Floxie Hope

Floxie.Hope.1800.72.dpi

This site is to give HOPE to those who are suffering from Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome as a result of being poisoned by fluoroquinolone antibiotics – Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox, Floxin, etc.  It contains stories of healing.

Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox and all other fluoroquinolones are dangerous drugs that can have devastating effects that cumulatively I’ll refer to as Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome or Floxing.  Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome/Floxing includes damage to connective tissue (tendons, ligaments, cartilage, fascia, etc.) throughout the body, damage to the nervous systems (central, peripheral and autonomic), and more. The damage done by fluoroquinolone antibiotics can destroy a person’s quality of life or even kill them. Certainly, there is a time and a place for drugs with dangerous side effects. If you find yourself in a septic shock induced coma, fluoroquinolones may save your life. Unfortunately, these drugs are not being reserved for life or death situations. People are being prescribed them for urinary tract infections, suspected prostate infections, upper respiratory infections, as a prophylactic for travelers’ diarrhea, ear infections, pink eye, etc. Thousands of people have suffered needlessly from the devastating effects of fluoroquinolone antibiotics, when another, safer antibiotic could have, and should have, been used.

The damage done by fluoroquinolones is largely unacknowledged by the medical establishment and an accurate diagnosis, compensation and relief are difficult to come by. There is no known cure for Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome/Floxing.  However, many people continue to LIVE after being poisoned by fluroquinolones.  They find healing, recovery, perseverance, compassion and hope.  These are their stories.

This site is meant to give hope for healing to those who are adversely effected by fluoroquinolones.  It is no way meant to disregard the pain of those who are chronically suffering from the horrifying effects of Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox or the other fluoroquinolones.  There are people who don’t recover.  Their stories are real and they matter.  There are also people who are able to recover and I share their stories with the hope that they inspire others, or at least give hope that recovery is possible.

Here is a New York Times article about the dangers of fluoroquinolone antibiotics – http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/10/popular-antibiotics-may-carry-serious-side-effects/?_r=0 – more news stories, research papers and other resources can be found on the “Links and Resources” page.

Here is a Facebook group that is a great resource for those going through Fluoroquinolone Toxicity – https://www.facebook.com/groups/floxies/

Featured post – I’m floxed. Now what?

The Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Solution Ebook has helped many Floxies to recover, including DanielCindy and Ruth.  As a bonus, you will also receive The Floxie Food Guide – a book of diet guidelines to help you through fluoroquinolone toxicity:

flu tox get help you need banner click lisa

 

 

 

19,965 thoughts on “Floxie Hope

  1. Darko pet December 2, 2018 at 2:12 pm Reply

    Has anyone else experienced continuous ear buzzing ? Mine have been buzzing for 4-5 weeks now and the noise is driving me mad.

    Thanks

    • L December 2, 2018 at 2:24 pm Reply

      Tinnitus is a fairly common side effect. We can hear different variations of it. Mine is a constant buzzing/hissing/ humming sound. Some hear ringing. Mine was waxing and waning for a while and now seems to be steady. Some have had theirs go away, and others not. Why it happens is anyone’s guess. At first I thought it was nerve damage, since I had so much nerve damage. Could be. Could also be mitochondrial damage. It’s also listed under symptoms of mast cell disorder, also linked to the FLQs.

      • Darko pet December 3, 2018 at 5:36 am Reply

        Thanks L. I am currently taking many supplements from magnesium, vitamins B’s, D’s etc etc and I am convinced that some of my side effects are caused by these supplements. I might try and get off all of them for couple of weeks and see if symptoms improve

        • A.Coleman December 4, 2018 at 3:14 pm

          Darko, I seriously doubt it is any of the supplements you are taking causing your tinnitus. If you read through these threads you will find lots of floxies with tinnitus issues. I too have it and it didn’t come on until 2 years post floxing. The good news is that after 9 months it has quieted down to a level where it is mild – hopefully it will eventually go away.

          Bottom line those nutrients are more important to healing your floxie symptoms than any contribution they could have to your tinnitus – which is probably 0. Stick to the Mg, D and B and give the tinnitus a chance to go away. In the mean time get a sound masking app and use it at night. It will help you sleep. Likely in the day with other sounds the tinnitus isn’t too bad and the masking at night will help train your body to ignore the sound and help you sleep.

          Good luck.

  2. Jackie Farrell December 2, 2018 at 4:46 pm Reply
  3. Andrea December 3, 2018 at 5:48 am Reply

    https://www.healio.com/endocrinology/practice-management/news/print/endocrine-today/%7B3c8cd116-858a-4d75-b9d2-bcb36d715465%7D/fluoroquinolone-safety-labeling-changes-an-opportunity-for-physicians-to-reassess-their-prescribing-practices

    Uhm..I’ve read many others European news like this, after the EMA hearing. Let’s see if in a year from now, we’ll see a drastic reduction in the use of FQs. I doubt it, seriously. These dummies are still prescribing them like candies. I don’t get it. There’re many warnings, today , here in Europe, we also have an offccial restirction, but yet, “urinary tract infection? Cipro!”…

    • Don M December 3, 2018 at 8:47 am Reply

      Andrea…………….. I won’t defend Cipro because it and an IV dose of Leviquin have left me “floxed”. For reference I am 84 now. In 1961 I came down with a simple urinary tract infection. I was sent to a young Urologist for treatment. This young and money hungry Urologist, with his constant invasive procedures, proceeded to turn the simple UTI into a chronic prostate infection that was e Coli. For the next 24 years I was shuffled among 7 Urologists, 3 infectious disease doctors and a couple of gastroenterologist for treatment.
      These doctors gave me every antibiotic that was remotely applicable to the infection problem.
      At one time I was on Bactrim/Septra daily for 18 months. None of them stopped the problem because they did not penetrate the prostate sufficiently to kill off the e Coli.

      Then Cipro came to clinical trials. I was a participant and IT MITIGATED the constant infection re occurrence. For the next 32 years I would rely on Cipro to throttle the symptoms each time they flared up. There were numerous flare ups. Over that 32 years I probably took 1,000 pills of Cipro. See my discussion of “persistents” in the paragraph below.

      In October 2017 I had another UTI attack and went to the ER. There I was IMMEDIATELY given an IV dose of 500 mg of Leviquin. Then (still dumb to the affects Fluoroquinolones could have on a person) I came home and followed the Leviquin IV with 10 days of Cipro. I stopped the infection’s progress alright. But now……….. After researching the Fluoroquinoones on the Internet I realize that the “not quite just right” feeling that I have had
      since I began taking Cipro 33 years ago is because I am floxed. Now on a daily basis one or the other problems of a floxie pop up. At 84 I do not expect to ever see the day that I can say I am “cured”. I just need to devise the plan to make things as good as possible.

      I have done quite a lot of reading and find that there is a term, “persistents”. There are bacteria, and e Coli is one of them, that can hibernate and produce enzymes that protect them from antibiotics. These “persiatents” will revert to hibernation and wait for the antibiotic to be withdrawn and then come back again. Stronger (through mutation) than before.
      Interesting (disgusting) that I had to find this information on the Internet and not from one of the dozen doctors that I have seen over the years.

      Now that I no longer will use a Fluoroquinolones , I try to keep the UTI problem in check with weekly use of D-Mannose and other “natural” things that work toward the health of the urinary tract.
      I am a sincere advocate of D-Mannose use if one has a UTI. D-Mannose is not an antibiotic, it is a sugar, (but it does not raise the blood sugar level) it sticks to e Coli bacteria. D-Mannose sticks to the urinary tract walls and makes them slippery so that the bacteria can not stick. The surface of e Coli has receptors that D-Mannose sticks to and balls it up to where it minimizes the ability of e Coli to stick to the walls of the urinary tract.

      All in all…………… I floxed myself over a period of years because no one told me anything about the devastating possibilities of taking Fluoroquinolines.
      I had to read it on the Internet.
      Sadly, 50+ years ago the Internet was not here, so no one knew the true devastation that Fluoroquinolobnes could have on a person’s health.

      • L December 3, 2018 at 9:55 am Reply

        something to look into. there are certain bacteria that have a protective biofilm around them that make it difficult to treat. however, there are bio film disrupters you can get that help penetrate those little suckers. do a little search on that.

        • Henk Noordhuizen December 3, 2018 at 10:02 am

          As far as I can remember I read that that’s the reason fluoride is added to the formula of FQ’s,and many other “medicines”.

        • L December 3, 2018 at 3:53 pm

          and what makes it all the more dangerous…it can breech the blood/brain barrier.

        • Attsy December 3, 2018 at 10:13 am

          interesting, I am reading this on the internet now:

          “Fluorine is a common element added to pharmaceuticals because it can increase the drug’s selectivity, enable it to dissolve in fats, and decrease the speed at which the drug is metabolized, thus allowing it more time to work. Twenty to thirty percent of drugs contain the element, including some of the most widely prescribed drugs such as well-known antibiotics, anti-inflammatories, anti-depressants, cholesterol-lowering medications, and some inhaled anesthetics.”

        • L December 3, 2018 at 4:08 pm

          yeah it sucks because fluoride is toxic on its own, and as I mentioned in another post, it also allows the flq to breach the blood brain barrier

        • Tricia December 3, 2018 at 9:15 pm

          L, where can you get biofilm disruptors? I just recovered from a kidney infection that I guess began as a uti, although it seemed the infection went straight to my kidneys. I was on Bactrim for over 10 days. Although I had no side effects w bactrim , I hate having to take antibiotics and wish there was a way to naturally cure a uti (other than d_mannose and cranberry juice)

        • L December 3, 2018 at 11:14 pm

          Hi Tricia. There are several. I have read that Nattokinase (an enzyme), NAC (N-acetyl cystene, which has a lot of great uses) and even curcumin are disrupters. But, if it were me, I would try either Lactoferrin (Jarrow), or Biofilm defense (Kirkman) or Interfase Plus (Klaire Labs.) I imagine there are others as well. You can buy them online from various sources and may even be able to find the Jarrow at a Health food store. (I order from Vitacost because shipping is free at $49, and I just wait til I need a few things.)

      • Andrea December 3, 2018 at 2:54 pm Reply

        Don. Thanks for sharing your story. I have lots of respect for you and your age. I can only imagine what’s like to struggle with all this madness at 84… I remember you’ve already posted something about getting floxed years and years ago. If I might ask, what were/are your symptoms? I’m talking about the prostate infection. Plus, why do you write that the young and money hungry urologist transformed a simple UTI into a chornic prostate infection? Is it because, with the use of antibiotics, he allowed the infection to become persistent? Thanks.

    • L December 3, 2018 at 9:12 am Reply

      Same here in the US. It’s like an echo chamber

    • Attsy December 3, 2018 at 9:57 am Reply

      I also receieved this information about reduction in the use….but it’s still prescribed here in middle Europe like bonbons. These ATBs are very favorite because they kill everything so the doctors have less work, unfortunately it can also kill the person but noone will tell you this.

  4. Andrea December 3, 2018 at 6:03 am Reply

    Here’s my tought :
    Id’ like to see how many people would take FQs if the doctor who’s prescribing it would tell them like this “Ok, I’ll give these pills for your sinusitis. They’re pretty safe, I use them all the time. Oh, just one thing. There’s a 10/15 % chance your health would be completely destroyed for the rest of your life, even after just one pill. You could experience permanent nerve damage, DNA/mitochondrial alteration, excruciating pain all over your body, hearing issues, sight issues, tendonds rupture even if your sitting on your chair, insomnia, digestive issues etc. It’s basically a russian roulette you’re playing” They should put something like this on the warning label instead of ” Just don’t do any physical activity for the time you’re taking the medication, and don’t expose yourself to the sun, and then you’ll be good to go” like that idiot told me 2 years ago…

    • Don M December 3, 2018 at 8:50 am Reply

      Andrea………….. Nothing wrong with that thought.

    • L December 3, 2018 at 9:46 am Reply

      and then they have the nerve to say “stop taking if you notice any of these side effects.” Only by then it’s too late!

      • Andrea December 3, 2018 at 2:58 pm Reply

        That’s the dumbest s**t they could come out with. That’s exactly what I’ve done.That’s exactly what many of us do. But, sorry…too late

    • Attsy December 3, 2018 at 9:54 am Reply

      They should put some pictures with people suffering on the box like they do with cigarretes….

  5. M December 3, 2018 at 10:21 am Reply

    Hi all,

    I’ve just gotten a new mattress (Stearns and Foster – traditional spring + one layer of memory foam on top) and was sleeping on it well for a few weeks but have just started feeling a relapse of my FQ symptoms. They seem especially bad right when I wake up. Mostly neurological-type stuff — head pressure, brain fog, dizziness, muscle twitching. They continue throughout the day. It feels like I’ve had a brand new reaction.

    I know that some people are concerned about toxic chemicals/materials in standard mattresses, but I never imagined it would give me an actual relapse/new reaction!? Is that crazy? Has anyone else felt worse from a mattress? Or perhaps it is because my body is in sort of a different alignment as I sleep?

    I can’t imagine what else it could be. I have been on the same diet for quite awhile now (paleo, all organic, try to limit fluoride as much as possible) and the diet has not changed. I’ve been working out more, but that has been ongoing since July. The only major change in my life in the last several weeks has been the mattress.

    Any insight?

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 3, 2018 at 10:24 am Reply

      Might there be any fluoride involved in memory foam fabrication?

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 3, 2018 at 1:20 pm Reply

      Whe3re there is Fluor Free Foam, there will probably be foam WITH fluor as well:

      https://efectis.com/en/testing-extinguishing-qualities-fluor-free-foam-accordance-annex-h-en-1568-32008/

      You might be (extra) sensitive for one of the other components of the foam,or other parts of the mattrass as well. Chemical stuff will always be a risk for floxies because of the mitochondrial damage,which makes the cells more accessible for chemicals and other toxines (that was the reason to add the fluoride to the Cipro,in the first place.Second reason: money!).

      • M December 3, 2018 at 2:12 pm Reply

        Thanks Henk. Well I’m fairly certain its the mattress causing my issues. Now I have no idea how to find a new one that is safer for me. My old one is gone. What a nightmare.

        • L December 3, 2018 at 4:11 pm

          OK, I know nothing about these mattresses but on their site they say “nontoxic” you might contact them and ask if they use foam…or what they do use and then search that. It’s one of those “bed in a box’ things so you wouldn’t have to go pick it up. (I am not sure where you are, I guess I made the assumption the US, which I shouldn’t have.) https://purple.com/mattresses/purple-mattress

    • Andrea December 3, 2018 at 3:13 pm Reply

      M, this is just my opinion, so I could be wrong of course, but I doubt your symptoms are related to the mattress. I remember during my worst “floxie outbreak”, two summers ago,weaking up was one of the worst part of the day. I was dizzy, confused and tremendously tired. I was too trying to understand what I was “doing wrong”, but I think that, with the exception of caffeine and the extremely hot temperature, nothing was influencing my symptoms.
      Remember that these symptoms are very tricky. Sometimes you feel good , the next few hours you feel like crap again.
      I’ll give you an example : Even if I noticed that eating healhty it’s very important for my symptoms, in the last few months I let myself go with food. Remember, I don’t drink, smoke or do recreational drugs. Sport was my “drug”, and I really love food.
      Now even if in the last few months I was eating lots of crap, I was doing quite good, in floxie terms. On the other hand, there’ve been periods of time, where I was doing everything right, but still the pain in my ankles, for example, were terrible.So who knows…

      • L December 3, 2018 at 4:19 pm Reply

        I posted my sofa saga a while ago, but during my 2nd year of being floxed, while still quite ill, I had ordered a leather loveseat thinking leather was a healthier choice, because it is impenetrable to dust mites and I though it might also shield from what is inside. WRONG! SO toxic! Apparently they way they treat it is highly toxic. Anyhow I was still have olfactory issues, and once I took the plastic off, I thought the smell would choke me and I couldn’t breathe. Sadly the driver was gone already. I live in a small place and I knew I could not stay the night with it inside. I immediately contacted the store and they said they were going to tell the driver to come back. He didn’t. He got different order from a different boss. I was on the phone with three different people for 6 hours, trying to get the thing out of my place. They finally just hired some local guy to pick it up in his old dirty truck, just to get it out. I totally believe M is reacting to the bed. They are not healthy for anyone but we are already at such a fragile threshold. https://savvyrest.com/info/does-memory-foam-contain-toxic-chemicals

    • Andrea December 3, 2018 at 3:17 pm Reply

      You should probably do a test : sleeping for a few nights in another mattress, or even better, in another room, and see how you fell

      • M December 3, 2018 at 3:32 pm Reply

        Thank you for the feedback, I appreciate it. I do hope you’re right. It will be such a nightmare if it is the mattress.

        I just think it is too strong of a coincidence. I have felt consistently ok for about a year and a half, following the same routine and diet. And then after sleeping on this mattress for a few weeks, and changing nothing else, all has gone to hell. I did notice that it has a strong chemical smell. I figured worst case scenario I would wake up with a normal headache. I never in a million years would expect it to cause a new reaction. I hope I am wrong and it is as crazy as it sounds.

        I wish I could sleep in another room…I live in a studio apartment in NYC 😦

        • Andrea December 3, 2018 at 3:56 pm

          Uhm…strong chemical smell. Last week I’ve changed the window fixtures in my apartment. The first night there was a strong smell of that foam the workers used to seal the windows. I immediately started to get an headache followed by that crappy sensation of light headness. It was similar to floxie symptoms. As a matter of fact, I was scared; I was experiencing a relapse but as soon as I opened all the windows and breathed some freash air I started to get better. So, it could be that, but sill, who knows. Try, during the day, to let the windows opened, and don’t cover the mattress. Let it loose that strong smell, if you can.

        • L December 3, 2018 at 4:24 pm

          I live in a studio too, so I feel your pain. The thing is, even not sleeping on it, it is still outgassing toxins…

    • L December 3, 2018 at 3:56 pm Reply

      I had the same concerns. I was looking for a new loveseat and there are so many toxins in polyurathane foam. I spent MONTHS trying to find something I could afford. I finally found one with just polyster fiberfill and no foam. It also has no scotch guard or anything like that on the fabric (more toxins!) I would not be at all surprised if you were reacting to your new bed.

      • M December 3, 2018 at 4:58 pm Reply

        Thanks for your feedback L. I was thinking of trying this one:
        https://www.avocadogreenmattress.com

        • L December 3, 2018 at 5:49 pm

          oooh. 100%latex. NICE! That looks really good!

        • L December 3, 2018 at 5:49 pm

          btw I order latex pillows through bed bath and beyod

      • M December 3, 2018 at 7:06 pm Reply

        Thanks for validating that it looks good. I thought so too. God I just hope this isn’t a long lasting setback. I have to believe that once I get this current mattress out I will start to feel better, unless I’ve kickstarted some relapse :-/

  6. Attsy December 4, 2018 at 8:04 am Reply

    Hi guys, how long did it take for you to feel normal again? How many months?
    Just wanted to thank you for Lactospore recommendation. First lactobacillus pills that I don’t vomit.

    Thank you!

    • Darko pet December 4, 2018 at 8:32 am Reply

      I have been trying to recover for around 9 weeks but no improvement at all. Muscles twitching, pins and needles continues complete with fatigue. From research that I have done, it depends on your body and guess is a number of weeks/months.
      What are your main symptoms?

      • Madge hirsch December 4, 2018 at 9:51 am Reply

        If you are completely better in months you are very lucky. Many of us here are plodding on with this for several years. I am more than 3 years from my last dose of Cipro ( one capsule only) and my tendonitis is still an issue. I feel less bad overall but still have to rest far too much for my liking . My legs hurt a lot and I get tendonitis elsewhere too and some neuropathy . FQ toxicity can be a long haul.

      • Attsy December 5, 2018 at 4:28 am Reply

        very bad diarrhea with weight loss, stomachache, I feel like I have some virus like flu – pain in joints, night sweats and anxiety with heart beating, nerve pain, the symptoms come in waves, like 2 weeks its awful than it gets better for a while and then it starts again, sometimes I experience weird symptoms like excessive hair fall, gum bleeding…thank you a lot for your answer

        • L December 5, 2018 at 10:41 am

          Hey Attsy…I had all that too (among other things.) I lost 36 pounds in 2 weeks. Lived on smoothies for most of the first year. You need to slowly build back your good gut microbiome. I would steer clear of gluten, dairy, GMOs. Use good quality probiotics with at least 30 billion units, and several different strains. I found digestive enzymes helpful, and for the first two years I used Hcl Betaine with any proteins meas. (THat’s tricky to find the optimal amount but I had an ND help me. After trial an error I was taking 5 with each meal with 14 gr or more of protein, and slowly got down to one. Again, it’s a difficult supplement to navigate on your own.

          I also had hair come out in chunks in the shower. These are after all chemo drugs. That stopped after the first year. And I felt so sick…like when I had double pneumonia. I could barley shuffle the few feet to the bathroom. The pain I had went away after I started IVs…it felt like it was buried deep in the bone but in the middle of my back. My joints experienced more popping sensations and pain only when I used them, like walking up stairs (which I had to stop).

          Believe it or not once your gut starts getting better, other things will fall to the side. Your gut is connected to every system in your body, and they are now linking it to disieases like cancer, Altzheimer’s, Parkinsons, and so on. So healing your gut is priority one.

        • Attsy December 5, 2018 at 12:13 pm

          Thank you a lot L! This whole experience left me very scared and confused. I can be only happy that internet and information exist now.

        • L December 5, 2018 at 12:32 pm

          Yes, I am thankful for the internet (and LISA for putting together this amazing site.) I started having side effects after ONE pill (discovered I had taken fluoroquinolones in the past but just didn’t remember the names—so I guess I had reached my threshold. Plus I was on prednisone at the time). Anyhow I stopped at four pills (and already at that point my body was destroyed head to toe), but I would likely have taken all of then and just wondered what the hell had happened to me.

          These toxins have been around for decades. Just think of how many people had NO idea what hit them. And of course the doctors were (are) equally ignorant of all this. They were surely misdiagnosed as having chronic fatigue, lupus, Epstein Barr, you name it. In fact, I can also thank this site for the ND who ended up saving me. Someone else had been to him who was floxed, and she posted his name on a spreadsheet that is on here somewhere. (Not all the doctors on there are familiar with FLQs so not sure why they got on, other than they were maybe more caring.) But if I hadn’t connected with him, I really don’t think I would be here today.

        • Madge hirsch December 9, 2018 at 5:17 pm

          The cycling is normal. At least you are getting some let up. Eventually you will get longer periods of feeling better but cycles of feeling crap could continue for a while and it’s often hard to know what has set off the relapse. I have just got used to being in pain most days. It has become the new normal.

    • L December 4, 2018 at 10:31 am Reply

      We are all different. I know how desperately everyone wants to know “when will I be better?” but the answer is always “it depends.” Some are more damaged than others. We all try different supplements, IVs, other modalities. We go it alone or are helped by NDs, integrative doctors, acupuncturists, etc. We start our at different levels of health. There are just so many variables, so asking when someone else felt more normal, doesn’t really have one answer. I got past the most nightmarish side effects after about 1 1/2 years. But I was still dealing with meniscus issues; fluid around the heart (now permanent that has to be monitored); vision issues (ongoing); fatigue; phantom scents; tinnitus, and a few other things. I am now more than 3 12 years out and still dealing with all that, and now have had a nose/throat/chest congestion issue that may or may not be related to the cipro. (I think it is possibly mast cell activation disorder whose symptoms can change over time…and tinnitus, hives, and interstitial cystitis are all symptoms that I have had post cipro.)

      Things that have a better time gage and treatments. For example, I had prolozone injections in both knees for torn meniscus. IT takes several months for the effects to work as the body heals itsef.

      • Attsy December 5, 2018 at 4:29 am Reply

        thanks L, I am very sorry for what is happening to you :(, this is really very long time, hope you will heal fully soon

        • L December 5, 2018 at 10:45 am

          Thank you. I hope we all heal. I hope someone discovers how to turn this toxin off.

  7. M December 4, 2018 at 9:53 am Reply

    I posted yesterday about my new mattress nightmare, but I just can’t help but vent a little more. The tendons in my legs are now rapidly becoming more and more sore each hour, which have no bothered me to this extent in years. In addition to terrible brain fog, head pressure, twitching and tingling.

    This is CRAZY. I have not taken a Fluoroquinolone since 2009, nearly a decade. And a MATTRESS is giving me a relapse? Seriously, excuse my language, but what the fuck.

    I thought worst case scenario a new mattress would give me a sniffle or a headache. But it is bringing back all of my FQ symptoms?!? Why!?!? Even when I am way from the mattress for most of the day my symptoms are progressing. This makes no sense, but there is nothing else that I can imagine is causing this. Unreal. I’m so careful with my diet and my daily activities and have been going strong for a long time. It’s like the universe just had to find some way to hit me again.

    • L December 4, 2018 at 10:38 am Reply

      WTF indeed. I am livid that Bayer and Jansen spend so much in advertising and not one damn penny to try to figure out how this stuff manages to do so much destruction, and how to fix the millions they have injured. I had a brief window of a few months where (aside from the permanent heart and vision issues) I felt almost back to normal and like I could get on with my old life. That came to halt, and now I am left playing detective again, spending more money, and unable to resume my former life. This stuff is diabolical.

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 4, 2018 at 10:58 am Reply

      Best,for now is,to relax. Stressing yourself is “eating ” lots of magnesium,and probable other minerals as well,and it will not change anything for the better.I had a similar problem,two years ago,right after the Cipro.Just brought my under-blanket,bedcover and pillows (all cotton,with 100% pure wool filling) to the dry cleaner’s and got it back with a nasty chemical smell.Because I had trouble putting it on my bed,sick as I was (kidney stone,bladder infection and a double bleeding in my intestines;I was in a hell of pain and only used Paracetamol),I descided to sleep in it anyway,but the next day even my body had this nasty smell.

      Lucky me:I had just enough money to buy everything new and there was a special offer right at that moment.Despite of me,feeling terrible,I changed the smelly stuff for the new things;had to turn my heavy mattrass as well,because the winter side smelled chemical as well (had just put the winter side up).

      As soon as possible I brought the smelly blankets to another dr\ycleaner,because I thought the first one had done something wrong (dirty installation,or so),but when it came back it had the same smell.I had no earlier experience with dry cleaning;this smel appeared to be “normal”.Part from the chemical for cleaning,and part from something they add to have an even better cleaning,with an odor to “cover” the smell from the chemical

      I put the bedcover close to the central heating and turned it every few days untill,after weeks,the smell had (almost) gone.The underblanket was next.Washed the pillows in a special,natural detergent for wool (it has lanoline in it).Bought this detergent with,and without a natural essential oil;for the pillows I used the one with the essotheric oil (eucalypt) to “cover”the nasty smell.That treatment,and several mmonth of patience,helped get rid of that nasty chemical smell.Now,2 years later,I’m gone put those balnkest on my bed for winter. The “new” blankets will get the same treatment,and after “service”,and I’ll wash the pillows myself.

      I know this will be impossible to do with a mattrass;heat and ventilation,and avoiding inhalation of the fumes as much as possible might,in time,solve the problem.

    • Andrea December 4, 2018 at 3:28 pm Reply

      Jesus Christ M, I’m so angry reading what’s happening to you right now. And also so scared…The more I read the experiences of my fellow floxies, the more I think there’s no turning back. No certain healing. 9 years going strong and now a fu***ng mattress is giving you all this???
      Anyway, you never know if that’s really the cause of your relapse. It defenetly looks like it, but who knows…There was a time when I was almost sure that eating dairy was terrible for my tendonitis, but now I can drink a bottle of milk and not feel a thing.
      Anyway, as Henk suggested, the only thing you can do now, it’s trying to relax. Yeah, I know, it sounds pretty irritating and stupid, but really, what else you can do? And since we’re talking about relax, were you particulary stressed during this time? Are you working a lot? beside being floxed, is it a good time of your life now? I’m asking you all this, because I’ve noticed how better I feel when I do enjoyable things, and when positive things happen to me.
      On the contrary, when I have a bad day, or I have an argument with someone, I defenitely feel worse. Can I ask you, if you don’t mind of course, how was your journey with FQ. How it all started and how things developed? I’m not curious, I just want to get more and more infos about how these drugs are affecting us. Take care.
      Andrea.

    • Attsy December 5, 2018 at 4:43 am Reply

      Hi M, I am very sorry, just to read it and it awful. I would definitely sleep somewhere else and not use the mattress, could not even imagine that this could happen.

    • Madge hirsch December 9, 2018 at 5:35 pm Reply

      I believe I was floxed in 1999 after post flu antibiotics for a chest infection. Back then we did not have internet and it was only after being floxed again in 2014 and 2015 that I found out about floxing. But looking at my symptoms and looking back to health issues I developed back then I was convinced I had been exposed to an FQ. I recovered mostly but in the winter of 2010/2011 I became unwell with what I think now was a relapse of floxing symptoms. I started with chostochondritis and feeling generally feeble and had problems with dropping blood sugar as well as generalised tendonitis. I believe this relapse might have been brought on by the flu jab I had in 2010. I can think of nothing else as I did not take any antibiotics between 1999 and 2014. I had been ok with flu jabs other years but 2010 was the first time they put the swine flu vaccine into the seasonal jab. Who knows what brings back the floxing symptoms. This condition is a mystery. We have been poisoned .

      • L December 9, 2018 at 7:56 pm Reply

        yeah I would assume it was that. Not just the swine flu addition but all the toxic ingredients. My ND told me to never again get a flu shot. (and I actually got the flu the last two times I had the vaccine.) It is now known that even addition to all the other reasons not to take it, the more you get it, the less effective it is.

        • Madge Hirsch December 10, 2018 at 10:43 am

          Yes , I did not really make the connection with the jab at the time. I was too worried about the pain in my chest ( GP sent me off to the cardiologist ) and feeling so weak. So I had it again in the autumn of 2011! I got flu in Feb 2012. Never had it since. Now I rely on NAC and vitamin D.

  8. Attsy December 5, 2018 at 4:39 am Reply

    My relative was prescribed these ATB (Ofloxacin) so she asked me which ATB gave me these horrendous side effects. I advised to see another doctor for second opinion and another doctor gave her the same ATB but with different name (Ciprfloxin). Although she fits almost all the precautions inside the drug list.

    To my own surprise she was fit 15 years ago, now she can barely walk and wakes up in horrendous pain, just learned that she took these ATBS numerous times and already had some knee operations, but she told me she was going to take them anyway :(.

    • L December 5, 2018 at 10:47 am Reply

      Oh no! She will only get worse. I cannot imagine EVER taking Cipro (or the others) again. IF given the choice between a fluoroquinolone or death, I would go for death.

  9. Mike Wallbridge December 5, 2018 at 5:11 am Reply

    How many people take collagen supplements as part of their healing regime? How important is it?

    • Andrea December 5, 2018 at 12:41 pm Reply

      I’ve used collagen peptides in the past for about 2 months. Didn’t noticed much from it.

      • Andrea December 5, 2018 at 12:43 pm Reply

        I was taking about 30 gr a day with MSM powder, who suppsedly works great as a combo but, like I wrote in the previous post…not much

  10. Joanne. December 5, 2018 at 8:03 am Reply

    Hi M,
    It probably is your mattress. Here in the U.S. we had people getting mysteriously deathly sick and come to find out it was their drywall that was made in China and they had some unusual amount of formaldehyde in their products. So I would definitely suspect your matress.

  11. Joanne. December 5, 2018 at 8:12 am Reply

    L,
    After reading your link you posted on Restore I ordered a bottle and I’m already feeling benefits from it , and I’m only on day 4. The most notable benefit is my shoulder pain is almost completely gone.
    Just wanted to say thanks for the link, and hopefully it will continue to help.
    What’s funny is I had ordered Restore about 6 months ago but didn’t use it. I remember thinking “I can’t believe I spent so much money on Dirt water” so disgusted I returned it. Anyhow, I glad you posted that link.

    • L December 5, 2018 at 10:43 am Reply

      wow, that’s great! I actually just ordered a bottle of their nasal spray, hoping it might help with this unending congestion issue I am experiencing.

      • Joanne. December 5, 2018 at 12:03 pm Reply

        I pray it helps you. When I was reading comments on it yea there was a lot of people with allergies getting good relief, but there also was a good amount of people that said they had chronic sinusitis for years and it helped them. So good luck and make sure you let us know how it’s going.😊

        • L December 5, 2018 at 12:11 pm

          Thanks. I sure hope so. Don’t think it’s allergies at this point. IT’s been going on 8 months. I was allergy tested and am getting allergy drops for the few things that came up positive. Been playing detective for too long. Ruled out allergies, silent reflux. I still think it might be mast cell disorder from the Cipro. I am on a medication (ugh) that is supposed to help with it, and it helps a little, but certainly does not alleviate it. I have spent too many nights up coughing trying to get stuff out of my lungs…and I have not been able to even get temp work because I never know hour to hour if I am going to be hacking and and making all sorts of awful noises when it’s stuck in my nose and throat. I even ordered a bio film disrupter on the off chance there is something lingering from an old infection. Fingers crossed!

  12. Joanne. December 5, 2018 at 8:20 am Reply

    Also, it’s helping my tendons especially the ones in my ankles and legs.

  13. Cipropoisoned December 5, 2018 at 4:06 pm Reply

    If you have tried Dr. Ghalili’s treatments, please let us know how it helped you. I am considering going to him for the Stem Cell Treatment. Thanks.

    https://floxiehope.com/2018/03/13/floxie-hope-podcast-episode-25-dr-mark-ghalili/#comments

  14. Mike Wallbridge December 6, 2018 at 3:05 am Reply

    My symptoms i.e. pain in legs, back and shoulders had stabilised quite well and I wasn’t feeling much discomfort and pain. But my herbalist has put me on a detoxing regime and I notice signs of detoxing eg flu-like symptoms, furred tongue, bad breath etc. Could these returned pains be part of the detox or just an example of the changeability of toxicity symptoms?

    • L December 6, 2018 at 10:59 am Reply

      Could be…but the furred tongue is suggestive of oral thrush/candida. NO surprise. Many of us get it along with the ravaged gut. Look into candida treatments.

  15. Andrea December 6, 2018 at 6:47 am Reply

    Hi everyone, I’m a bit concerned about tendon rupture. I’m trying to run lately. I’m doing 15-20 minutes of light jogging, almost everyday, and while I notice I feel way better after this activity, the pain in my ankles, expecially in the tendonds are more pronounced. Every scan or ecography I’ve done showes nothing wrong, but is it possible that the rupture appears even after years from the FQ exposure? Also, does running put me in more vulnerable situation, as far as tendonds rupture/damage? I’ve read of people who woke up from bad and their tendonds snapped, so what’s the deal here? I know FQs symptoms are nasty and tricky, but I want your opinion. Am I pushing too hard?

    • A.Coleman December 6, 2018 at 10:57 am Reply

      Andrea – hi I have went back to running as soon as I was physically able post floxing. This means that about 6 months after I was floxed I returned to running. Having said that my floxing issues were much more neurological than they were tendon related. I had some tendon issues in my left leg that popped up after floxing. My left achilles now has a huge knot in it and is always painful after I run. Had some problems with the tendons behind my left knee too.

      Here is the approach I have taken. I stretch religiously before and after running. I do achilles stretches, quad stretches, and a few others lightly before and deeply and prolonged after to keep the tendons from tightening too much.

      When I run I no longer run as fast, far, or frequently as I did pre-floxing. This will be different for everyone – but pre-floxing I ran 2 1/2 miles three days a week and ran one 5K for time and another 10K each week.I was running 22 minute 5Ks before floxing. I now run 1 1/2 miles twice a week and run one 5K each week and the fastest I have run a 5K post floxing is 24:45. For a bit over 3 miles nearly 3 minutes slower is quit a bit. My 10K runs are probably a thing of the past though I have been toying with a speed walking half marathon.

      But I know we are all different and I am sure some people on here with severe tendon problems wouldn’t dare try this. I find that when I do run my neurological symptoms always feel a bit better as I assume running increases blood flow to my legs and feet – which is where most of my neuropathy is. Hurts while I run, but better when I finish.

      I would say try it slowly at first, which is what it sounds like you are doing; make sure to stretch; and give yourself more time for recovery between runs than you did. After that listen to you body and SLOWLY increase the speed and frequency if you want.

      The other thing I have done is started using a rowing machine. Not nearly the same chance for tendon tears but decent cardio. I have also joined my wife in spin class some – think there is less chance for tendon tears there – I just don’t like the hip-hop music they play – lol.

      • Andrea December 6, 2018 at 2:43 pm Reply

        Thanks a lot for your suggestions A. Coleman. Yeah, I too feel a lot better after running, expecially when I stretch my legs/ankles/kness. The “funny” part is that, sometimes when I start to run, or even before, I feel a lot of pain and stiffness in the tendons. After running, I feel a lot better, it just doesn’t last much, and the next day my ankles/tendonds hurts again. Oh, these symptoms are so weird and unpredictable…

        • Anna December 6, 2018 at 3:00 pm

          I too exercise everyday, and have since being floxed 5 months ago. I feel nerves firing off when I run and get random aches, but I push on, and I swear it has been the most helpful thing for my recovery.

        • Andrea December 6, 2018 at 4:38 pm

          Thank you for sharing Anna. Yeah, inactivity it’s the worst, and exercise makes you feel good, but my fear is that if I keep running my tendonds would snap. But, hey, what do I have to lose, right?

    • L December 6, 2018 at 11:02 am Reply

      you might be…but I would like to repeat a suggestion I made before: prolozone (not prolotherapy). It helps the body naturally regenerate after a few months. Now it does have procaine as part of the combination (not to ease the pain but it helps activate the ozone) and I know some have had problems with anesthetics. But I got it, had no problems, and saved my knees. Mine was done by an ND, but many sports medicine doctors now do it (depending on where you live)

      • Andrea December 6, 2018 at 2:46 pm Reply

        What’s the difference beetween prolozone and prolotherapy?

        • L December 6, 2018 at 3:10 pm

          Prolozone is ozone and procaine. Prolotherapy works on the same theory but uses a different substance instead

        • Andrea December 6, 2018 at 4:39 pm

          What did you noticed different after the treatment?

        • L December 6, 2018 at 4:56 pm

          again, it’s so hard to say, because was also doing twice weekly IVs…AND I was damaged head to toe, over thirty side effects including vision, breathing, heart, olfactory damage, nerve damage, tendon issues, popping and cracking in different areas, excruciating pain, large fast weight loss, destroyed guy, hives, and on and on. I felt as bad as you can feel and still be alive. (Oh and major pysch issues too). Becaue I was SO ill, and so many things going on, it is really hard t pinpoint anything. My ND told me it was my best chance for recovery and he had used them on other floxies. I trusted hin 100% so I did it (after I rounded up the money from various sources.) I have to believe that as damaged as I was, they must have played a part in the extent of recovery I have had.

  16. Lea December 6, 2018 at 11:36 am Reply

    Hi, my name is Lea and I think that I just got floxed. After an UTI diagnose, it was prescribed 500mg of cipro during 7 days, 2 times a day. After the second day, my body started to shake, my head started to vibrate. I immediatly googled about the adverse effects of this drug on the internet and stayed in panic. I had no idea of how bad this stupid drug is. Then I went to the ER because I decided to suspend an antibiotic treatment and I know this is dangerous. The doctors of course never heard about the horrible side effects of cipro. So, after taking 7 pills, the last one was tuesday 12/04 night, I’m feeling weak, my body vibrates, I feel like crying all the time, can’t focus, feeling like having a panic attack. I haven’t had muscle pains, and I hope it doesn’t happen to me. So, in your experience, do you think that what I’ve been feeling might have been caused by the drug?

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 6, 2018 at 12:12 pm Reply

      May I ask where you live,Lea? Here,in the EU,there was a hearing of the EMA about the dangers of Cipro and family,and,because of the “new information” the EMA got during this hearing they sent a new set of advices to all doctors NOT to prescribe these extremely dangerous AB’s for an uncomplicated UT-infection. Here you can view the hearing of the EMA (4 hours!):

      • Lukasz December 7, 2018 at 5:18 pm Reply

        Thanks a lot for sharing this video, Henk. Looks like our European compadres are getting it right.

        • Jackie December 10, 2018 at 4:23 pm

          I have lots of memory foam in the house. Pillows, cushions, mattress, mattress topper. Help.

        • L December 10, 2018 at 5:33 pm

          If you have had the items for a while, they may have outgassed the worst of it. Personally, I just don’t want contact with the chemicals. Some, like flame retardant, which is not banned, NEVER completely outgas. Here is a site that talks a bit about it. https://savvyrest.com/info/does-memory-foam-contain-toxic-chemicals

    • L December 6, 2018 at 1:07 pm Reply

      It sure sounds like it Lisa. And shame on your doctor for prescribing it after a warning came out MONTHS ago that flqs should not be used for uti. This is medical malpractice. Hang on to all your paperwork, because you just might want to file a lawsuit…and while it might be the furthest thing from your mind right now, if your side effects continue it can get very expensive to treat.

      The things you want to do right away are get on a good magnesium supplement, like an orotate or glycinate or L-threonate. I took up to 800 mg a day for most of the first year. Also avoid any fluoride, gmos, gluten. Try to eat mostly fruits and veges, organic when possible, and avoid meats raised with antibiotics. Take a high quality probiotic (so much is connected to gut health) with several different strains.

      If you want to share where approximately you live (country, state) perhaps someone on this site can recommend a ND or integrative MD that is familiar with fluoroquinolone toxicity.

      • Anna December 6, 2018 at 2:59 pm Reply

        I was floxed from Cipro, prescribed for a UTI, which didn’t even end up being a UTI – Dr called and said stop taking it b/c I had no bacteria in my urine. This happened 5 months ago in July 2018 – Was the new rule for not prescribing FLQ for UTI made before or after then?

        • L December 6, 2018 at 4:38 pm

          oh that pisses me off! should not be used even in a confirmed uti diagnosis! LAZINESS! And yes the warning was in 2017. Do you live in the US? If so, what state?

        • Anna December 6, 2018 at 5:01 pm

          Hi, L – I am in Miami Beach, FL – I went to the Urgent Care center here in July 2018. Embarrassingly, I ate chili paste on noodles and peed fire the next day, I had handled spicy food in the past and did not make the link between the chili paste and urine discomfort. Dr immediately put me on Cipro, took the urine sample, and then called 3 days later to say the urine had no bacteria. I did not know he should’ve been aware that Cipro isn’t to be subscribed for UTI

        • L December 6, 2018 at 5:09 pm

          You want to look up what the statute of limitations is in florida for medical malpractice. (EG in California it is either one year from the event (of taking the antibiotic) OR a year from the time the plaintiff became aware of the connection to his/her injuries.) this is an important date, because after that you are barred from seeking a claim. You would need to prove damages, so as I said, make sure to keep all records of doctors visits, bills, etc. Then if you end up having lingering or worse issues, and/or you have to stop working because of it, you can try to find an attorney to take your case. That in itself is a challenge. But you want to be prepared. I hope nothing further happens to you, but if it does, as I mentioned, it can become very expensive. I was more damaged than most, but between NDs, Acupuncturists, supplements, Ivs, stem cell it has cost me over $40,000…with no real end in site. None of that covered by insurance. (THe good stuff, the natural stuff isn’t. The toxins? The ignorant doctors? Oh yeah, they’re covered.)

        • Anna December 6, 2018 at 5:15 pm

          Thanks, L – Unfortunately, Florida is not the best state for opening malpractice suits. Florida is, well Florida 😀 I will check further into the laws around this though, in hoped of at least educating or scaring the doctor so he does not do this ti anyone else. I did not know laws had changed in 2017, or that he should have known better based upon the more recent studies./

        • L December 6, 2018 at 5:51 pm

          well most states are pretty anti-plaintiff when it comes to med mal. Here is CA the laws really favor the medical community, making it difficult to find an attorney, because it is just not worth their time money-wise. IT’s like that across much of the country. A group called pubic citizen estimates that something like 97% of all medical malpractice victims will be unable to secure an attorney. And what makes our cases especially hard, is the difficulty in proving causation, since most doctors stick up for other doctors and say “oh, couldn’t be the cipro!” Still it’s possible. I know of cases that were at least settled. (You also want to check out your pharmacy laws. In CA a pharmacist is required to consult a patient on any new or changed medication. Signing that little electronic box doesn’t cut it.)

        • Madge hirsch December 9, 2018 at 5:50 pm

          Before.

    • L December 6, 2018 at 1:08 pm Reply

      also do NOT take any NSAIDs or steroids.

    • Andrea December 6, 2018 at 2:56 pm Reply

      I agree with L, Lea. Try not to panic (I know it sounds stupid) and at the same time, while you’re trying to recover, think about a lawsuit. These stupid, ignorant doctors should know very well to not prescribe these awful drugs like this. There’re restictions in the US and in Europe as well now. It looks like these dummies would understand it the hard way only. Anyway, take care. And feel free to ask everything.

    • Lukasz December 7, 2018 at 5:31 pm Reply

      Lea,

      100%, without doubt, related to the drug. Listen to L and her recommendations. You’ll be better off.

  17. Flox December 6, 2018 at 3:01 pm Reply

    Hallo,
    i am 19 months postflox and i have alot of eye problems like dry eyes, vitreous detachment, keratitis, blepharitis, alot of floaters and lights.
    Now i am seeing around car lights halos and starburst.

    Has anyone experienced the same problem with this starbursts and halos postflox.
    Is there any explainment for it?

    • L December 6, 2018 at 3:05 pm Reply

      Tons of eye problems. Lots of floaters. Like looking through gauze. Light sensitivity, diminished vision, vitreal detachment, and now macular degeneration. Get an eye exam and start taking vitamins fir the the eyes. I used can c eye drops for months and they helped with the floaters

    • L December 6, 2018 at 4:40 pm Reply

      also, the floaters are because cipro attacks all connective tissue, including the vitreous. The rest, who knows. Could be nerve damage, mitochondrial damage.

    • Anna December 6, 2018 at 4:57 pm Reply

      Actually, I just went to a third eye specialists today at Bascom Palmer. This time I was seen by an Ocuplastic Surgeon, because she specialized in the orbital area and not just the eye. She concluded that initially when being floxed the tendons in my eye may have tightened, but that now she does not think the tendons are the problem, but an immune response type swelling is in muscles around the eye are causing the discomfort. The eye itself has been examined multiple times by a Neuro-Ophthalmologist and the eye itself is very healthy. Therefore, it is pretty clear eye pain does not always mean the eye itself is hurt, but could be inflammation or damage occurring around the eye, in muscles/tendons. The Ophthalmologist went on to say Rhuemotologists and steroids are the go to for this issue and she suggested avoiding steroids at all costs.

      • L December 6, 2018 at 5:02 pm Reply

        She sounds smart! Stick with her. All the eye specialists I have seen are too free with steroids. And steroids are so toxic, not just for us. but for everyone. They actually destroy all the tissue at the site of injection. (It’s funny when I first read your post I thought “what’s a third eye specialist? For someone with 3 eyes? Or is the the third eye some metaphorical thing.)

        • Anna December 6, 2018 at 5:09 pm

          lol, that is funny L! 🙂 I mean to say I am on my third appointment with a “specialist” in an effort to understand what happened with my eyes. Aching in behind the eye/ particularly in the upper orbital rim, and swelling in the under eye muscle that happened overnight with the Cipro issues. She can only guess at this point it is tissue/muscle swelling due to auto immune response. She recommended the medicine called TIME. She was better than some of the other so-called physicians I’ve seen since this whole ordeal. I think some of what floxies deal with, or a lot, it auto-immune and neurological making it harder to target, understand, diagnose. It’s like a batch of traveling and alternating side-effects, random bought of inflammation causing discomfort and nerves firing off incorrectly. Taking Cipro is like getting your airplane pilot high on drugs and then wondering why the flight isn’t smooth.

        • L December 6, 2018 at 5:45 pm

          good analogy…or in my case, I was flying blind for a while. Since this happened in 2015 I have seen two opthamologist and SIX retinal specialists! The floaters were so bad for most of the first year, it was like I was looking through a sheet of gauze. Light sensitivity was actually painful. I still have it, but much less. What was really scary was the drop in acuity. I remember posting this a long long time ago, but one of my guilty TV pleasures used to be Storage Wars. If you’re not familiar with it, in the lower left of the screen they would tally how much their discoveries were worth. I could see that just find pre-cipro. Post cipro, for months, I could not even make out who the people were on the screen. So scary.

          One of my first side effects was a golf ball size swelling on the inner wrist, over the ulnar nerve and tendon. The welling went down, but I still had some swelling for a couple years. (Even now, 3 1/2 years later, I can still make out a tad. I ended up having a scan done to see if the tendon was ruptured. It all came back fine—as most tests do.

        • Anna December 6, 2018 at 6:45 pm

          Wow, I get so upset hearing about this 😦 I keep getting blood spots under my skin when I move a lot, and weird tingling all over the legs, probably vascular and neurological . Initially, my vision light sensitivity was also painful–I was led into the ER by my arm, wearing sunglasses, with my eyes closed. I thought at the time my retina had torn, but that wasn’t the issue, it was only swelling behind the eye. Oddly, neurological issues in the eye and muscle/tendon swelling can cause light sensitivity and pain. The swelling brought on in random tissue is one of the great mysteries about Cipro effects. And, of course, swelling is a painful and toxic problem by itself.

        • L December 6, 2018 at 7:20 pm

          Yeah I think a lot of it is nerve damage. And I had so much : the nightmarish olfactory overload (understatement) fingers spasming out of Control, tinnitus, and here I am almost years later and my toes are all still numb.

  18. L December 6, 2018 at 5:52 pm Reply

    Oh dear. The one time I really need that reply button and it is not there. Of course I meant to say public citizen, not pubic! 🙂

    • Anna December 6, 2018 at 6:49 pm Reply

      L, it sounds like maybe your Optic Nerve was affected. Did any of your specialists determine the health of your optical nerve? Or, did they think it was retina damage?

      • L December 6, 2018 at 7:28 pm Reply

        No. They don’t see any issues with the nerve. All physical damage. I mentioned before that the proliferation of floaters is vitreous detachment. They didn’t say so but I have read that they have now linked macular degeneration to mitochondrial death snd we know flqs damage Mito. As far as the light sensitivity, who knows. I also was overly sensitive to loud noises and to all scents. The auditory sensitivity went away but left tinnitus behind. Sadly no one really knows how all this damage is done

  19. Lukasz December 6, 2018 at 10:46 pm Reply

    Anyone developed Diverticulitis? I’m having some serious lower abdominal pain of late and it’s driving me nuts. Might have to go on a liquid diet soon to get things under control.

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 7, 2018 at 5:33 am Reply

      I had diverticul,2 years ago,in the upper part of my intestines,and a bleeding in the lower part.And a bladder infection,caused by a kidney stone,stuck between my bladder and the toilet pot.All in the same time,and that was the reason that my doc gave me the Cipro.The divertical was caused by Flecainide Acetaat.

      In the hospital they prescribed me laxetate to make my stool looser for easier passage.It was a synthetical fiber ( all for the patent,and the money,of course!).Terrible stuff;made me exxtremely windy,with a smell that came right out of hell! Didn’t dare to go visit friends and while shopping I run through the shop,trying to hide my resposability for the nast smell.

      Then I descided to quit that synthetic fiber and go for natural: psylium husk.A little experimenting with the daily dose and: problem solved.When I informed my doc about quiting the Macrogol (the synthetic fiber),and now using Psyllium,she got,again angry on me (“Are you playing doctor,yourself,again?”) Well;I learned my lesson, having to solve all the problems she and other doctors gave me with their poisons. Most doc-made problems are not fully reversible but trusting on them (docs),untill now hasn’t helped a bit and only made matters worse.

      I think that psylium and drinking as much as possiblle might be a way to get rid of abdominal pain, But it will only help when the cause is a too dry stool.The pain might be caused by a totally different cause; bladder infection,prostate problem or even too tight muscles of your underbelly because of stress.

      • Lukasz December 7, 2018 at 1:56 pm Reply

        Thanks for your input, Henk. It’s obvious from your account that these antibiotics are being prescribed for maximum profits. Doctors know these drugs don’t fix a damn thing but their brain-washed mentality leads them to prescribe them for three reasons 1) it gets you out of their office and makes you believe it’s the solution to your problems 2) it makes them a boatload of money 3) it’s all they know after being brainwashed by Big Pharma Universities. As for your doctor’s arrogant response, it’s a classic alright. I’m sure they say this kind of stuff to patients all the time. They try to control us like we’re farm animals. Like you, I had to come to the realization that most of them are not on this planet to help me, but to make money off me, the hard way. Lesson learned.

        My stool has been in shambles as of late. Very pale in colour and food stuck to it on the outside. It’s quite close to diarrhea levels. Sorry for the graphic description. This tells me that my body is STILL not digesting food properly. Along with this lower right side abdominal pain, something feels very off. I did eat greenhouse grown tomatoes and there’s no NON-GMO label on them. This makes me wonder if the tomatoes are causing these issues. I also thought it was a new tea I started up, licorice root, since teas have been problematic for me since the floxing but it’s hard to say which one is the culprit and it could be something completely else. I may have to do a elimination protocol to get to the root of the problem. Luckily, the pain is less severe today.

        • Lukasz December 7, 2018 at 1:57 pm

          One more thing…

          Dr. John Bergman has a great video up about how to reverse diverticulitis. This video, in my opinion, would also be of interest to anyone who’s taken antibiotics or been vaccinated, in other words, all of us. As much as I despise doctors, this is one doctor I wouldn’t mind being under the care of. Good sense of humor, knows his stuff and is not a pill pusher. Western doctors could learn a whole lot from this guy. If you want to watch the video I’m talking about, find Dr. John Bergman Diverticulitis – Cause and Solution video on YouTube.

        • Henk Noordhuizen December 7, 2018 at 2:56 pm

          Hi Lukasz,I want to correct your idea about the efficiency of Cipro a bit:recent studies show it is about 20 % effective in UTI’s,so well worth the risk of all those severe and sometimes permanent adverse reactions.Or is it??

          After my first AB-course,wit Amoxicilline and Metronidazole,I had the same problems with my stool;very loose,sometimes very pale for a while,and most of the time with regognizable pieces of food in it.Also couldn’t eat sugar,could hardly eat any carbs without getting a hyper-,and a half hour later a hypoglycemia.This lasted for 3 years,and to my big suprise I gained weight (and quite a lot!) while eating almost nothing,compared to what I ate before that course.Now I know (Dutch/Belgian discovery!) that the AB’s killed all my Akkermansia bacteria;those control your weight.

          In the meantime I rediscovered the Bob Beck Protocol,descidet to build the Blood Purifier and the Magnetic Pulser (their original names),not for myself but for friends with cancer (my favorit brother just died of blood cancer,and a very good friend of pancreatic cancer,and I wanted to have something to offer as an alternative,in case another friend would get cancer,or another serious illness.When finished building I descieded to try them on myself first,and to my big suprise,after just 2 weeks both the loose stool ánd the crazy bloodsugar swings were mostly gone.As far as I remember at that time I only used the magnetic pulser.You can build one yourself;only things you need are an old electronic photo flash,a piece of double wire and a coil,like discribed on the bobbeck website.

          The Lactospore I use since a while is great as well;it helps your intestinal bioflora to recover and is acid resistant.For people with such hefty intestinal proble3ms you’d best combine it with high quality probiotica and good quality food.Avoid everything with conservatives in it (those kill your intestinal bacteria),and feed your pré- and probiotica with a daily dose of inuline.And then: may the best win :-))

          After 2 days of Cipro I didn’t have loose stool (might be because “my” Flecainide Acetate makes the stool very hard and compact) but Hyper- and Hypoglycemia were back like after that first course. After a month I descided to use the magnetic pulser again and it worked like it did before,but after I stopped pulsing it came back in a while.I just stopped premature,so I restarted pulsing and now I still pulse almost every day.My pancreas is less important now;my sugar level is quite stable,so now I use it on my lungs,my teeth and my eyes,and everywhere there’s pain.Doesn’t do much good for my eyes :-((

        • Lukasz December 7, 2018 at 5:03 pm

          lol… 20% effective you say? No wonder doctors are handing it out like candy!

          I took Metronidazole as part of a triple “therapy” for the eradication of h. pylori, along with Clarithromycin and some PPI, it wrecked my stomach good. I’ve never had a normal stool since. Not only that, but I’ve been unable to regain the weight I lost after this combo treatment and I’ve tried nearly everything to put the weight back on. It seems to have altered vital processes. From what I’m reading, you’ve done your due research on what these antibiotics do to the gut.

          I’m going to add Inulin as per your suggestion. If it’s my good for my gut, it’s on my list of supplements. Thanks a lot for the suggestion.

          Sorry to hear about your brother and good friend. It’s terrible that we live in such times that getting cancer is almost a certainty. That’s awesome that you were able to build these gadgets. Even better that they’re helping you cope with the symptoms of toxicity. We gotta keep up with what works. That’s what I’ve learned over the past 4 years. It takes effort but the payoff is worth it.

          Re: the pancreas, Dr. Bergman recommends placing a hot compress in that vicinity as it has the potential to penetrate through the skin and tissue and provide the nerves and organs a much needed and deserved rest. I’ve just bought a hot bottle compress from an online retailer and hope to try this out soon.

          For your remaining issues, have you tried iodine supplementation?

    • Madge hirsch December 9, 2018 at 6:14 pm Reply

      I developed diverticulitis which led to me being floxed with iv Cipro in 2014. What I have never considered is whether it was as a result of previous floxings that I was unaware of-that is that the ill health I was suffering was due to having been poisoned. I believe I was floxed in 1999. One of the symptoms I got later was terrible pain in my coccyx. My GP sent me for a barium enema in 2001 just to make sure nothing sinister was going on higher up and they told me I had a few diverticuli but that was normal for someone my age. In 2014 I got my first infection and was given the iv Cipro/ Flagyl combo. This year in March I had 26 cm removed from my colon. The surgeon said that despite antibiotics in Jan for another attack there was still infection and eventually I would have perforated. In between the two attacks I was hospitalised for I had several lesser attacks that I controlled with liquid / low fibre diet but still the condition progressed. If you get a barium enema or colonoscopy they will be aable to tell you if you have diverticulitis and how widespread it is. If you need abx Augmentin will work .

  20. Cipropoisoned December 6, 2018 at 11:34 pm Reply

    Close to 7 years and I am experiencing new symptoms :-(. As of a few days ago, after about a week of muscle twitches in my chest and legs, I am beginning to notice pins and needles in my legs, face and hands :-(. This is the first time I am experiencing this. I had burning pains around my ankles in the first two years, but this is new after almost 7 years since I took the last cipro pill. Any recommendation(s) is appreciated. Just a bit of background, my current cycle began with night sweats, headache, finger pains, ankle and heel pain, and loose stools.

  21. Cipropoisoned December 6, 2018 at 11:35 pm Reply

    I might add that I mainly feel the pins and needles when I am supine in bed or resting on the couch.

    • A.Coleman December 7, 2018 at 8:09 am Reply

      Cipropoisoned – only suggestion that comes immediately to mind is what are your current supplementation regimines for B vitamins and Mg? If you are not taking both I would suggest starting on a good quality B complex that includes Methylcobalmin form of B12. Based on your MTHFR status consider methylated forms of folate (B9) and B6 in the B complex. Several good options out there – just remember you get what you pay for.

      As to the Mg, must assume you are supplementing that still. If not recommend resuming. And if you are supplementing would suggest adding in Epsom salt baths if you are not using them. At least 2 a week and use at least 4 cups of Epsom salt per bath. Soaking the Mg in directly where it is needed helps me as I think my body sometimes thinks it is needed in other places and the supply I need to feet and legs is limited. Transdermal gets it to the nerves in the skin directly. This can get expensive and if only your feet were affected I would say using a foot bath that you reuse would work. You might also want to experiment with a high quality MgCl spray for your face. Spray it on a wash cloth and rub on face.

      Sounds like you are experiencing some of the autonomic nerve problems that all of us floxies suffer. IMO because some latent poison (cipro) that your body had safely sequestered away somewhere made it into your circulating systems.

      Good luck – never good to hear about someone 7 years out with a relapse.

      • Cipropoisoned December 7, 2018 at 8:37 am Reply

        Hi, thank you for your response. I stopped taking all supplements and vitamins after about six months of the poisoning. I will re-initiate Magnesium and Vit. B Complex; I have nothing to loose. Yes, almost 7 years of daily symptoms of one organ or another. I was hoping to be looking back and say the nightmare is done with, but it seems that the nightmare is permanent. I don’t write here often because I don’t want to discourage new floxies. Loom and doom is not something they should be reading. However, the truth must be told that this poisoning can last many, many years in some people, especially in those who have been exposed to Fluoroquinoloes multiple times. The good news is that many people go back to their normal health within months to few years. I am just not that lucky or fortunate. Despite the on-going symptoms, in many ways I am much, much better. I can walk more, I have less ankle and finger pains, the anxiety and depression have for the most part resolved…I can handle the aches and pains. The worst, absolute worst symptoms were the anxiety and the almost stop urge to end my life in the first 6 months when the poisoning began. Now, I am mostly back to my happy life with intermittent health bumps.

        • Dee December 7, 2018 at 10:02 am

          cipropoisoned, Did you take multiple rounds of FQs or get floxed after only 1 time of taking it?? Was just curious since you mentioned being exposed multiple times??

        • Cipropoisoned December 7, 2018 at 1:04 pm

          Hi Dee, as I go through my medical records, it looks like I had taken it once before around 2004. I had minor symptoms heel pain, headache, dry nose, but I attributed them to everything else but the CIPRO. So, I have used CIPRO twice.

  22. Dee December 7, 2018 at 4:40 pm Reply

    Cipropoisoined, I could be mistaken but were you the one that said you had been anxious and stressed recently and took antidepressants?? Someone who had a relapse mentioned it?? If it was you I was thinking the medication or the fluoride in a lot of antidepressants could cause a relapse?? I apologize if it wasn’t you who mentioned it as I think there were two of you recently on floxie home talking about having a relapse. I sure hope it is short lived for you!!!

  23. Andrea December 7, 2018 at 5:40 pm Reply

    Hey Henk, can you explain to me what’s a blood purifier? also, what’s the sota silver pulser?
    I already read a lot about the magnetic pulser, but the silver pulser I can’t really understand the thepry behind it.
    Thank you.

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 7, 2018 at 6:13 pm Reply

      Well,the original name Bob Beck gave to the Silver Pulser is Blood Purifier.Because Blood Purifier is,in fact,a medical claim,Bob changed the name to Silver Pulser (more politiccaly correct ;-)) .It not only sents little electric pulses through your blood,killing bacteria,virusses,fungi and amoebe,but it can also make good colloïdal/Ionic Silverwater (it’s a two in one device)..The name “Silver Pulser” ,and the design,originally made by Beck,are,with his permission,used by Sota because Beck was very impressed by the professional way the Sota owner designed a more professional,commercial version to sell to people who are not able,or interested,in building them themselves.They,later on,became real good friends.

      Don’t forget that the goal for Bob Beck was,to design these devices to be as simple (but also effective) as possible because he wanted to spread his knowledge,and the possibility to build your own devices,via the internet.He knew that,this way,no government nor corporation could stop him from taking away this way of self-treatment and self-curing for the people.He didn’t want to earn any money with this inventions.

      The Magnetic Pulser,in fact,does the same;creating electric pulses in the body. He designed this because he discovered that some virusses (like malaria),micro-fungi,and,maybe,other pathogens are able to hide themselfs from the immune system by entering a human cell;here they are invissible for the immune system.But everywhere in your body,in cells as well,are tint metal particles (iron,copper,zinc etc),and,like in a dynamo of a bike,a changing magnetic field creates an electric current,or pulse in every metal particle within that changing magnetic field.

      The Silver Pulser is great for treating the blood;you use it on bloodvessels that are right under the skin,in wrist or ancle.The magnetic Pulser is ment for deeper tissue,where there is a lesser bloodstream,like (hollow) organs,intestines etc.Together these two make a great way to get rid of pathogens all over the body.

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 13, 2018 at 8:11 am Reply

      About the Magnetic Pulser: Sander (the guy behind the Zapper.nu website) has both the old model MP5 (the one I own),and the new MP6 on his website. The new model has an extra mode which loads faster but penetrates less deep. I,personally,don’t think this fast mode is so important,unless,for impatient persons,and it is € 25 more expensive than the “old” model.So,when you’re short in money,you might consider to buy the older MP5.

      In this manual the difference between both moder (relular and fast mode) are explained:

      https://www.sota.com/files/pdf/manual_mp6.pdf

  24. Andrea December 7, 2018 at 6:37 pm Reply

    But the mganetic pulser is also useful for treating pain in the joints, right?

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 8, 2018 at 3:51 am Reply

      Yes,it is. This technique is,now,also used bu orthodox medicine to treat pain of arthritis.It also works on the infections of the joints but it is obvious that they give those “effective and perfectly safe” medications to the patients anyway.

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 8, 2018 at 4:06 am Reply

      For pain,I use it mainly on my left shoulder;had a bursa infection there (Hope,I spelled it alright),while working in archeolagy.Leaning on one arm,and working with the other in a hole in the ground is nót good for the shoulder of the leaning arm.This shoulder is often painfull,and the MP helps fight the pain.Also helped getting down the pain when after Cipro,first my left,and then my right archilleus tendon where extremely painfull;could hardly walk for several weeks.At that time I started to realize something was wrong with Cipro;you can hurt one arch.tendon,but two? And one after the other? And got that heart pulptations too,from day one.Started a search,found out about floxies and found this website.

      • Andrea December 8, 2018 at 5:07 am Reply

        Thanks Henk. Your advices are always very helpful. Next week I’m going to order the sota pulser.

        • Henk Noordhuizen December 8, 2018 at 1:44 pm

          The Silver Pulser or the Magnetic Pulser? If I could buy just one of both,I’d go for the Silver Pulser because the Magnetic Pulser is so simple to make yourself.Just de-soldering one wire from the Xenon tube,and conect one of the coil wires,to that de-soldered wire,the other to the,now “empty” connection of the xenon tube.In facct,you put the coil in series with the xenon tube.

          The Silver Pulser is a bit more complex;you need basic knowledge of electronics.With this devise you can (electro-)pulse your blood án make a gooed quality Colloïdal/Ionic silverwater.When you don’t intent to use this silver pulser anyway,the Magnetic Pulser will be the logical choice.

          I expect some money before the end of december,maybe early januar and will,at last,buy me the Sota Ozonizer and throw away that chinese piece of rubbish Mediverse sold me.Than My Sota equipment will be complete;

          I’m less interested in the Sota Lightworks,so far.
          I’m curious about the possibillity of the new MP; faster reload,but a less intensive pulse.Good for pulsing on tissue,right under the skin.The standard pulse is used for deeper tissue.Not so very important for me because,while pulsing I always watch a movie,or an old series (Time Team,at the moment :-))

        • Andrea December 8, 2018 at 3:09 pm

          I was thinking about the magnetic pulser. Plus, I’m not very convinced about the silver thing. I’ve read some scary side effects from colloidal silver. I know they’re probably very unlikely to happen, but you know…Another thing I don’t really understand it’s how soemthing that is suppsoed to “clean” your blood, would also make colloidal water. Can you explain that to me. Thanks.

        • Henk Noordhuizen December 8, 2018 at 4:33 pm

          I’m quite curious about what you read about the neg. effects of CS;read a lot of that “fear mongering”,and after having read lots af more scientific reports,and after years of experience, those negative reports are always good for a laugh :-)) In fact,last week there was a consumer tv-program about CS here,and there were a user,a very simple minded man telling that he’d used it for years,and so did his family,and,in times,his neighbours.Then there was a “scientist”, a toxicinolog,telling that it did nothing positive at all (no research done on CS,he said),it was dangerous ( uhhh,didn’t he just tell hardly any research was done?) for your cells and your sperm,and,lucky us,there were plenty of very effective and perfectly safe anti biotics.Well,thát really convinced me ;-)) In fact a lot of research is done and clinics use silver a lot,in treating burn wounds and in heavily infected wounds of diabetics,etc.

          Both what he told about CS and about AB’s were plain lies! I know enough about the scientific research on the safety of CS to be sure the dangerous (for human cells) dose of the most common concentration of CS (6-15 PPM) is much more than you would need to take a bath or drawn yourself:A big lie.Don’t have to tell any of you that AB’s are dangerous.Those might not only change your live in a horroble way but,if you run out of luck,even kill you.This all,in a consumer program that,most of the time,points consumers to fraud and crimes,to protect them.The program makers obviously didn’t do their homework;the white coat of the “scientist (really; he was dressed in white!) did his work again.

          The Silver pulser is,like I wrote,a 2 in 1 device.Bob designed the Blood Purifier to work on 3 9 volt batteries in series =(27-31 volts).This is pulsed and by 2 electrodes,lead through the blood,thereby disrupting the pathogens in the blood.He also found,by experimentation,that that voltage was just enough to produce CS by way of electrolyses.By controling voltage and amperage the silver particles are kept as small as possible,to produce high quality CS.

          In the Sota Silver Pulser only one 9 volt battery is needed because it uses a tripler circuit which,by a step-up system converts the 9 volts to about 30 volts.A friend of mine has build such a tripler for me( I found a diagram for building it),and I took 2 of the 3 batteries out of my homebuilt Silver Pulser/Blood Purifier and put the tripler into the circuit.It gave me the promised 31 volts from the one 9 volt battery,and my device works like a charm.Works even a bit longer than the Sota device,probably because the electronic circuit of my homebuild device is simpler.My homebuild has no CS-generator;I’d built a separate device for that long before I started building my Blood Purifier.

          Sorry,that these explanations are quite long but I try to explain these technical things with not technically educated people in mind, as simple as possible.

          Nice sunday to you all :-))

        • Andrea December 9, 2018 at 8:41 am

          Thanks Henk. You know, it’s not that I don’t belive you, or anyone here on this website, it’s just that using something, that has even the least possibility of something irreversible (eg turning blue) freaks me out. I already did a mistake, like everyone else here, by trusting a docotr and using an AB, and now I’m ust too scared to even trying, soemthing that could be beneficila for me. Anyway I understand the theory behing purifing the blood trough electricity, but I don’t understand how this same electricity can produce silver…Thank you anyway

        • Henk Noordhuizen December 9, 2018 at 9:57 am

          The process of electolyses is known and used for ages,for silver- and goldplating,among others.The Silver Pulser has 2 separate circuits in the box: The Blood Purifier,and the CS generator,both using the same powersource.You can not use both optiona at one time;when micropulsing your blood it’s not possyble to make CS,and while making CS it’s not possible to micropulse your blood;both functions use the same extern connector.

          Argyria (turning gray/blue only happens when consuming extreme amounts of badly made CS.The only cases known are from people speeding up the process of making CS by adding salt;thereby NOT making CS but making silvernitrate.Every black * white photographer knows what this is:a silversalt,which,like silverbromide,is used for photography.Makiing,and using CS,made with salt for speed-up of the progress,in affect,changes you in a lightsessitive photo plate.ALWAYS use ONLY good quality destilled water !!!

          The other cases of argyria were from doctors prescribing patients Silversalt eyedrops,and salves with a silver-proteine composition. And yes:you read it well:DOCTORS knew the antybiotic properties from silver since long time,used,and still use it in many different ways.They can patent silver-impregnated bandages,silver salves etc. but they can’t patent CS;that’s why they use the fear mongering tactic.

        • L December 9, 2018 at 11:20 am

          Just wanted to add that both the ND who I attribute with saving my life, and one of my doctors, an integrative MD who is an internist and pulmonologist, as well as a well-respected Lyme specialist, have both, on different occasions, prescribed colloidal silver for me. If you don’t make your own you need to make sure you are getting a high quality brand, but I have used it for various infections both internally and topically.

        • Andrea December 9, 2018 at 10:43 am

          Thanks Henk. You clarified a lot of things for me. Thanks a lot!

        • Henk Noordhuizen December 10, 2018 at 9:26 am

          Hi Andrea,I hope you’ll enjoy the MP,but I would have felt more comfortable if you’d have experimented with a home-build one first,because of the MP being quite expensive,and building one yourself would have cost you about € 30- € 40. I ,myself,have good experiences for years,with the Magnetic Pulser,the Silver Pulsrer and the Bio Tuner,so,for me,buying the Ozonator in a few weeks from now is not a big risk.Even the Mediverse Ozonator did well,as long as it worked.

        • Andrea December 10, 2018 at 3:01 pm

          Yeah Henk, you’re right, but I’m not very practical with DIY, and I don’t want to miss the oppurtunity to enjoy the real deal. What if I do something wrong and I think that’s because the MP it’s just useless…

  25. A December 10, 2018 at 1:34 pm Reply

    Hi everyone,

    I haven’t commented on her in quite sometime although I do come here and read the recovery stories. Unfortunately, I was floxed in 2013, after receiving Cipro for a UTI. It took 2 pills for me to feel horrible. I discontinued taking them. During the 1st month everything was out of wack. I experienced a lot of pain and clueless doctors. I was thankful for finding this site. I’ve had doctors to want to say RA and then some to say it’s not and don’t know. I guess my question is has anyone been told that they have RA as a result of taking these medications?? I’ve never had problems with any type of arthritis. I’ve read that others have stated that this medication can mimic these types of diseases.

    • L December 10, 2018 at 2:08 pm Reply

      HI A, I was not diagnosed with RA but I, like most others here, were run through a battery of tests including one for auto immune, because the doctors cannot imagine that cipro could do all this, and they assume it must be RA, or lupus, or something else.

      If you should have it, there are a number of recommended natural treatments. I would check out sites of reputable integrative doctors like Drs. Kesser, Mercola, or Hayman. https://drhyman.com/blog/2015/07/24/10-strategies-to-reverse-autoimmune-disease/

      • Anna December 10, 2018 at 5:36 pm Reply

        Yeh, I was just told by a second eye doctor that the swelling in my eye muscles were an auto immune response. Presumably Cipro aggravates underlying auto immune disorders or causes drug induced AI problems. Some think all the aching and swelling is auto immune related, the AI system is flared up from the Cipro and having trouble calming.

    • Andrea December 10, 2018 at 3:08 pm Reply

      Hi A. I don’t have RA, but like many many other FQ victims, I experience lots of pain in the joints, and my hands looks different too. The skin is completley different from what it used to look. They look a lot older overall But every scan or ultrasound I have done shows nothing wrong. Have you tried turmeric and black pepper together, for the pain?

  26. A December 10, 2018 at 7:09 pm Reply

    L, Andrea, and Anna, thanks so much for your responses. It really helps a lot. Andres I just purchased some Tumeric that I’m going to start using, as I’ve heard that it’s very useful. I’m thankful to God that I’m still able to work and function because I know that so many are not able to. Again thank you all very much.

    • Andrea December 11, 2018 at 10:12 am Reply

      Yeah, turmeric, curcumin…I was reading a lot about their antiflammatory propreties, and I don’t really know what to choose. Turmeric as a spice? as an extract? or curcumin? who knows…

      • L December 11, 2018 at 11:26 am Reply

        It should be a turmeric supplement that lists 95% curcuminoids, with the addition of piperine (black pepper)

        • Andrea December 11, 2018 at 5:14 pm

          Thanks L

      • Anna December 11, 2018 at 11:47 am Reply

        I’ve bought everything natural for inflammation and in my experience, it is useless! I tried Turmeric/Black Pepper, Bromelain, Burdock Root, Tart CHerry, on and on and on —- If you truly have auto-immune swelling I do not think that stuff is strong enough to cut it. You have two options: Time or Steroids — I have chosen time, time for the immune system to quiet and calm from the scary experience of Cipro. Right now, I am on the last attempt at treating the inflammation with a supplement called Solomon’s Seal. I think this is doing something, but not enough. I will up the dosage more and see if it works. If Solomon’s Seal works I will report back here.

        • L December 11, 2018 at 12:10 pm

          well, glad you are opting for time over steroids. steroids are not just bad for floxies but for everyone. I would throw out one more suggestion: serrapeptase. It’s an enzyme. Do a search on it. I have used it for respiratory issues, because it helps with inflammation and also to thin plegm. IT is used for joint paint for the same reasons (inflammation) and other uses as well.

        • Anna December 11, 2018 at 2:08 pm

          Thanks for the suggestion, L, I will check into it! Yeh, steroids are rotten for everyone, I agree. Men doctors seem more careless with prescribing steroids for some reason. The last doctor I went to was a female and she told me no one should take steroids unless they are in crippling pain. Many people swear by Solomon’s Seal, so I will give that another week to do its magic.

        • Andrea December 11, 2018 at 5:14 pm

          Thanks for sharing your experience Anna. Can I ask you what was the type of turmeric/black pepper you’ve used and how long did you use it before giving it up? Thanks.

        • Anna December 11, 2018 at 7:41 pm

          I tried the Tumeric supplements from Whole Foods, I don’t recall the brand, but it includes Black Pepper to support absorption. I took it for 1.5 week , I even took far more than the label suggested, but it did not do anything.

        • Henk Noordhuizen December 12, 2018 at 3:30 am

          Anna, 1 1/2 week is way too short for things like turmeric/black pepper to workt.All natural medicines and supplements need time to do their work,weeks,or even month.

          Black pepper,added to your food,will improve absorption of the vitamines and minerals.I don’t know if red peppers do the same but they’re very healthy as well.Cayenne well may be ( one of the best) red peppers on the market.

        • Andrea December 12, 2018 at 6:38 am

          I agree with Henk, Anna. 1.5 weeks means nothing. For supplements, the general rule is AT LEAST 6-8 weeks of contious use, to see some benefits.

        • Henk Noordhuizen December 12, 2018 at 7:05 am

          Adding to the information about black pepper for better absorption: butter,or,even better,ghee,improves absorption of vit’s and minerals as well,in particular fat-sollible vitamines (A,D,E). Add both butter and (black) pepper to soup’s and other food;good for taste ánd health.

        • Anna December 12, 2018 at 10:57 am

          Ok, well, I appreciate the added knowledge and input about the supplements. Maybe, I will give it another shot with the Tumeric, when I finish with the Solomon’s Seal. Thanks, you all!

  27. Andrea December 11, 2018 at 5:53 am Reply

    Hi, has anyone tried Hyaluronic Acid?
    I’ve read that it could be helpful for treating rheumatic pain. I still has some collagen powder and some MSM, and now I want to start using them again with some HA. Any experience with it?

  28. Don December 12, 2018 at 9:27 am Reply

    Just an interesting article on iatrogenic illness … http://medind.nic.in/maa/t05/i1/maat05i1p2.pdf
    A very interesting comment near the end of the article. The harm that a physician can do is not limited to the
    imprudent use of medicine or procedure, but may include
    unjustified remarks and misinterpretation of
    investigational data. The physician should be aware of
    the properties of drugs that he prescribes and their
    potential dangers. Ignorance of the possibility of a
    reaction is a clear evidence of negligence. The physician
    should warn the patient of the likely side effects

    Does any of this sound familiar to floxies?

  29. Don December 12, 2018 at 7:35 pm Reply

    I don’t advocate this brand but the information pitch to sell the product has a lot of good information in it. Maybe it would help some floxies. One never knows unless one tries it.
    https://happybodystore.com/os/?utm_source=FB&utm_medium=Conv&utm_campaign=OS+M+56+Plus+USA&utm_content=OS&fbclid=IwAR0EMbPxynwbid5H4sG9A14gJxCg1Y2_CpnqzJf-C5gtOk0trXoZR0Kx1hE

    • L December 12, 2018 at 7:59 pm Reply

      Always best to get supplements from food when possible and there are plenty of choices when it comes to sulfur: kale, cabbage, broccoli, garlic, onions, avocado, brussel sprouts, sweet potatoes and more.

    • Andrea December 13, 2018 at 5:31 am Reply

      I’ve already commented this, but I’ve tried MSM (sulfur) in high dosages, 5-10 gr a day, if i remeber correctly, with collagen powder. It didn’t hurt me, but I didn’t noticed anything effective from it…

      • Andrea December 13, 2018 at 5:37 am Reply

        Anyway, I’ve just oredered some Hyaluronic Acid pills. I’m going to do another cycle with MSM/collagen/HA, and see what happens this time. I’m talking about joint/muscle pain.

  30. A.Coleman December 13, 2018 at 12:12 pm Reply

    Hey gang – quick symptom question.

    In the last six months my blood pressure spiked from normal to pretty elevated. Started taking BP medication (no issues that I can tell other than my BP going down to just a bit over where it was). Wow western medicine worked.

    My question is – about 10 days before I started taking the BP medication I started getting bouts of feeling light-headed. It has been a bit over a month now and it is still hanging on. It fluctuates throughout the day and is rarely an issue at night. It seems to be very slowly getting better – but still has days when it bothers me. I feel a little pressure in my head and just off. Not really dizzy and no other symptoms. No headaches or anything else.

    Primary who prescribed the BP medication blew it off. I see my integrative medicine specialist tomorrow who is more understanding and believes I was floxed even if she is stumped at offering treatment. Do I need to push for more tests on this with her – or is this something I can thank the fluoroquinolones for? How many other floxies have dealt with this and did it go away? Did you do anything other than just deal with it?

    BTW – I was floxed a bit over three years ago and am generally recovering started my second worse relapse about 3 months ago. Somewhere around 90% of normal on good days.

    • L December 13, 2018 at 12:38 pm Reply

      First, I imagine your integrative md will recommend fish oil, coq10 or ubiquinol and exercise/dietary changes, instead of the bp meds which have their own myriad side effects. (Western medicine works…at a cost. https://www.livestrong.com/article/187606-dangers-of-high-blood-pressure-medication/ )

      As for testing…when it comes to floxing, most of it is useless. Most tests come back negative because the damage is functional, not structural, as pointed out by (floxed) Doctor Todd Plumb.

      The light headedness can be cause by so many things, including LOW pressure, so not sure those two things are related in any way. But it can have something to do with the inner ear, allergies, anxiety or numerous other things. I experienced it very early on in my floxing and it just went away on its own.

      • A.Coleman December 14, 2018 at 7:35 am Reply

        L – thanks for the feedback on non-prescription options. We already tried all those things. I already exercise regularly (5 days a week with cardio) have been all during my floxing even when it killed me. Was already taking CoQ10. I do need to lose some weight and hopefully that will help – I have dropped 5 pounds and vow to get down another 20.

        As I noted, I have been a floxie for over 3 years, so know that test results are typically normal for floxies. My high BP is the only thing ever “abnormal” in my whole floxing journey. Something must have triggered it to go up so dramatically in just three months; so I am working to find that cause. In March it was 117/78 and then in June it was 138/90 and got up to 150/100 in November. All during that time we were trying the non- prescription approaches you suggested and it just kept going up. By November it was dangerously high and I had to do something. The BP med the primary prescribed is the one recommended by my integrative medicine doc. It is just so hard to get in to see her – that I went to the primary.

        I do appreciate that you suffered with it and it finally just went away. I am thinking that at least part of my problem is psychosomatic / anxiety. This last relapse just a few months before I thought I might finally be well has been mentally taxing.

        • L December 14, 2018 at 10:42 am

          well, it sounds like you are doing everything right. I have a friend whose bp suddenly got quite high and he doesn’t know why. (Of course, he drinks diet sodas which is a big no-no, but he has been doing that all along.) I don’t know your age, but if you are over 40, you want to be on the ubiquinol form of co-q10 because it is the active form and your body doesn’t need to convert it.

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 13, 2018 at 1:24 pm Reply

      While a fake doctor prescribes you a medicine,based on symptoms,without being sure of the cause,and tell you to come back if this medicine doesn’t work,just to try another “medicine”,good doctors first does as much tests as needed to really know the cause of the problem.
      Of course,then most of them prescribe a medicine as well,but these kind of doctors will probably be be less careless on their choice of medicine as well.

      Your description of symptoms is not very helpfull;could be caused by a legion of things. Magnesium- or other mineral/vitamine defficiencies, (pre-) diabetes,and many other things. That’s why tests are so very important.In the meantime you might consider to use a multi like Solgar V2000 or V75.That might help (a bit),and there’s little risk of doing anything wrong.

      • A.Coleman December 14, 2018 at 7:53 am Reply

        Henk – thanks for your thoughtful comments.

        Most of the options you suggest have been tested. My RBC Mg is 5.6, so pretty good, near the upper end of normal. B vitamins and other minerals are mostly at the high normal levels. B6 is a little above normal – but those levels are because of the B supplementation I use to treat neuropathy and the fact I am C677T MTHFR. I also supplement with Vitamin D, Mg, CoQ10, and trace minerals.

        I wish I could describe symptoms that would help make a determination. Lightheaded is the best description I can come up with. Here are all the details. It is worse earlier in the day. Gets better as the day progresses and seems to be little or no effect after 7PM. It is worse when standing, but that is just because I am on two feet instead of sitting on my behind. It isn’t something that is related to standing and gets better after I stand – it is the same when I first stand and 10 minutes later.

        I have investigated a ton of possible causes. About the time it started I started taking the ReMag Mg solution. I am going to stop the ReMag for a week and just supplement with my normal Mg Glycinate which I have taken for three years to see it that is the problem. I have also wondered not about pre-diabetes, but low blood sugar. Since it is worse in the morning and gets better as the day goes on I wonder it my blood sugar isn’t low. I have never heard of diabetes causing lightheadedness; but this is one of the things I probably need to be tested for again. When it was tested 9 months ago it was fine – but then 9 months ago my BP was perfect too!

        I would blame the BP medication, but the symptoms started BEFORE I started the meds. In fact I can’t identify any side effects of the BP meds at all.

        I will consider taking a multi-vitamin; but doing that is tough with my MTHFR status since most don’t have the forms of B I need and or can tolerate. In addition that throws off the Vitamin D and B complex supplementation. D is easy enough to work around but B is another story.

        Hopefully this is just a floxie symptom that will go away with time as many others have / do. My recent relapse when I was 95% well has really been tough and this may be anxiety related too, since now I am back down to something like 80%.

  31. DP December 14, 2018 at 4:25 am Reply

    Following a 4 week ciprofloxacin treatment, I have developed very bad muscle spasms and fatigue. The spasms/twitching have been continuous over the last 12 weeks. Does anyone have any suggestions as they are driving me mad. Thank you in advance

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 14, 2018 at 5:05 am Reply

      Spasm’s? I think magnesium is the first thing you might want to do. Four weeks of Cipro is a lot;how much daily,and for what reason?Better read trhough the postings on this website;there’s a lot of usefull information to find here!

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 14, 2018 at 5:07 am Reply

      Try magnesium bisglycinate;it’s a chelated form for better absorption.

      • Andrea December 14, 2018 at 6:56 am Reply

        Also Magnesium threonate

        • Andrea December 14, 2018 at 7:41 am

          It should be the only form og mag. that significantly increases levels of magnesium in the brain. Also try Epsom Salt (magnesium sulfate) baths.
          PS Never take magnesium sulfate orally

        • DP December 14, 2018 at 8:53 am

          Thank you everyone, I have been using magnesium chelate for the past 10 weeks but only 400mg per day. It’s weird but twitching has actually increased over time and not decreased. I have noticed in USA there is a chiropractor doctor who claims that he has treated fq patients successfully, has anyone heard or come across this?

        • L December 14, 2018 at 10:46 am

          In the US there are many NDs, chiros, acupuncturists who have treated floxies. No one has a cure, but all these alternative doctors end up seeing a fair share after we have given up on allopaths, who are mostly just dismissive. The ND I saw had treated 1/2 dozen floxies before me.

    • L December 14, 2018 at 10:34 am Reply

      Not knowing what you are currently doing, I would hope you are taking z fair amount of a good magnesium supplement. Early on took up to 800 mg a day. Try mag glycininate orotate or l-threonate. I think this subject has been discussed on here u=numerous times, so try a work search.

  32. L December 14, 2018 at 10:35 am Reply

    sorry, word search

  33. DP December 14, 2018 at 12:36 pm Reply

    Thanks L. Currently I am taking coq10, udos choice probiotic, iron, vitamin b12, b6 and d3. Having undertaken many tests, it is clear that peripheral nerves have been agrevated and are missfiring, also my red blood cells count have increased and iron level dropped. So many issues are going on. I had mri scan and EMG tests undertaken plus many blood tests. I think that twitching is happening because the nerves are missfiring, I could be completely wrong. I took cipro for orchitis , first 3 weeks no issues, then in week 4 bang..

    • L December 14, 2018 at 1:37 pm Reply

      Yeah, nerve damage is rampant. I am three plus years out and still all my toes are numb (likely will be for life); I continue to have phantom smells plague me (and they are always ghastly) and I believe the tinnitus could also be nerve damage related. The b complex is supposed to help, esp b12. I had dozens of phosphatydilcholine IVs which I believe did help with some of the other nerve damage. I think you can get liposomal. That might be something to try.

      • Henk Noordhuizen December 14, 2018 at 2:31 pm Reply

        The only substance that I know of to help repair nerve- and braincell damage is THC,a cannabinoid. I would give that a try if it wasn’t for the fact that,a little while before I got floxed,I was brought to hospital twice in two weeks with cardiac arrythmia,and since then I use Flecainide Acetate.And from day one of my Cypro experience I had heart pulptations which,during the irst year (probably mainly because I started taking even more magnesium tnan I already did),those pulptationa slowly disappeared.

        Because THC causes the heart to beat faster I dare not experiment with it although I have reason enough to do so;damage to the nerves ,giving pains that randomly appear everywhere in my body,damaged memory,and movement control,and double vision,sometimes most of the day,with,now and then,a short period with a little improvement.I think the double vision is caused by the brain not being able to merge the signals from the left and the right eye,while the “disobediant” right eye still giving a focussed view.Sadly enough my right eye was,and in fact still is,the eye with the sharpest view.

        • L December 14, 2018 at 7:33 pm

          Tried it. I’m afraid it did nothing for me.

  34. DP December 14, 2018 at 12:42 pm Reply

    My GP prescribed me pregabalin accord 50mg, I am nervous about taking any medication now, has anyone else tried these?

    • L December 14, 2018 at 1:41 pm Reply

      ooh, that would make me nervous. I have read bad things about lyrica. And it will only mask symptoms not fix anything. I am not familiar with this site, but it gives a partial list of side effects. https://gazettereview.com/2016/01/natural-solutions-alternatives-for-lyrica-cure-chronic-pain-holistically/

    • Andrea December 14, 2018 at 3:00 pm Reply

      When I went to see a neurologist (I’ve seen 3 since being floxed), he just did a manual visit on my legs and then he put some needles on my legs and feet, to see if I was suffering from peripheral neuropathy. He said I was completely ok. I asked him if he could prescribe me an exam (Electromyography) to be more sure about it. He refused, but he prescribed me lyrica, for the pain. I asked him about side effects, he said there were none. I went home and look at the side effects and decided to forget about lyrica. It’s funny how most doctors are so prone to prescribe any drugs they know, but they rarely try to really understand the cause of the problem…Now, I’m not telling you,DP, that something bad would happen to you, if you take it, but just be careful.

      • L December 14, 2018 at 7:44 pm Reply

        As several of us have noted in past posts…neurologists have been some of the worst doctors we have seen. (That was the one who wrote in my notes I was “delusional.”) He was arrogant and ignorant. He had a computer a foot away from him, but rather than look up “nerve damage and cipro” or “mitochondrial damage and cipro” he chose to mock me. And my god, there is a black box warning about possible PERMANENT nerve damage. No excuse.

        • Andrea December 15, 2018 at 9:30 am

          I think you’re right L. But this particular docotr, wasn’t even arrogant or hasty, he just thought it wasn’t necessary. If you ask me, this is just another proof how ignorant most of them are. And they also rely so much on drugs, they are deeply sure about the safety of these drugs…it’s just so unbeliveable. They even prescribe ’em to themselves.

  35. DP December 15, 2018 at 12:10 am Reply

    I have seen 4 neurologists , two of them have accepted that I am suffering with ciprofloxacin side effects, the other two denied it. I have Now given up on all of them as to date I have spent 1000s ..

    Can you all please let me know your thoughts on this https://youtu.be/eHNizwtgHYQ

    Many thanks

    • L December 15, 2018 at 12:33 am Reply

      Yeah, I am around $40,000…and counting

      As for the video. Not sure what to make of it. I mean why is she going out eating burgers and fries if she is having so many health issues? And taking Ibuprofin 12 times a day? She said she found out she had been poisoned by cipro, but didn’t learn not to take NSAIDs? And if she WAS taking that much, it makes me wonder if she actually was floxed or had other issues.

      I had an excellent ND who had treated other floxies. I had an integrative MD, who is also a lyme specialist, an internist and pulmonologist, and he does IVs. I am light years from where I was, but still have issues, some permanent. I think she likely had other issues going on (maybe in addition to some floxing) and she is very lucky.

      And this doctor just kept saying “your body has the ability to heal,” which is true to SOME extent, but I don’t think he has a clear understanding of just how toxic and invasive these drugs are. I agree, people should seek out functional medicine/integrative doctors (although now some are saying they are just to get more patients) but I think they both just got lucky and/or were dealing with other issues.

  36. canie December 15, 2018 at 2:19 am Reply

    what was magnesium by food ? mostly good for nerves ?

    • Henk Noordhuizen December 15, 2018 at 4:37 am Reply

      Google,DuckDuckGo,or,even better,Ecosia on “magnesium health) and you will soon understand the importance of magnesium,not only for floxies but for everybody.

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