has happened to me.
    I start to get even more panic stricken before going to bed because I cannot get comfortable in bed and know that in the morning I will be in more pain .
    Pain that could have been avoided if I had not taken those crappy antibiotics.


    • jwinn December 11, 2015 at 7:38 am Reply

      Good morning Lucy Sky, I pray you slept well last night. I know it is frustrating and discouraging to go to bed in pain everynight. I am also very angry that I took the medication that was supposed to help me, and ended up wrecking my life as I knew it. I pray for better days for all of us. It is such a disgrace that we all have to live and suffer this way. I was prescribed capsaician creme when I had shingles on my hip. It was for the nerve pain that is associated with having shingles. Unforutnately, the creme can cause more pain and burning if applied to an area with an open wound. I tried to use the capsaician for the pain, but my shingles kept spredding, so I was limited to its use so I could not feel the full effect. If you don’t know anything about shingles, it causes blistering that will pop, the fluid comes out, and the wounds have to heal. It is VERY painful and BURNS constantly. I could not use the creme in those areas, which is why it helped sometimes, and sometimes it didn’t. The neurapathy pain can last for weeks or years, depending on the person. I do believe it helped in the areas that I was able to apply it. As long as you don’t have any open areas or thinning skin, I would give it a try. For example, I have very thin skin on my feet and toes due to a year of Prednisone ( they gave me Cipro, Levaquin AND Prednisone). I have to wear special socks and shoes to avoid blistering and ripping of my skin on my feet. I would NOT attempt to use capsaician on my feet because of my thinning skin. However, I may now give it a try on my neck, arms, shoulders, elbows, and wrists myself!

      Just remember, it will get hot from the chili peppers. Here are a few tips from my box:
      •Wash your hands with soap and water immediately after using capsaicin cream unless your hands are part of the treated area.
      •If you are using capsaicin cream on your hands, allow 30 minutes for the medicine to absorb before washing. During this time, avoid touching damaged or irritated skin, contact lenses, or your eyes, nose, mouth, or other mucous membranes. Wash hands after 30 minutes.
      •Do not apply to wounds or damaged, broken (open), or irritated skin.
      •Do not bandage or wrap the affected area.
      •Do not use capsaicin cream with a heating pad.
      •Do not expose the treated area to heat or direct sunlight. Warm or hot water or sunlight may increase the likelihood of burning or itching. Do not use capsaicin cream immediately after bathing, swimming, using a hot tub, sunbathing, or exposure to heat.

      You can also buy capsaician creme at the drug store (or Walmart) in arthritis strength over the counter if you would prefer to test it out before taking the prescription. Then, if your body seems to be able to tolerate it, I would ask for the prescription strength.

      I hope this helps! Good luck! Sending love and blessings your way! HUGS!

  41. Lucy Sky December 11, 2015 at 3:16 pm Reply

    Hi jwinn

    Thanks again for your reply it is much appreciated.
    I had physio today which helps with the neuropathic pain as it keeps the joints moving enabling some pain relief for several hours before building up again.
    I have told to walk as much as possible without getting overtired of course.

    Exercise , mobilising will encourage the production of endorphins which as you know are the body’s natural pain relievers and anti depressants.

    I also bought a book on the Paleo diet. As well as this I spoke to my friend who was eventually diagnosed with dysbyosis due to a candida overgrowth.

    When his vitamin D level reached over the official optimal level his signs and symptoms of leaky gut disappeared as did the tingling, numbness in his legs and heels and feet – so he informed me.

    It took 3 months of a gluten free diet. As stated previously once his Vit D level rose he was able to introduce gluten back into his diet without any problems.

    He also had adrenal fatigue.
    His parasitology stool test was positive.

    He had been taking prozac for years but he stopped taking it is now able to function normally.

    Please note that I am not advocating stopping any drugs especially anti depressants unless under medical advice/supervision.
    His panic attacks have since ceased.

    So in a nutshell he:

    1. Had a parasitology stool test via David Hompes Nutritionist . This proved positive for two organisms in the gut. Yet a blood test for H Pylori one week previously done under the NHS was negative!!

    2.He went onto a gluten free diet for three months.

    He took probiotics, Co – enzyme Q 10.Vit d.Vit B12.Calcium. Magnesium.Zinc.Capryllic acid.

    Used magnesium oil and soaked in a bath with Epsom salts every night.

    4. Went to a chiropractor.

    5. Kept away from doctors.

    6. DIET.

    Apart from commencing a gluten free diet he went onto the Paleo diet or rough equivalent. That is fresh meat.fish, not tinned .
    Fresh fruit and vegetables.

    Ate butter instead of the pro active etc.
    Stopped sugar and refined carbs. No cereal.

    Avoids caffeine , no tea or coffee etc during the gluten free diet period. Drank plain water.
    Also he never uses/d a micro wave.

    I do not know if any of this helps floxies but it is obviously important to find out the root cause of the leaky gut syndrome and treat it accordingly.


    • Lucy Sky December 11, 2015 at 3:17 pm Reply

      Hi jwinn
      Sorry meant to say that my friends thyroid hormone level, the tsh went back to normal after these measures that were mentioned in my last posting.

      • jwinn December 11, 2015 at 7:48 pm Reply

        Lucy Sky, I am so happy to hear about your friend! Hopefully, you will be in recovery soon, as well! I went into recovery about 3 years into this. I was about 75% better. I still had some pain, but could function fairly well, and my depression was better. I even took a trip to Italy to visit a friend, and was able to walk each day as long as I rested well in the evenings. It lasted for about a year, and I relapsed a year ago. I have no idea what caused the relapse. I did, however, start menopause, so wondering if that triggered it. Now, I have full blown pain in my head, neck, shoulders, arms, elbows, wrists and fingers all the time. I could not eat, due to the severe pain, and lost 20 pounds ( I only weighed 110 lbs) . I did not sleep for 3 months. I thought I was going out of my mind. My hair began falling out again ( I lost most of my hair, my fingernails, and my toe nails when I was first floxed) I had/ have no energy, I am depressed, and my anxiety levels are at an all time high. I would not drive out of fear for 6 months. Now, I will only drive 1 mile distances. I have only one store I will go into due to my anxiety. I live alone, so I have no one to help me. My niece drives 100 miles every weekend to go grocery shopping for me and clean my house. I don’t know what I would do without her and my dog! My fingers and toes stay freezing, and the rest of my body stays hot. I am able to go to work now, come home and take care of my precious dog, and I then crawl into bed to give my body some relief from the pain. I do not know what has caused this relapse in me. I also have glaucoma, high cholesterol and osteoporosis, so I have to be careful what supplements/medications I take. I am taking CoQ 10, Magnesium, Calcium, Vit D, Boron, Vit C, Krill Oil, Biotin, Mitochondrial Energy Optimizer, Glucosamine Chondotrin MSM, Vitamin B12, NAC, and my eye drops (presciption Combigan) for my glaucoma pressures that I have been using for 15 years now. I don’t know if any or all of them are actually helping me, but I take them religiously. I use Ginger Root if I get an upset stomach. I was diagnoses with neuropathy due to Cipro, but that is still not a ‘label’ for SSI reasons. I am fortunate that I can now work, but with limitations so I do not feel secure at my job of 30 years. I do an awful lot of praying each and every day…..I do that for all of us!!!! Blessings to you, Lucy! And hope and prayers for ALL of us who are experience pain and heartache due to this injustice to our lives!!!!!

        • Bob December 11, 2015 at 8:59 pm

          Jwinn, Some of the symptoms you describe sound like thyroid issues like your hair falling out when you were closed. We know these drugs can mess up your thyroid. Then you relapsed when you went into menopause. There is a cascade of hormone issues at that time. Maybe you should get a complete hormone workup from a functional medicine doctor. Have you ever been tested for hashimotos disease where the thyroid is making antibodies against itself?

        • Bruce December 11, 2015 at 9:46 pm

          The ND I visited said insufficient iodine levels in the body can cause a lot of the problems with thyroid.

        • Linda December 11, 2015 at 10:29 pm

          My ND also put me on an iodine supplement: Biotics Research Iodizyme-HP. It’s expensive but lasts a long time because you only take 1/2 pill and there are 120 in the bottle.

        • jwinn December 12, 2015 at 7:42 pm

          Bob, I went to an Endocrinologist and had a complete hormone workup and then did another one with my OBGYN. My thyroid levels were normal. I was deficient in Vit B12 and Vit D, and my estrogen levels were extremely low. They recommended hormone replacement therapy and Vit B12 injections and Vit D supplements. At that time, I chose to go the natural route for my hormones and tried EVERYTHING I could find that was recommended on the market for my symptoms….black cohosh, Kava Kava, melatonin, etc.. .. I even had a friend in Europe send me their natural form of menopausal symptom supplements. Nothing helped my extreme anxiety, loss of appetite, insomnia, chronic fatigue, and severe depression. I had bottomed out, and could not function from day to day. I was ready to give up on my life. My friends, family, and doctor were ready to have me committed. I finally succumbed to the lowest dosage of hormone replacement therapy on the market called ClimarPro patch and a 1/2 dosage of Remeron for Anxiety (I am extremely med sensitive since being floxed, so my doctor is very careful to watch for side effects, and only prescribes 1/2 a dosage to see how my body will react). I noticed a positive difference in myself within a week of taking them. I have been on them for 4 months now, but I do not want to STAY on them! I am afraid of breast cancer; however, the medication has also kept me functioning. However, it has not helped my severe joint and muscle pain. I was taking a 1/2 pill of Sevella for joint pain, and it was working, until I had my relapse last year. I woke up with a “frozen shoulder”. I have no idea why it happened. I refused a steroid shot, and the doctor ordered physical therapy 3 times a week, but my insurance wouldn’t pay for the $120 visits (x3), so I had to stop going. I continued doing the exercises on my own, and started going to a chiropractor. Nothing has helped the pain since my relapse a year ago. After seeing a chiropractor, I have about 50% use of my arm, but I am in severe pain each day. I go back to my GP this month to have a recheck and blood work redone. I want to get off of my meds, but I don’t know how! I am not taking very much…matter of fact, my doctor can’t believe such low dosages are even helping me with my anxiety and my depression, but she sees for herself that they are. Unfortunately, the Savella is no longer working for my severe muscle and joint pain. I just don’t want pharma drugs in my body! I want to be healthy, with no pain, again. My floxing, along with a year of Prednisone, was so severe that I’m not sure my body will ever be able to recover. However, I am in so much pain right now, that I am not living, I am barely existing. Sorry to unload my life story, but I am having a bad day and just needed to unload. Thank you for being the listener of my rant. I live in the middle of no where in Virginia, and I have very few choices as to medical care. Most of what I learn is from the people on this website. I appreciate this information and support so much! It is sad, but comforting to know that I am not alone and someone else actually knows how I feel. Floxing has changed all of our lives…Btw., my OBGYN also told me that the extensive use of Prednisone is probably what threw me into menopause, and I never should have been on Prednisone with Cipro to begin with….imagine that!

        • Linda December 12, 2015 at 10:57 pm

          Prednisone and Cipro is what made my floxing so bad. I wanted to ask if you had tried accupuncture for the pain?

        • jwinn December 13, 2015 at 1:58 pm

          No, I have never tried acupuncture. I will try to check to see where and how far I would have to go in order to get it. I see a therapeutic massage therapist once every two weeks. It’s all I can afford. She knows I was floxed and did her research before touching me on the types of damage it can do to muscles, tendons, and joints. She is amazing, and truly helps my muscle and joint pain…even relieves my headaches. She uses mostly pressure therapy, so not to damage my muscles. She simply puts her fingers in my pressure points and holds them there until the pressure is released. She spends an entire hour working on nothing but my hands, arms, shoulders, neck and head using pressure points. I just wish I could go more often!

        • Linda December 13, 2015 at 3:27 pm

          It’s great you have someone who took the time to research it. That’s how my acupuncturist its. I have been going around 3 months and in that time he has seen THREE other floxies!!! This is all so criminal. I know what you mean about $. I have none, have a ton of credit card debt, still can’t work, and can’t get an attorney to take my case because of the cap in CA on what you can recover. If you haven’t watched it yet, take a look at Certain Adverse Events—a documentary you can find online re the flqs. It is from 2009 and nothing has really changed….

  42. Tricia December 11, 2015 at 5:53 pm Reply

    To all those suffering with PN,
    I am 13 months out now and this, for me, is the one thing that has greatly imoroved. Once in a while my left foot gets a little tingly at night, but doesnt last long. A year ago at this time my legs & feet were burning, twitching so bad , I could barely walk . The only thing that really helped was time, and supplementing w Taurine helped immensely. At present, I am left w floaters , spine and back pain that comes and goes:( Hang in there everybody!

    • Tricia December 11, 2015 at 6:33 pm Reply

      And reading about peripheral neurapothy really scared me too!! It says it only gets worse, no cure, but I don’t think that’s true. There are many floxies who have recovered EVENTUALLY from PN symptoms, myself included. I think SM had posted earlier about not “labeling” an illness or identify it through a diagnosis/disease. I think that’s so important, for all of us to remember as we go through this journey 🙂

    • Linda December 12, 2015 at 11:01 pm Reply

      My worst is still breathing issues and severe anxiety, some pn—but my floater—and it is just one HUGE one drives me crazy. It is like looking through gauze all the time. I read one researcher who said it was perhaps from the cipro damaging the vitreous fluid as it damages collagen, which makes sense. It infuriates me, after taking such good care of my eyes. Floaters as a rule don’t “go away.” They may lighten, but most doctors say you just get used to them. It has been ten months and I can’t imagine getting used to this.

      • Danielle December 13, 2015 at 1:00 am Reply

        Linda any recommendations for severe anxiety?

        • Linda December 13, 2015 at 1:42 am

          I wish I had some recommendations. My anxiety is through the rough. Sadly, I can hardly go anywhere without crying. I have cried my way through Trader Joe’s, Vons, Target, you name it. One thing that helps a bit is to become aware of my breathing. I inhale for four counts and then try to exhale (depending how my breathing is at time) for 7-8 counts. Really does make a difference.

        • Lucy Sky December 15, 2015 at 7:42 pm

          Yoga has been effective for anxiety for some people.

        • Stephanie December 16, 2015 at 1:11 pm

          Linda if you do yoga my girl friend teaches yoga and said to start with restorative yoga it’s the best type for us especially if movement is hard. She teaches in long beach but let me know where you live and I can ask her for a good teacher near you. 😜

      • Daniela December 13, 2015 at 4:55 pm Reply

        Linda, I wonder if the anxiety is related to what I call vertigo, a feeling of being off balanced and weird, which strikes me most often ( and always ) in supermarkets. It is hard to tell which comes first, and maybe that doesn’t matter. But I find that trying to avoid the vertigo lessens the anxiety. Another thing that sets off the vertigo besides supermarkets and big box stores is car (or bus, plane or train) rides. I definitely am worse after being in a car for even half an hour.

        I also do the same breathing exercise when the anxiety hits while trying to sleep. It is very difficult to do at first, but seems to work after a while.

        I am trying to do a regular morning breathing and meditation routine, but for some reason I still can’t get into the rhythm. I am hoping that this will serve as a preventative, rather than something to do when it is almost already too late.

        • Stephanie December 13, 2015 at 5:23 pm

          For the vertigo and anxiety in the supermarkets and stores/ restaurants in general my ND said it’s most likely a combo of the stimulation and the lights. For me even the bus is harder than being in my car again because it’s a lot of stimulation and the buses are lit with those icky lights. At home I can control stimulation and shut it off when I feel like it’s too much same thing for lights. I’m mostly cool with natural lighting. Don’t know if this is the same for you guys but just my insights.😜

        • Linda December 13, 2015 at 5:34 pm

          The lights in the supermarket really affect me because it worsens my vision. But also it is all the people. I have a hard time being around a lot of people now, which sucks–I have performed on stages in front of thousands of people. 😦

          As for feeling off balance, I get that a little bit, but not too often, so can’t say it is connected for me. So much of this is such a big annoying mystery.

        • Stephanie December 13, 2015 at 6:04 pm

          Yeah it is😢🤗😘

        • Daniela December 13, 2015 at 6:02 pm

          But there is something going on in the supermarket. I was just struck by how Linda picked out those places, which I also would do.

          Anyhow, it’s going to make that job of last resort, working at Walmart, even more difficult 😦

        • Linda December 13, 2015 at 6:54 pm

          I was thinking about when I might be able to pick up at least part time work, and it pretty much rules out any kind of store. Not just the lights…sounds too. Like a child will scream, and where it normally might be just annoying, now it is actually painful. Then many offices have fluorescent lighting—and that is very disturbing as well.

        • jwinn December 14, 2015 at 8:10 am

          Believe me, I am with you on the anxiety. I have had to get my neice to drive an hour to my house on the weekends for the past 5 years to do my shopping for me. I would have starved to death (along with my dogs) if not for her. I can’t even sit through an hour of church without freaking out. I am not in a marijuana state, but wish I was. I think canabit oil would be a great help for my joint pain. I am going to check into the MSM/cannabis extract cream online and see what is available. My neuropathy and foot pain has gotten better than in the beginning, but I still battle with it and have to wear special shoes and socks.

  43. jwinn December 11, 2015 at 7:52 pm Reply

    Lucy sky, may I add that I not only took Cipro, but one month later took Levaquin, and then put me on Predisone for a year. No one could diagnose my symptoms, so they left me on the Prednisone because they were convinced that I had an autoimmune disease, even though all of my tests came back negative each month for an entire year. I honestly thought I was going to die during that time. There is no telling how much joint damage and nerve damage that I have from the extensive use of Prednisone on top of being floxed.

  44. Deborah December 11, 2015 at 8:27 pm Reply

    Did a fungus cause you to lose your toenails? I lost both my big toenails and could not figure out why!! Took levaquin in ’13.
    Thx, Deb

    • jwinn December 12, 2015 at 1:46 pm Reply

      Deb, it looked like a fungus’ yellow color; however, the doctor seemed to think it came from my lack of circulation to my extremities from my joint inflammation. My feet were also one big blister and turned black, and my fingers did the same thing. My nails simply started lifting off from my nail beds. My nose and my ears also blistered. They were afraid I was going to lose my feet because of the lack of circulation. However, they checked my SED inflammation counts every month for a year for autoimmune diseases, and they all came back ‘0’, which is as negative as it gets. They had no answers….I know now that I was floxed. My big toe nails still look bad, like they have a fungus even after 5 years. But my fingernails look good. I started using something called Trind from Delo Enterprises. It is a clear nail polish strengthener. I saw the add in a magazine in my auto immune doctor’s office. It has helped my hails tremendously. They made me stop wearing colored polish when I nail beds started lifting because they couldn’t tell if my fingers were purple underneath, so I started using that to help with the peeling and the splitting of my nails. If used as directed, IT WORKS! I still use it, even if I put colored polish on top of it. But it hasn’t helped my big toe nails. They had started looking much better and the yellow part had grown out, until I had a relapse last year. Now, they are yellow and thin again. I am betting yours came from circulation issues as well!

  45. Carla December 13, 2015 at 3:45 pm Reply

    Hi fellow Floxie fighters … I’m new to blogging at all, but since much of my time now is consumed by dealing with the effects of Fluoroquinolones, I’m finding this site interesting and helpful. I’ve tried to reply to a couple of posts, but get lost on the main site, so I will just put my information on here and hope that it is of some help.

    First I should say that I have been my own doctor for decades, had an injury that hospitalized me nearly three years ago, and was given a fluoroquinolone antibiotic intravenously in the hospital with no forewarning even tho I questioned them. I have been treating the subsequent health problems (that I now know are the side effects of these drugs) with my own combination of lots of research and experimentation with various supplements and herbs, as well as consultation with healers of many persuasions. I am healing more than backsliding and am determined to regain as much function as possible. In the meantime, here are some of the things that have helped me:

    Eye deterioration, including floaters: starting getting floaters after using computers beginning in late 80s; began taking 6mg. Lutein and other eye vitamins. Finally got my eyes checked at age 70, and was told I needed reading glasses of 1.50, eyes looked good, and keep taking the vitamins.

    Frozen shoulder: woke up one miserable morning with this terribly painful attack. I live in a medical marijuana state, and I had some cannabis oil, which I rubbed on for pain relief, and MSM cream, which is a joint lubricant. They worked well, and I ended up combining them to make a wonderful penetrating pain reliever for multiple purposes. If you have access, look for MSM Cream with Cannabis extract. I believe there are some online.

    Foot pain, swelling, burning, neuropathy: still dealing with this, but have had positive progress with Ionic foot baths (the kind with the wristband); Manuka Honey applied to the irritated skin and wrapped with a single layer of gauze in a loose cotton sock; frequent application of various healing creams and lotions, including the MSM Cream mentioned above; and careful attention to diet and supplements and healing herbs.

  46. jwinn December 14, 2015 at 8:18 am Reply

    Carla, I tried some cannabis extract ointment in the past, but the smell was sooo bad that I couldn’t put it on and go out of the house inorder to go to work. Does anyone know of any MSM and cannabis extract cremes that don’t have such a horrible odor? I am sorry about your frozen shoulder……it was one of the most painful things I have ever experienced. I am 6 months in and yet to recover. I am still in pain every day. I rub down in Traumeel gel every morning and night, and it does seem to help. However, but the time I get off from work in the afternoon, all I can do is go home and crawl in bed from the pain of the day.

    • Carla December 16, 2015 at 7:02 am Reply

      Hi jwinn … I made my own. I acquired some high-quality cannabis trim and infused it into virgin olive oil (hemp oil is good as well) by slow cooking at low temperature (approx. 175) for a few days. Then I got some MSM cream from rawfoodworld.com., a site I trust to have no harmful ingredients in their products. I found a way to mix the oil into the cream and added a bit of my herbal tonic to prevent bacterial growth. The tonic contains garlic, and when I shared my cream with others, the only complaints I got were about the smell — garlic and cannabis. I experimented with adding extracts, and eventually found that a small amount of vanilla, almond and orange extracts work to mask the unplesent odors. You may want to try adding a bit of those extracts to the cream you have to see if it helps. I want to add that topical cannabis creams have no psychoactive effect and will not trigger a positive drug test, so they are truly medicinal and are also legal because they are not ingestible. Cannabis works well to alleviate pain.

      • jwinn December 16, 2015 at 10:58 am Reply

        Thank you, Carla! I will try adding those things! Sending blessings and healing your way!

  47. Rachel December 14, 2015 at 2:14 pm Reply

    Hi, I am not sure where to post this, but thought I’d try putting it here and see if it reaches people. I want to thank everyone who has shared their experiences here. I had a severe reaction to a different class of antibiotics that caused me to loose all of the hearing in my left ear. Since then I approach every antibiotic with caution so when Cipro was suggested to me for a current sinus infection, I began researching it and found this site, among other sites that gave stern warnings, which thankfully made me decide not to take it. I am still suffering from the sinus infection, but I know I have to find an alternative treatment. However the reason I am posting is that in my search for an alternative treatment I was doing some research about boric acid and came upon a very interesting article that describes the health benefits of boron, which includes fluoride detoxing and helping the body use magnesium. Since I had been reading about the detrimental effects of fluoroquinolones that same day, I couldn’t help but think that supplementing with boron (via boric acid) might really help people who were poisoned by fluoroquinolones. Here is a link to the article: http://www.health-science-spirit.com/borax.htm. You have to read through it a bit to find the relevant information, but I think it might be worth it. Also forgive me if this is old news or proven ineffective for fluoroquinolone poisoning, but just in case it could help even one person, I wanted to share this information.

    • Linda December 14, 2015 at 3:10 pm Reply

      That was sweet of you to post. I am thinking, since it was written by Walter Last, that perhaps Jason has posted something on this? As for your sinus infection, have you seen a naturopath?

  48. Marçal William December 14, 2015 at 9:39 pm Reply

    Someone here could answer two questions?
    1- How do I post a new topic and see the other topics?
    2- How can i know the number of members of the site and what are they?

  49. Tricia December 15, 2015 at 3:17 pm Reply

    Has anybody have or had rib pain ?

    • Lucero Rojas December 15, 2015 at 3:51 pm Reply

      Hi Tricia

      Yes used to have pains on my sides. I would touch my ribs and it seems to hurt but then I realized that it was my skin muscles the ones that are on top of my ribs. Right now after 5 months they still hurt a little when I press on them. I continue putting mag cream on me and it seems to help. How far out are you Tricia?

      • Tricia December 15, 2015 at 4:31 pm Reply

        Hi Lucero..
        I’m 13 months out. This just started about a week ago 😦 always somehing!! On a positive note, somev things are improving, like my legs and feet are way better than last month. I’m very thankful that i can still work as a hairstylist and carry on a “normalish” life, with aches and pains in my back being the worst.
        Anyhow, I’m glad that your rib pain has gotten better ! hope ur doing well lucero:)

    • Linda December 15, 2015 at 6:38 pm Reply

      Tricia…kind of. I had severe, really hideous deep-in-the-bone pain near the scapula. It was actually ten times worse than when I had cracked ribs. I would just sit, crumpled up on the couch and cry all day. It was one of the first side effects to subside when I started IV therapy. That was about 5 or so months ago, and not even a twinge in that area now.

      • Bob December 15, 2015 at 6:44 pm Reply

        Linda, What kind of IV’s did you get?

        • Linda December 15, 2015 at 6:58 pm

          I started out with Myers which has anti oxidants, B vitamins and Mag, which we all need in spades. I got H2O2 because I had to wean off of inhaled steroids for asthma, but it also oxygenates all your cells. I got phosphytidalcholine which is (among other things) for nerve damage which I had plenty of, and I got high-dose vitamin C, which (among other things) helps to rebuild damaged collagen. I got a “push” of glutathione with all except the H2O2 (they don’t play well together) each time I got an IV. They really saved me. When I was taken there (after a dozen MDs who basically threw me under the bus) I could barely walked. I shuffled with the help of a friend. I was 30+ pounds down and extremely frail; gasping for each breath, in horrific pain , numb toes and fingers, obliterated GI system, suicidal, and blurred vision. (and some other stuff like popping in joints and electrical zaps and nerves pressing in around neck like I was choking. Seriously—Stephen King couldn’t have come up with this.) I really felt like I had one foot in the grave. Today, I still have breathing issues, though FAR from what they were. I have blurred vision and numbness in toes, fatigue and anxiety. BUT compared to where I was in March—there is no comparison. So, yeah, I am a big fan of the IVs. I was sure I was going to die before them.

        • Bob December 15, 2015 at 7:59 pm

          So the Myers, the phosphytidalcholine, and the Vit C were all separate IV’s?

        • Carla December 16, 2015 at 6:24 am

          Linda, I have had significant help with removing the lingering toxins through Ionic Foot Baths. It’s amazing how much ugly gunk they remove through one’s feet! I just had my fourth one –one week between each — and the swelling and pain in my feet are much less. I send hope for your continued healing.

        • Linda December 16, 2015 at 9:53 am

          Thank you Carla, you too.

        • jwinn December 18, 2015 at 8:19 am

          Linda, do you think the powdered form of phosphatydalchline would help me with my neuropathy and burning in my feet and hands since I don’t have a NP around? I saw some various powdered forms on the internet.

  50. Me December 16, 2015 at 11:07 am Reply

    Hello everyone,

    I’ve frequented this site since November 2013 when I first was prescribed and took cipro. I didn’t finish the script because the second pill immediately caused me unwanted side effects. My hands felt weird and achy and my joints began to pop considerably. I’ve never had any type of joint pain or popping for that matter. Of course the doc said no this is not from cipro and to continue to take the script. I didn’t I through them away and never took them again. after that I was referred to many specialists as in rheumatologist and a couple said RA then one said not RA and that he just didn’t know what it was. This rheumatologist said that he didn’t want to prescribe me a med that could possibly cause more serious problems for me if its not in fact RA. He even went as far to say that he wouldn’t even take it. I believe that it was plaqunile because it can cause vision problems. Last blood work was last year 2014 around this time. RA factor was within normal range. CRP was normal. Sed rate was 39 which is higher than the range of 20. ANA was negative. I guess my question for anyone out here is have anyone been given a misdiagnosis of some sort. Has anyone inflammation markers stabilized. Has anyone doc leaned toward an RA diagnosis and didn’t have it. I’m not seeking validations from anyone however I am just a little curious. God bless you all.

    • jwinn December 16, 2015 at 11:30 am Reply

      Dear Me, All of my doctors leaned toward RA, but didn’t have the tests to prove it. There is no ‘true’ diagnosis for being ‘floxed’, so doctors try to find other scientific reasons for our symptoms. I got tested every month for a year for autoimmune diseases, and my specialist finally had to let me go with no diagnosis. He told me when he let me go that it was his opinion that I had been reacting to the antibiotics and steriods given to me prior to being sent to him. However, this was not ‘written’ in any document, medical file, or letter to my primary care physician. Doctors are very careful not to be specific and follow the medical ‘code of ethics’ with eachother. I’m not your physician, but if I were you, I would have regular blood work done, and not take any medication unless I received a VALID CONFIRMATION of RA. ‘Guess work’ should not be part of your treatment. Good luck in finding your answers and your treatment for better days! Sending hope, blessings and prayers your way.

      • Linda December 16, 2015 at 11:47 am Reply

        Yes, sadly, that is the norm. I think a big part of it is (other than being completely brainwashed, first in medical school and then by reps re the glories of pharmaceutical drugs) that physicians just don’t want to believe that something they hand out like candy could have actually harmed their patients. One doctor told me the excruciating, mind-numbing pain I had around my scapula (overnight) was arthritis. Really? REALLY? Just like that I went from no pain to pain worse than when I had cracked ribs. Well, within a couple months of doing IVs, the pain disappeared. Completely. Never to return. Arthritis—yeah, right.

      • Me December 16, 2015 at 1:18 pm Reply

        Jwinn and Linda

        Thanks so much really appreciate the feedback. Yeah just frustrating and I agree it’s like their playing a guessing game with what’s going on with you. But one thing all the doctors do agree on is it wasn’t the cipro. Yeah right, how do someone wake up one morning with cracking and popping joints out the blue with no rhyme or reason right after taking a medication. I laid down as normal but woke up to the sounds and tunes of my joints.

    • Daniela December 16, 2015 at 7:22 pm Reply

      Let me just leave this here again:

      Even Dr Andrew Weil writes that even if you really do have RA, he advises against taking the medication.

      “Conventional medicine treats rheumatoid arthritis (and other autoimmune diseases) with steroids and other immunosuppressive medications, most of which are toxic when used long-term. Try to avoid these strong drugs if you can. Patients who are dependent on them are less likely to respond to natural treatments.”


      Everyone is doing the no dairy, no grains diet. Give it a try 🙂

      • Linda December 16, 2015 at 7:27 pm Reply

        I agree whole-heartedly. Not to mention that steroids exacerbate FLQ toxicity. We all need to get off the pharmaceutical merry-go-round when at all possible.

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