Floxie Hope


This site is to give HOPE to those who are suffering from Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome as a result of being poisoned by fluoroquinolone antibiotics – Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox, Floxin, etc.  It contains stories of healing.

Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox and all other fluoroquinolones are dangerous drugs that can have devastating effects that cumulatively I’ll refer to as Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome or Floxing.  Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome/Floxing includes damage to connective tissue (tendons, ligaments, cartilage, fascia, etc.) throughout the body, damage to the nervous systems (central, peripheral and autonomic), and more. The damage done by fluoroquinolone antibiotics can destroy a person’s quality of life or even kill them. Certainly, there is a time and a place for drugs with dangerous side effects. If you find yourself in a septic shock induced coma, fluoroquinolones may save your life. Unfortunately, these drugs are not being reserved for life or death situations. People are being prescribed them for urinary tract infections, suspected prostate infections, upper respiratory infections, as a prophylactic for travelers’ diarrhea, ear infections, pink eye, etc. Thousands of people have suffered needlessly from the devastating effects of fluoroquinolone antibiotics, when another, safer antibiotic could have, and should have, been used.

The damage done by fluoroquinolones is largely unacknowledged by the medical establishment and an accurate diagnosis, compensation and relief are difficult to come by. There is no known cure for Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Syndrome/Floxing.  However, many people continue to LIVE after being poisoned by fluroquinolones.  They find healing, recovery, perseverance, compassion and hope.  These are their stories.

This site is meant to give hope for healing to those who are adversely effected by fluoroquinolones.  It is no way meant to disregard the pain of those who are chronically suffering from the horrifying effects of Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox or the other fluoroquinolones.  There are people who don’t recover.  Their stories are real and they matter.  There are also people who are able to recover and I share their stories with the hope that they inspire others, or at least give hope that recovery is possible.

Here is a New York Times article about the dangers of fluoroquinolone antibiotics – http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/10/popular-antibiotics-may-carry-serious-side-effects/?_r=0 – more news stories, research papers and other resources can be found on the “Links and Resources” page.

Here is a Facebook group that is a great resource for those going through Fluoroquinolone Toxicity – https://www.facebook.com/groups/floxies/

Featured post – I’m floxed. Now what?

The Fluoroquinolone Toxicity Solution Ebook has helped many Floxies to recover, including DanielCindy and Ruth.  As a bonus, you will also receive The Floxie Food Guide – a book of diet guidelines to help you through fluoroquinolone toxicity:

flu tox get help you need banner click lisa




25,483 thoughts on “Floxie Hope

  1. Andrea March 12, 2019 at 3:49 pm Reply

    I’m more and more convinced, it just malpractice

    • L March 12, 2019 at 4:03 pm Reply

      could not agree more

    • Anne Leenders April 17, 2019 at 7:43 am Reply

      hello Do you know where to buy MitoQ? I live in Canada

  2. Andrea March 12, 2019 at 3:52 pm Reply

    They showed a small part of this interview

  3. joanneb4 March 12, 2019 at 5:16 pm Reply

    I was floxed in Feb 2015 while tapering benzo. Horrific. I then got further damage from Flagyl and macrobid after Cipro. Tapered benzo. Felt like I was healing for a year afterwards and that I made it out alive. But then had to take antibiotics was given steroids and went back on klonopin, had Versed for endoscopy and CT scans with dye and never same since. Constant burning skin and tongue and mouth and mast cell activation. Had to go back on benzo and tried several antidepressants like cymbalta, amitriptyline, Prozac (has fluorine) and now dr wants Luvox ( has fluorine). Took PPIs (had fluoirine) for ulcers and used fluoride toothpaste 12 times. I am totally messed up and find no way out. I’m on benzo and going to start Luvox. I’ve been inpatient and outpatient for psych and awaiting inpatient again. Gut and brain and skin are so messed up I can’t sweat and my detox pathways are messed up. I react to everything and can barely eat. I even react badly to water in shower. What can I do? I am totally hopeless. Even naturopath said to stay on klonopin and take Luvox and magnesium and drink vegan shakes.

    • L March 12, 2019 at 6:45 pm Reply

      I too was floxed feb 2015. Sorry you have been through so much, but the CT scan dye (I refused both) and the steroids in particular were probably critical in your setback. As I posted earlier, antidepressants have been shown to be no better than placebos, and they have their own risks. I was on them for decades. Never again. Unfortunately the PPIs likely damaged your gut microbiome even more and it is so crucial to good health. If I were you I would find a good ND or integrative doctor that does IV therapy and who can guide you in healing your gut which I think is priority one. As long as you continue these drugs I am afraid you will just put off healing.

      • joanneb4 March 12, 2019 at 7:00 pm Reply

        I’m very suicidal and desperate I don’t know what to do. Who to see, what advice to follow,

        • Andrea March 12, 2019 at 7:33 pm

          Hi joanne, I really don’t know what to say to you. That’s a crazy situation we’re dealing with. I was 2 years out in december, never had any gut issues. Then I took a powerful probiotic and I messed up my guts with it, and it seems that I can’t really heal from this mess. I developed a bad allergy, and I’m sure it is not a coincidence. Anyway, I know this is not very supportive, but if it makes you feel just a little better, feel free to ask anything. I’ll answer with pleasure.

        • L March 12, 2019 at 9:04 pm

          If you post the general area where you live, perhaps someone can refer you to a healthcare provider that helped them. I found the ND who saved me through this site.

        • Joanne. March 13, 2019 at 7:36 am

          Don’t give up!
          You will get better!!
          Your gut has been destroyed and cannot supply your body with what it needs to function properly.
          So concentrate on everything that heals your gut. Eat a raw potato every day, or if you can’t do that drink a table spoon of potato starch in cold water. Also, eat a green banana daily and drink bone broth throughout the day at least 3 cups.
          Then slowly (not too much too fast) add good bacteria either through foods such as slow fermented Sauer kraut, keifer or probiotics(I use Visbiome, formerly VSL).
          And stay away from anything that kills bacteria of course antibiotics but even natural bacterial killers such as lots of garlic, most herbs and herbal supplements, lots of apple cider vinegar, anything that will kill the bacteria that you need to desperately build back up. Look up all supplements and foods you want to use as medicine and make sure they dont kill bacteria. Also don’t use anything on your skin that kills bacteria such hand sanitizer, use gloves when doing dishes, etc.
          As for the anti depressants, I wouldn’t worry about stopping them until you are better because our gut bacteria creates all the chemicals our brains need and when it has been destroyed you might need that help until it’s been restored.
          Remember you were healing before but you took antibiotics again and destroyed everything you had built back up, so you CAN do it AGAIN!

        • Virginia March 13, 2019 at 8:11 pm

          I’m so sorry to hear about your suffering, Joanne! Please don’t give up; you never know when healing might be around the next corner. I know how hard this vicious FQ poisoning is. Getting better can be very slow, but it can happen. My tendon ruptures from Cipro have all healed with time. Please speak to a therapist and naturopath if you can and keep connecting with all the online Cipro support groups you can find. Antidepressants (except for those that include FQs) might be needed right now to keep the suicidal thoughts at bay, though long-term other options might be healthier. Antidepressants helped me for many years; I only gave them up because they were giving me bone fractures after many years.. Sending you lots of positive energy.

        • Jackie March 31, 2019 at 3:59 pm

          are u taking any meds such as a benzodiazepine? http://www.benzo-case-japan.com/my-story-english.php

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 13, 2019 at 4:11 am Reply

      Like L. wrote;as long as you use this mix of “medicines” your problem will not be solved.Most PPI’s don’t have fluorine in it,as far as I can find,but antidepressivants have.Depression is not a lack of antidepressivants in your brain,but a deficiency of essential oils,vitamines (B-complex),Vitamine D,magnesium etc.Those “medicines” won’t solve your medical problems,changing your food habbits,exercise,going out,in the garden (if you have one),especially when the sun shines,and even singing/whistling work better than those pills (which only suppress the symptoms,while the things I mentioned take away the causes).

      Magnesium is extremely important;a defficiency causes lots of problems,among which being frightened without a real cause,and panic attacks,and depression.But the fluorine in Luvox will keep on robbing your prescious magnesium,and other important vit’s and minerals.PPI’s cause a deficiency in magnesium,zinc,vit.B12 etc.As long as you don’t eliminate the deficiencies on essential oils (Omega-3 being the most important for psychical wellbeing),vitamine B-complex (B3 is essential for your brain functioning;a deficiency causes all kinds of psychic symptoms),and minerals like magnesium and zinc.

      One of the many “pills” nature offers agains depressions.is Curcumin,probably one of the most usefull,and researched natural substances:


      I hope that we can help you to solve your problems and feel well but it will take time.One last,important advice: stay away as far as possible from everything,containing Fluoride/Fluorine.Once being floxed you are extremely sencitive to fluoride and even the smallest dose of this extremely aggresive poison will worsen your symptoms.

      • Charlotte Kanon March 25, 2019 at 2:46 am Reply

        Beste Henk noordhuizen,

        Zo te zien een Nederlandse naam.
        En zo te lezen bent u ook gefloxed ?
        Ik zou het erg fijn vinden om in kontakt met u te komen.
        Vr Gr charlotte kanon

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 13, 2019 at 4:21 am Reply

      Here’s an article from Dr.Mercola that might help:


      I’m astonished that even the naturopath told you to stay on Klonopin and take Luvox (Fluorine);might it be that he’s afraid to come in conflict with your regular doctor/psychiatrist?

      Oh,and the Klonopin can be replaced by CBD oil,a safe,effective and completely natural anti-psychotic.Your nathuropath should know this,and all the other things I wrote.

      • Jane Jennings March 31, 2019 at 4:02 pm Reply

        Henk benzos are evil evil drugs . cbd http://www.benzo-case-japan.com/my-story-english.php
        is much safer.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 1, 2019 at 2:58 am

          I never took any anti-depressivants.My doc,the same one who prescribed me the Cipro that changed my life for the worse,tried to get me on Paroxetine (Paxil),just for “falling asleep a little better”. I read the stories on the web,about the adverse,and withdrawl reactions; It scared the hell ot of me when I realized my doc has apreference for the most evil “medicines” on the market (the female one;she practices together with a male doc,not much better,if better at all)

          I constantly tell people to use naturals like CBD,Magnesium (Mag. L-Threonate),Camomilla Omega 3 oil etc.,and things like taking a walk through nature,or working in the garden, Even singing,humming and whistling help;I noticed that because I love music and whistle a lot. When I told others that that cheared me up,they told me “that’s all between your ears”.Whell,thát remark made me laugh;that is the exact place were I wanted it to be ;-)) Later on I read that research had proven that it works;your endorfines rise while singing and whistling.Almost forgot: meditation works as well.I love meditating (TM) in the forrest,on a quiet place where I only hear the birds,and the wind playing with the leaves and branches.I hope to be healthy and fit enough,this summer,to go there.

          Another way is the use of the Bio Tuner,invented by Bob Beck after years of research.This device works by stimulating the brain (CES) with a low electrical pulse of a multitude of frequencies.It helped a lot of people with overcoming a depression, sleeping better,improving memory etc.

          I use my Bio Tuner one or two times a week,and it does really help.Might be a coincident but when,after a year of having “attacks” of severe double vision,every day,I started using my Bio Tuner (not used for a few years),and using my Magnetic Pulser on my eyes every evening,in a few weeks I noticed a strong improvement,and since then,for a few months now,these “attacks” of double vision only come now and then,are lasting only a minute or so,and are less severe.When I wake up I have a normal vision,most of the time,while,during that first year of double vision,it was there every day,and so severe that I almost didn’t dare to go down the stairs.No need to tell that I’m very happy for the moment :-))

    • Jennifer Clark April 13, 2020 at 1:00 pm Reply

      Did you ever figure anything out. This is happening to me right now

  4. Dee March 12, 2019 at 7:46 pm Reply

    Andrea, may I ask what probiotics you took that caused you bad gut issues? I hope your stomach will heal in time!!

    • Andrea March 12, 2019 at 10:26 pm Reply

      Hi dee. The probiotics I took are from an italian brand named bromatech. I took the one that it’s called “enterelle”. It used ti cure severe cases of diarreha and to kinda reset your flora. After that you’re supposed to start with another probiotic and then with another one. But after 3 or 4 days I was extremely costipated and bloated.

  5. Dee March 13, 2019 at 7:30 am Reply

    Andrea thanks for the Probiotic info. Do you know how many bacteria your dose had?? It sounds a lot like our VSL #3 brand here in the US. 2 pills had 225 billion bacteria or 1 pill had 112 billion which was for fixing IBS etc. I took 1 pill for about a week and it made my stomach bloat and loose bathroom. I stopped taking it and slowly better. But I suppose it can really throw you off? I did have IBS before I got floxed and loose stools so thought I was a candidate for the strong probiotic? I guess we are more sensitive and have to be very careful with anything?? Although some floxies respond really well to the stronger probiotic!! Have you tried bone broth yet for your stomach or fermented foods??

    • Andrea March 13, 2019 at 9:54 am Reply

      No Dee, I never tried bone broth, but I’m going to, whenever I can find it, even if I think a vegan diet would work better, at least for me. Yeah, some probiotics are good to treat some problems, but unecessary/dangerous for others. And this is expecially true for us floxies, that are already so weak. I might be wrong, but this particular probiotic I took, was only 3 kinds of different probiotics but in huge amounts, like 700 billion, or something like that. It was probably like dropping a bomb on an already healhty gut….
      In the past I took some lighter probiotics and never noticed anything from them, not good not bad. So this one was really soemthing wrong for me…

      • Henk Noordhuizen March 13, 2019 at 12:21 pm Reply

        Andrea,the Lactospore I used (and wrote about) did a good job for me.When I started I had an unstable stool,sometimes normal,sometimes loose.I used them for a few month,during which my stool stabilized.When they ran out,I didn’t buy a new container because I had invested in the expensive Mag.Threonate (money is often the problem),but,untill now,my stool is still very stable and has even survived two probable foodpoisonings;a few hours of diarrea,and a quick recovery,and,to my surprise,no feeling of being sick,at all.

        For now,I’m waiting to see how long this possitive effect lasts;I hope it’s a permanent effect.If not,I order them again;these really work! And they are cheap!

        I bought them here (€10 for 60 tabs,enough for 2 months)


  6. Andrea March 14, 2019 at 4:10 pm Reply

    Henk, in the last few days I was taking another probiotic that the dietician suggested. I was feeling a little better, but then I stopped because I started a 3 days water fast, hoping that soimething would change, but it seems that it didn’t work the way I expected…
    Oh, to anyone who’s interested to know how fasting for 3 days affected me, this time (last time was more or less a year ago) I felt way better : less fatigue, not so weak etc. But in the last 12 hours, all the aches and pain in my leg, (and this time my elbow too) returned. Quite strong. After the first meal I took a pill of mag. and 5000 iu of vitamin d3. One hour later I started to feel better. Today I felt way better, so after dinner I took the mag/vit d again. That’s weird.

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 15, 2019 at 3:08 am Reply

      Andrea,that’s a puzzling reaction.Might it be that something in your food causes the fatigue? Normaly,fasting gives fatigue,the first days,becuase there’s no (food/energy intake,and your body starts up a cleaning process,which needs energy as well.Could you try to eat gluten-free for a few days,or a week,to see how you react on that? I know,pasta’s and bread (gluten-rich) are the base of italian food (you’ve got great bread;I really like it !) but being floxed,or having taken other AB’s, leaves many people with all kinds of allergies.

      While controlling my glucose,after my first AB course in 2004,I noticed that bread and pasta’s made my glucose-level rise extremely while potatoes didn’t.This amazed me because potatoes have a much higher glycemic index than wheat products.While the other symptoms of adverse reactions,more or less disappeared,once I used the Beck Protocol,my sensitivity for wheat did go down but I couln’t eat more than 3 slices of bread without my glucose rise way to high.And now,after the Cipro,I got stck on a max of 1 1/2 slice of bread,and 30 grams of white,35 grams of “brown” pasta.And bread and pasta’s do give me fatigue.

      So,you might try a week,or so,on potatoes,and rice (works fine for me),to see if a gluten intolerans plays a role,here. Might also help a bit concerning your intestinal problems.I hope,I’m wrong becuase an Italian without his favorite pasta’s…I feel pity for you if gluten is the cause.

      Which probiotic are you using now? I hope,this one will work without any problem.If not,you might try that Lactospore (spores,not the actual bacteria).This one heals and protects the inner lining of your intestines and creates a healthy environment for your gut flora,as far as I know/read.I have a very positive experience with this one,and I used a lót of other different probiotica without result,after my first AB course.Cost me lots of money,too;some were quite expensive.But for now you choose another one;let’s hope this works well.Let us know,please.

      • Andrea March 16, 2019 at 4:54 pm Reply

        Thanks for your reply Henk. I’ve checked the probiotics I’m taking right now : no lactospore (bacillus coagulans) in it. But I’ve also checked the other probiotic I was taking before, and it does contain the lactospore you took. 2 billions. So, it I can say, it was useless for me.
        Another thing. I’ve checked one of the ingredient of the enterelle, the probiotic that messed up my gut flora. One of the main ingredients is enterococcus faecium, probably why this probiotic is named like that. Look it up what it is :


      • Andrea March 16, 2019 at 5:32 pm Reply

        Oh I was also reading about another ingredient of this enterelle. It’s name is saccharomyces boulardii. It’s a specie of yeast. In Italy is also sold, as as over the counter drug, form treating diarreha. I’ve read that, in the past, there was a restriction, because it was causing candida. I’m starting to think that I could be affected by it. I was thinking about a antimicotic, but before taking it, I want to get tested first.

        • Andrea March 16, 2019 at 6:07 pm

          Sorry, there have been rare cases of candida in immunosuppred patients and patient with chatheter.

        • Henk Noordhuizen March 17, 2019 at 3:22 am

          Ciao Andrea,I think,like I wrote you before,that the Saccharomyces Boulardii (a ferment/yeast) caused the problems.This one is,in a healthy gut, in normal/small quantities present in your intestines,and might,in a balanced intestinal flora,even be usefull but by using that Enterelle on a balanced gut flora,that yeast became dominant and caused the symptoms,like bloating.

          You took the Enterelle while not having intestinal problems;did you take the other AB,with the lactospore,on that same reasonably healthy gut flora as well? That might explain why you,then,didn’t experience any positive reactions,then;there was no need for it (nothing to repair).

          I hope that the probio you’re using now will bring everything back to normal. When the nasty symptoms continue,you might consider trying that Lactospore.It is proven usefull against your symptoms,successfully,by people with IBS.I use(d) it in combination with Inuline (a pré-biotic).Inulin is the perfect supp to make the usage of probiotics more succcessfull;use it,whenever you take probiotics.


        • Andrea March 17, 2019 at 1:32 pm

          Henk, I’ve used that probiotic (bacillus coagulans) in a combo with inuline and enzymes from curcumin and ginger after the mess caused by enterelle. Nothing really changed.

        • Andrea March 17, 2019 at 1:41 pm

          Right now, I’m using another one. It contains 4 different strains for a total of 70 billions CFU. It seems to give me the opposite effect of enterelle. If you know what I mean…well maybe, even if not pleasent, something is moving…

  7. Henk Noordhuizen March 15, 2019 at 2:32 am Reply

    Does anybody know what all these fake comments are doing here? Those with random “names” and no text? Some troll,I suppose.Lisa,can you,please,block the sender/source,if it is a scam or a troll?

    • L March 15, 2019 at 9:40 am Reply

      I was just thinking about that too Henk. Someone with way too much time on their hands. I figured it we all ignored he/she would just go away. Kind of pathetic when you think about it.

  8. Mike Wallbridge March 15, 2019 at 5:44 am Reply

    Back in early September, I was given Cipro after a prostate biopsy and so started my story of tendon/ligament pain and neuropathy. But I saw a herbalist fairly quickly and, along with high doses of magnesium, started on a detox regime to remove the fluorine from the body. Early in February, I had surgery to remove my prostate and had to stop all my medications including the magnesium and herbal tinctures but experienced two weeks without any symptoms of toxicity at all and wondered whether I had recovered. But then I was given a course of Cefalexin for a urinary infection and my toxicity symptoms have reappeared. I’m back on magnesium and the herbal tinctures again. How is it though, that I can apparently recover and perhaps be detoxed from all fluorine only to experience the same symptoms again from a drug that contains no fluorine? I don’t understand.

    • L March 15, 2019 at 9:57 am Reply

      Well Mike, for the same reason we can have relapses from Advil or prednisone or gluten or a 100 other things. We just don’t know. That’s why we buy meat that has not been given any antibiotics. The triggers to bring this beast back seem to be endless. Please see my post above about finding an ND who can give you the protocol for treating UTIs without antibiotics.

      • Mike Wallbridge March 15, 2019 at 10:19 am Reply

        Thanks, L. Sorry, but what is an ND? Unfortunately, no matter what it is, I can’t imagine I’m anywhere near one . . . living, as I do, on a Scottish Island. Even my herbalist is an expensive ferry trip away.

        • L March 15, 2019 at 10:23 am

          Yikes. You are isolated. It is a naturopathic doctor. It must be difficult for you. Even living not that far from a major city, it is still hard to find natural practitioners, but still much easier than most. Hopefully more and more will be turning that way.

        • Mike Wallbridge March 15, 2019 at 10:44 am

          Yes, we are isolated . . . and a long way from anywhere I would describe as a major city. And though we have a hospital here, I have to fly to the hospital in Aberdeen for any major surgery or treatment for cancer. I’ve had a search but I don’t think there are any NDs anywhere in Scotland!!

    • Andrea March 16, 2019 at 4:42 pm Reply

      Mike, there’re days, even weeks where I feel almost healed. Almost no pain, no fatigue. I feel normal. And maybe I’m eating junk food, not taking supplements etc. Then, there’re times when, even if I’m eating extremely healthy, taking all the right supplements, no matter what, I feel like crap again. These side effects are so terrible expecially because they’re so unpredictable. I think it has lots to do with stress. That’s probably why, when, even if I’m eating lots of crap and “not giving a damn”, I still menage to feel good. Probably that feeling of “freedom” to eat whatever you like is relaxing. I fdon’t know. Just my opinion of course. But defenetly stress has lots to do with our symptoms.

    • saff March 18, 2019 at 7:22 am Reply

      Hi Mike, I had the symptoms come back from non fluoride drugs, and I’m a bit scared about having any anesthetic. Do you know what they gave you when you had surgery at all?

  9. ursula March 15, 2019 at 11:40 pm Reply

    had tooth extraction day 4 now. pain getting worse. can only see dentist monday but can get script per phone of antibiotics. I see yellow stuff . hope its not dry socket. what pain meds do we tolorate and which antibiotics, he want to give clarithromycin (Klacid here in south africa)

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 16, 2019 at 1:00 am Reply

      As for the antibiotic: clarithromycin has no fluoride/fluorine in it’s composition;might be a “safe” choice (no AB is 100% safe,same for most synthetic medicines,and a few of the natural ones).

      Best,take a good probiotic,and a good magnesium supplement while using that AB.Don’t take the magnesium too close to the clarithromycin,but one or more hours seperated.

      For pain,the safest choice is Paracetamole.Don’t take more than the max advised dose;both clarithromycin and Paracetamole can cause liver damage.

      Might also be helpfull to rinse your mouth with hot salt water,and/or chamomilla tea,several times a day.Do you have Colloïdal Silverwater at hand? Than use it,both as a rinse and small oral doses to strenghten your immune system.

      I hope you’ll feel well soon;good luck!

      • L March 16, 2019 at 10:21 am Reply

        The magnesium should be taken four hours away from the antibiotic (per Dr Jay Cohen.)

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 16, 2019 at 1:18 am Reply

      Clarithromycin FDA warning d.d.februari 2018:don’t use if you have heart problems.Don’t use combined with statins:


    • L March 16, 2019 at 9:55 am Reply

      So sorry Ursula. It really sucks when we try to deal with other issues in addition to floxing. I copied this from a list Lisa posted somewhere on here a year or so ago. The ones that seemed to be safer choices were: Antibiotics to avoid in addition to flqs
      Penicillin seems to be well tolerated – unless you’re allergic to it.
      Cephalosporins seem to be well tolerated

      And of course like every other damn thing, people have sometimes reacted to these as wel. And recently something else came out about z pack and heart issues, but I don’t know if she would take it off the safer list at this point or not. I read that the one your doctor wants to use is similar to penicilin so sounds like as good a choice as any.

      As for pain meds, I cannot recall which I had but I was give two different ones…no issues at all. I would be less concerned with those. I would only request that they not also contain an NSAID which they sometimes will do.

      • L March 16, 2019 at 9:56 am Reply

        oops the phrase “antibiotics to avoid in addition to flqs” should NOT be there. I copy and pasted and forgot to remove that part

  10. Mike Wallbridge March 16, 2019 at 2:37 am Reply

    Hi L, Ah, you found one!! Just an expensive ferry and 300 miles away on some of the twistiest roads in Britain. Just out of the question . . . physically and financially.

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 16, 2019 at 4:02 am Reply

      Mike,you might contact him/her and ask if a telephonic consultation is possible.

      • Mike Wallbridge March 16, 2019 at 5:14 am Reply

        I guess so. I doubt it though. My herbalist is not allowed to prescribe without my presence.

      • L March 16, 2019 at 10:24 am Reply

        Good idea! and ask also if he can refer to someone closer

    • L March 16, 2019 at 9:58 am Reply


  11. Andrea March 16, 2019 at 6:08 pm Reply

    Doeas anyone have any expereince with Fluconazole or any other antifungal drugs, thanks.

    • saff March 18, 2019 at 7:03 am Reply

      I had a reaction with fluconazole, it lasted a month, I wouldn’t take it again.

      • Andrea March 18, 2019 at 9:42 am Reply

        Thanks saff

    • Deb March 20, 2019 at 5:14 am Reply

      Hi Andrea,

      I had a couple of reactions to fluconazole too and they lasted a two or three months. Possibly there is another antifungal that doesn’t have fluoride that you can take.

  12. Attsy March 17, 2019 at 3:41 am Reply

    To everyone who is taking supplements, do you take them permanently or do you make some breaks between? I am now taking magnesium citrate, vitamin D, vitamin B12 injection and spray, iron and folic acid (as I have depletion in all of these). I decided to be persisting and simply hold it. After how long did you make some breaks between?

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 17, 2019 at 9:39 am Reply

      Hi Attsy,you’d better not use fat-soluble vitamines (A,D,E) on a continuous base. I,personally,use all supplements except magnesium in periods.I eat quite a lot of cheese,so,magnesium is important for me,to compensate for all the calcium in the cheese.The soft cheeses I eat contain vit.K 1,and I use vit.K2 as well,since a few weeks;don’t yet know how I will handle that one in the future.

      When I use vitamine supp’s I usually ,when a daily serving is 2 or 3 pill’s/tab’s,just take one and try to get most of what I need from healthy foods.I do use vit D3,but not constantly.I have a Philips narrow band UV-B lamp and use it as well,also not constantly.And I try to go out in the sun as much as possible during the months one can obtain vit.D. from it,where I live (april-august).

    • L March 17, 2019 at 10:28 am Reply

      Funny you should ask. I was told by one integrative MD that I should take breaks from all supplements. This actually concerned me especially for ones I take for my eyes and also for the MAG, fish oil and D. He said to use them say, one week on, one week off. Or one month on, one month off. Out of curiosity I did a search online and could find no other source that said that. So, I asked another integrative MD (one who is trained both in internal medicine and pulmonology and also a Lyme specialist) , and he said “There is no need to do that.” So, what I have done is split the difference. The ones that concerned me (above) I take daily. Other ones, like all the mitochondrial supplements and others, I do one week one, one week off. I also take probiotics every day.

  13. Attsy March 18, 2019 at 10:47 am Reply

    Hi Henk and L,
    thank you for your tips, I guess I will go for month now and then take some rest but continue with magnesium, iron and B12 for longer time. I will probably also add vit e, c and k. I hope it will work as I strongly believe in it. And my colon is now in situation when it seems it will keep it down.
    thanks 🙂

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 18, 2019 at 1:46 pm Reply

      Hi Attsy,you’re welcome.Don’t forget that vit. E is one of the fat soluble vitamines;don’t take this one for a too long periode.And vit B 12 injections ánd the vit.B12 spray is not a good idea;use the spray only when not using the injections,or vice versa.

      • Attsy March 18, 2019 at 3:00 pm Reply

        Henk, I was thinking about using spray and injections together so I will take the spray after I finish with the injections. And will take vitamin E for shorter period for sure :).
        Thank you.

  14. Andrea March 18, 2019 at 7:58 pm Reply

    Guys, does anyone of you have an idea why after a 3 days water fast, wich supposeldy gives many benefits, I felt better overall, but it triggered the pain in my ankles and legs so bad? It’s a weird reaction. I’ve noticed that, as soon as I took some vitamin d3, I felt way better. Any idea?

    • L March 18, 2019 at 9:33 pm Reply

      I have no idea, but sometimes we attribute a relapse to the wrong thing. It’s logical to try to blame the single thing we can think of, but sometimes I think we just don’t know why a side effect came back. It’s possible it had nothing to do with the fasting. Sometimes I have a return of the disgusting phantom scents, or the squeezing sensation around my neck, after having done nothing different than the day before. The connection unfortunately is not always clear cut.

      • Andrea March 19, 2019 at 2:03 am Reply

        I know what you mean L. But in this case I really think the fast is the reason. Even months ago, when I did my first water fast, it triggered my symptoms. This time I felt way better overall, but by the third day, the pain really increased (It wasn’t bothering me lately) and as soon as I started to eat again and took the D3, I felt better.

    • Attsy March 19, 2019 at 12:43 am Reply

      Yes I sometimes have relapse without reason, sometimes I think it’s because I did something which contributed to the relapse (B12 injection – once but now it seems ok, tooth anesthesia, I ate one time chocolate and my body didn’t like it, too much walking etc….). So you food and water fast? I did only food fasting and I drank during my food fasting water and herbal tea.

      • Andrea March 19, 2019 at 1:55 am Reply

        Attsy, I don’t understand what you mean by “you food and water fast?” Anyway I meant I fasted for 3 days (complete food abstinence) and only drinking water with the exception of 2 camomille teas.

        • Attsy March 19, 2019 at 2:28 am

          I just saw in your post “water fast” so I thought that you are also not drinking water – sorry english is not my mother tongue, but as I understand now you drink water, so you did it the same way as me. It helped me but I guess relapses are quite normal maybe your body needed the vitamins as you stopped with food? How long are you going to continue? I think 3 days may be just fine for now.

      • L March 19, 2019 at 8:22 am Reply

        I haven’t done it yet, Attsy, but what has been recommended to me now by both an integrative MD and (unbelievaby) and regular MD is supervised water only fasting. It is supervised so they can monitor you, do blood tests, etc. They would like me to do longer but because I am already thin, it would be a week of fasting then 3-4 days of “breaking” the fast under supervision. It is supposed to act like a reset button, and has proven useful for auto immune disease. There are only a very small handful of places in the world that do it that are recognized by health care professionals as reputable and effective.

        • Attsy March 19, 2019 at 11:08 am

          Hi L, that’s great that you can do it under supervision! Honestly I would not do it again or at least not for 10 days as I did before (but I was completely out of my mind). And I also think that 3 days are just fine! Hope it will help you as it helped me.

        • L March 19, 2019 at 3:17 pm

          Thanks. it’s kind of a last resort. will have to borrow money to do it because you need to actually stay there on premises

        • Andrea March 19, 2019 at 2:42 pm

          L, please be careful! I’ve been reading a lot about fasting in the last year. As you said, it is SUPPOSED to act like a reset button, but you know damn well our symptoms are so tricky and different from many other ill people. As I wrote previously, the fast made my skeletal muscle problems worse. And since you’ve been so badly damaged by the FQ, I’m afraid it could hurt you. Just be careful, if you feel like something it’s going in the wrong direction, just start to eat again.
          Anyaway, there’s a terrific scientist who’s becoming more and more famus lately. He’s Italian, but lives in the sates. He’s been studying and experimenting fasting for the last two decades. He’s name is Valter Longo. He also invented what’s called “fasting mimicking diet”. It’s an extremely calories restricted regimen to do for 5 days. It should have the same benefits of a 3 days only water fast, but without the side effects. He developed this regimen for the cancer patients who found a total fast too extreme. He sell a kit with all the foods and supplements to take. It’s quite expensive, but sonner or later I’m going to try it. Just google fasting mimicking diet or Valter Longo. There’s plenty of interviews about the topic.
          Antùyway, Here’s a Link 🙂

  15. Attsy March 19, 2019 at 12:44 am Reply

    Yes I sometimes have relapse without reason, sometimes I think it’s because I did something which contributed to the relapse (B12 injection – once but now it seems ok, tooth anesthesia, I ate one time chocolate and my body didn’t like it, too much walking etc….). So you food and water fast? I did only food fasting and I drank during my food fasting water and herbal tea.

    • Attsy March 19, 2019 at 12:45 am Reply

      sorry double post :S

  16. hjxjefjvyk March 19, 2019 at 3:01 am Reply
  17. pxcnkemakr March 19, 2019 at 3:01 am Reply
  18. Toby March 19, 2019 at 11:12 pm Reply

    Is it safe to take Quercetin with Mirtazapine 15mg?

    • L March 20, 2019 at 9:34 am Reply

      The only herb that I know can present problems with some kinds of antidepressants is st johns wart. I think if you do an online search and can’t find anything it would likely be ok. I have taken quercetin many times, but I am not on antidepressants. (You might want to try turmeric with 95% curcumoid as an alternative.)

  19. A.Coleman March 20, 2019 at 7:47 am Reply

    Hey everybody

    Looking for feedback from those of you who experienced fuzzy brain and lightheadedness due to FQs. Around October of last year – I was getting better; probably back to 90% of normal with only two symptoms remaining.

    Then I got two new sypmtoms; this strange tingling and cold sensation in my legs (which is a symptom I had when initially floxed, but it had been gone for over 2 years) and a sense of lightheadedness. Fast forward to today – most of my symptoms have gotten so much better that I would consider myself very nearly well (95% to 98%) EXCEPT FOR THE LIGHTHEADEDNESS.

    Lightheadedness is often, but not always, accompanied by a band headache. I don’t seem to have any brain fog or cognitive problems just feel like I might pass out. It is not positional related. It comes and goes more than it did when it first appeared but when it comes on sometimes it nearly leaves me unable to function. I may go for a week with only a few mild episodes and then experience nearly constant symptoms for three or four days.

    So, my big question: is this FQ related? Have others on here had similar symptoms that eventually went away like many of our floxie symptoms? Or is there maybe something I need to bug my western medicine doctor about to investigate?

    Just as a reminder; I developed high blood pressure out of the blue around a year ago – has to be FQ related somehow. One month it was 118/76 and the next it was 140/90. I have since started medication and lost a bit of weight and BP is back to previous numbers. Given that “out of the blue” high BP my western medicine doc did send me for an ultrasound to rule out an aortic aneurysm (the latest FQ black box warning) and that came back negative – thankfully.

    When tested last year my blood sugar was high end of normal at 98 and my integrative medicine doc doesn’t think I need re-checking yet.

    I have also been dealing with a very sore neck and tinnitus for over a year now – maybe a floxie issue maybe not; but the neck is responding to physical therapy and the tinnitus is so quiet now that it isn’t really an issue. I have read up on the possibility of FQs causing cerebrospinal fluid leakage on this site – the neck, tinnitus, and lightheadedness are all symptoms – so there is a possibility that is the culprit. If it turns out not to be something else my integrative medicine dock is up to investigating that angle.

    Opinions greatly appreciated.

    • Henk Noordhuizen March 20, 2019 at 8:42 am Reply

      Hi A.Coleman,a (fasting?) bloodsugar is at the high end of “normal”.Actually,it doesn’t mean much;can becaused by many different reasons (adrenaline,for instance).And,as I wrote,it’s (at the high end of) NORMAL! Nothing to worry about;just hold on to a carb-restricted diet,and keep away from sugar(s).

      Your bloodpreasure,140/90: same thing.A little on the “high end” but not really a reason to worry.A BP of 130/85 is concidered acceptable,especially when you’re aged over 45/50,and even worrying about your BP is enough for a higher than normal BP.A little bit of movement before,or during the measurement,too,is enough to cause a higher BP.And some intense workout can cause a high (!) BP which could last for hours.

      When you want to get usefull info on your blood sugar,you have to take a measurement of your fasting level (before breakfast),one,directly before a meal,one,an hour after,and one,two hours after that meal.Do this measurement regime on different meals;it is helpfull on detecting what food sources bring your bloodsugar to a too high level.If so,change your food choices.

      Your BP changes throughout the day (and night);this is normal.For a usefull measurement you have to relax at least 10-20 minutes ,sit in the right position during that measurement,and don’t move (not even a finger),or talk during the measurement.And don’t worry about 140/90;it’s hardly any higher than the adviced 130/85,concidered normal for elder people.Nothing to worry about,really.

      The lightheadedness might be a symptom of bloodsugar fluctuations (and a high sensitivity for those fluctuations;most people don’t feel,or notice them).To be sure,you’d have to buy a glucose meter.You can also try if some kind of distraction helps,here.

      • A.Coleman March 20, 2019 at 6:36 pm Reply

        Thanks Henk for the feedback. The blood sugar was fasting. I have been thinking about getting a meter and testing my own and if things don’t clear up in a bit that is my next step.

        As to high BP. At least in the U.S. they have now targeted 120//80 as the top end of normal with pre-hypertension going up to 130/85. I wouldn’t have been concerned if the BP had crept up over a few years but it literally spiked up in one month. I have been monitoring the BP carefully at home and do take measurements as you recommend and at multiple times during the day.

        I too think the blood sugar fluctuations might be the issue as I almost always feel a bit better after eating. As to your recommendation to avoid sugar; I have been eating Paleo (with a few minor cheats) since the beginning of the year.

    • L March 20, 2019 at 9:56 am Reply

      My guess would be it is the blood pressure medicine causing the light headedness. Same thing happened to a friend. It was so bad one day he went to the doctor, sure something was really wrong. They lowered his dosage and it went away.

      As for the tinnitus I got that as one of my dozens of cipro “parting gifts” and it has only worsened over 4 years. For others it has gone away or reduced, so kind of a crap shoot.

      • A. Coleman March 20, 2019 at 6:41 pm Reply

        I would think so too, but the light headedness began before I started taking the blood pressure meds – by a month. And I also stopped the meds for a few days to see if they were causing the problem and there was no change. I am on the lowest dosage of my med; guess I could cut it in half. Maybe something to try.

        Sorry to hear your tinnitus has only gotten worse. As I said mine has improved to the point where it is really not even an issue and not because I acclimated but because it is about 1/4 to 1/5 as loud as it was when it was the worst.

        • L March 20, 2019 at 7:02 pm

          wow! I hope I can look forward to that one day

        • Andrea March 21, 2019 at 9:39 am

          A. Coleman,
          I don’t know the cause of your problems. Probably many are flox-related, others maybe not. But I can tell you that, while it’s very important to monitor your blood pressure, it’s also true that today doctors are lowering the “normal” range of blood pressure, just like they did with cholesterol. And I know for sure, that’s just another move to keep the prescription drugs market prosperous. Now, I’m not telling you to don’t care about your blood pressure, but also don’t worry too much if you have a BP a little over the normal range. Regarding your glycemic index, it is also very important to avoid blood glucose spikes but I don’t think it’s wise to avoid carbs. Remember, not all carbs are created equal. Foods like legumes, whole grains, all kinds of veggies, are your friends. You should eat them, in moderation, with every meal. Actually, they should be the big part of your meal. Even fruits it’s good, as long as you eat it in moderation (2 or 3 fruits a day), whoile (not pureed or in a shake, chewing it’s very important) and avoid the tropical ones (too much sugar). Try to move, as much as you can. Just a brisk walk everyday, for 30-45 minutes can do wonders, also to your blood pressure. 🙂

        • A.Coleman March 22, 2019 at 10:30 am


          Thanks for the thoughts and feedback. I too think my problems are likely FQ related – I guess a part of me was hoping there was a medical cause that could be treated because without these I would consider myself well. Heck if I could even just have the weird cold/tingly legs I would be good – at least until it gets to be winter again – LOL.

          Based on your feedback and Henk’s I started cutting my BP medication in half; and monitoring BP. After reading Henk’s post and yours I read up a bit more and do think that if I could get my untreated BP into the 120 – 135 over 80 – 85 range that I might be better not on the meds. What I didn’t note in the original post was that those BPs were my May and June 2018 numbers. I didn’t get treatment until December and that was after my BP was up to 145/93.

          I am trying to eat Paleo, since the beginning of the year. Haven’t had a blood sugar test in a bit over a year. So no legumes or grains, but lots of fruit and veggies. I do eat lots of bananas but lots of apples and berries too along with nuts. I may buy a home glucose monitor and follow Henk’s recommendations to see if that is the source of the problems.

          I exercise regularly and have never smoked. One of the things I did before floxing and started doing again as soon as I was able was exercising. I work out at least 4 to 5 days a week – which includes cardio. Interestingly I have always had problems getting my heart rate elevated – even pre floxing I could not get my heart rate over 150 even running a 5K in under 23 minutes.

          I have noticed since the high BP started that mine is actually much lower after working out. Heart rate stays elevated for a while, but BP goes down into the 105 / 72 area.

          I am going to try the 1/2 dose of the BP meds for a week and see how my symptoms change. After two days the results are not promising symptom wise, though my BP only went up to 125/80. If, at the end of the week my BP stays at that level I may try going off the meds for a week and monitoring. I don’t think it is medication related as I had the light-headedness for a month or so before starting medication; but if adjusting that gives the desired results then GREAT.

        • Henk Noordhuizen March 22, 2019 at 11:39 am

          Hypertensy (and heart/bloodvessel problems) is not a BP medicine deficiency but a magnesium deficiency.High(er) bloodsugar,and even diabetis is magnesium deficiency related as well. Raised cholesterol is not a statin deficiency,and one apple a day works almost as well as statins,but without the negative adverse affects.Cholesterol is extremely important for a good health!

          Magnesium citrate,or,even better,magnesium bisglycinate work well on a high(er) bloodpressure.Keep in mind that,for elder people,a little higher BP is considered normal than for younger people;for 60+ a BP of 160/90 is concidered normal/acceptable.No medication needed,except for greedy doctors. A lower BP is,of course,better.

          Very important: keep your adrenalin as low as possible;it can rise your BP level in minutes.When your blood sugar level gets to low,your body produces adrenalin to raise your BS-level by releasing sugar from the liver.This adrenaline circulates for about 3 days in your blood (and raises your BP during that time),before it’s all broken down.

        • Andrea March 22, 2019 at 5:55 pm

          A. Coleman
          One thing some men over 50/60 years old take is a small dose of aspirin, due to its antithrombotic properties.Here in Italy is called,indeed, cardioaspirin, or “aspirinetta”, meaning small aspirin. It’s 100 mg of acetylsalicidic acid instead of the normal 500 mg. I’m just telling you this, since it seems that this BP medications are bothering you quite a bit. Of course, I’m not telling you , you should try it. Maybe just read about it. I know many floxies have trouble and relapses with NSAIDs, but aspirin should be on the “safe” side. I even read an article about it on this website. Me personally, I’ve taken aspirin, after being floxed, for ten days once a day (500 mg,always after a meal) because of an inflammation in my urethra, after a cystoscopy. Didn’t bothered me at all. But, remember we’re all different.

        • A.Coleman March 25, 2019 at 7:20 am

          Henk and Andrea,

          Thanks for the additional feedback.

          Henk, I totally think that magnesium is part of the problem. I had been supplementing (200 mg / day with Epsom salt baths every 4 or 5 days) and had gotten my Mg levels up to 5.7 mg/dL Red Blood Cell (not serum) in February of last year. That is pretty good according to Dr. Carolyn Dean, who recommends shooting for 6.0 mg/dL. Over the summer my Vitamin D levels finally started shooting up (they were very, very low for the first few years of being floxed) which chewed up my Mg, without me realizing it; especially as I slipped a bit supplementing.

          When I got retested this year my Mg was down to 4.9 mg/dL. When I got that result I doubled my Mg supplementation up to 400 mg / day. I think I should go to 600 but my integrative medicine doc cautioned against it. I already supplement with Mg glycinate; so no change to do there. Though was thinking about adding a very small bit of Mg taurate (100 mg / day) since I know it is supposed to get in the brain better.

          I do know that in the last few weeks my BP had been going down some and was thinking that maybe I was reaching a tipping point with the Mg. And after reading feedback here; I was brave enough to try cutting the pills in half.

          I am now on my 4th day of halving my BP medication and my BP is the same or a bit lower. My lightheadedness is a little better.

          I am going to check with the doc and see what he thinks about stopping the BP medication altogether. I am 52, so not quite to where BP normally starts rising; but after reading your post and Andrea’s I did some more reading and would be comfortable with a BP in the 130 / 85 realm; if that was where it ends up when not on meds. My cholesterol is in line; last checked it was 140.

          I found a site where I could calculate my stroke and heart attack chances and the difference was less than a half percent (3.9% vs. 3.5%) using my BP on treatment and BP not treated (if I can get it down to 130 / 85 not on meds). That’s a risk I will take to be off the medicine.

          Still think that some of the lightheadedness is fluoroquinolone related, or at least related to some chemical imbalance my recovery has created; but if I could cut it down a bit more I could deal with it – at least until my body gets back to “normal”.

          THANKS AGAIN FOR THE IDEAS AND SUPPORT. This site and it’s members are life savers.

        • Henk Noordhuizen March 25, 2019 at 10:02 am

          Hi A.Coleman,is it since you started that BP medicine that you’re MG went down? Wouldn’t surprise me because The body seems to “recognise” synthetic “medicines” as being a toxine and starts all kinds of detoxification processes when confronted with these chemicals. And many,if not most of these processes need lots of MG;that’s why the list of MG “robbing” medicines is growing and growing,with nasty effects on human health.A fluoride poisoning,too,is causing a MG defficiency (FQ’s).. Not a suprise,that a MG defficiency is called “The Biggest Secret” of orthodox medicine in the alternative sector.

          Halving down on BP medication and BP not going up,instead still going down a bit,looks promising.When I was floxed I,immediatly,got heart palpitations and my BP went up a lot.It took a year,and lots of MG in different forms,for it to get back to normal (I have my BP meter set for 130/85 since I bought it,several years ago,having passed the age of 50).The (accepted) BP goes up,slowly,from 45-50 years old,probably,in part,because the intestines (ánd the teeth/chewing) get less effective,and MG and other vitamines and minerals get absorbed less efficient as well.

          Don’t worry about cholesterol;the cholesterol story proved to be a hoax,and new research shows that there is no connection at all between cholesterol and heart diseases (much info about this on the Mercola website,and books like “The cholesterol Hoax”. Actually,the real danger for heart diseases comes from alcohol,sugar and high carb diets (in fact; from high insuline levels).

          Don’t overdo MG supplementation (like you’re int.doc advices;I agree with him).MG,Calcium,vit. K2 and Vit.D-intake must be balanced.Taking to much of one of those and the effect might be negative on the other 3 componentsoif this quartet.

          Please,don’t take sites where you can calculate your risk for stroke and heart attack too serious;to little is known,and too much variables involved to do a reliable calculation on this risk. And,written on this site,over and over again;no two persons are the same,which makes these kind of calculations very doubtful.

        • A.Coleman March 27, 2019 at 10:51 am


          My Mg started going down before I started the BP meds. As I noted what chewed up my Mg was Vitamin D supplementation. A few months after my floxing my Mg was down to 9 ng/dL following floxing. I got it up to the low 30s, but couldn’t get it any higher. My integrative medicine doc had me up to 7500 IU / day of Vitamin D and then last summer it finally took off and when last measured in September it was in the upper 70s ng / dL. I am now on 4000 IU / day. I am sure that is what used up the Mg and also what indirectly caused my BP to go up. After consulting with my integrative medicine doc and getting a new Vitamin D level I will probably drop that supplementation to 2000 IU / day at least for the summer.

          I have now been on a half dose of BP meds for nearly a week and my BP has not only not gone up, but has continued to stay the same or inch down. Also later in the day, as the BP meds wear off my lightheadedness gets less or sometimes goes away. I am hoping to get the green light to stop the BP meds all together this Friday – when I see the doctor.

          I didn’t up my Mg supplementation until January of this year and I think that the low Mg was impacting my blood pressure and probably my blood glucose, as you noted too. I think that as my Mg levels got closer to normal it started causing the BP meds to create light headedness.

          Fingers crossed I can stop the BP meds; keep supplementing at my current levels for Mg, and Vitamin B while dropping Vitamin D and K some and I might be well.

    • Attsy March 21, 2019 at 8:42 am Reply

      Hi A. Coleman,
      I have just read your post. It might be antibiotics related. As my colon is healing very nicely I have similar problems to yours.
      My BP is normal (but when I went through benzo withdrawal it fluctuated the same way as yours for a few months).
      I also have the feeling of passing out which comes out of nowhere and my sugar in blood is a bit higher than the norm and the iron is now at the bottom of the norm. Which I didn’t have before I was floxed. I cut off alot of sugar from my diet now. I went for rehabilitation for the sore neck. Before I was floxed I used to be quite hot all the time, now my legs and hands are cold and I feel cold sensations inside. I catch cold like every month and as spring started I am pretty allergic (which I didn’t have before I was floxed to this extent).
      I take magnesium, B12 injections and another supplements (folic acid, vit. D, C and A).
      Someone recommended here borage, so I drink a cup daily.
      I hope your symptoms will improve.

      • A.Coleman March 22, 2019 at 10:00 am Reply


        Interesting how similar our symptoms are. Because my main issue when floxed initially were digestive problems and peripheral neuropathy. The digestion is much improved and the neuropathy has almost gone away. In fact in the last month it has been completely gone most days.

        I actually anticipate that eventually I will be able to stop the BP meds; at least until I am in my 60s (I am 52 now) – maybe a year who knows. If it is FQ related.

        What I didn’t say in my post was that I have been eating Paleo (mostly – cheats include still using milk in green tea lattes and oats for breakfast) since the beginning of the year, which was about 2 months after light headedness started; so my sugar is much less than before.

        Sure hope if it is a FQ symptom that it resolves in a few months; because then I might consider myself well.

        • Attsy March 23, 2019 at 12:49 pm

          A. Coleman,
          yes, that’s why I reacted because it seemed to me very similar.
          I also had mainly digestion issues but it improved a lot. I followed low-residude diet without gluten and lactose. But I sometimes cheat now, unfortunately for example today I ate some gluten free cake outside and I don’t feel well now. It would be great if I could again eat like before I was floxed but it will never happen as I was diagnosed (shortly before I was floxed) with celiac disease. I heard about Paleo but never studied it. Maybe I will look into it.
          I do believe that you would be able to get off your BP medication in the future, if it’s FQ related.
          Hope the symptomps and everything related will go away soon.

      • Jackie April 6, 2019 at 11:18 am Reply

        Hi I have weaned off a benzo as they similar to fluoroquinolone poisoning. I would urge everyone to do thorough research into every drug they are or have taken. I believe that this page , benzo groups should join together to get these evil drugs banned once and for all. These are crmes against Humanity

  20. Kyle March 20, 2019 at 8:24 am Reply

    Hi A Coleman – I’ve a year out from being floxed and struggle with very similar symptoms, cold and hot sensations in my legs, which come ago. Pressure in my face and temples and also cluster headaches, accompanied by lightheadedness and black floaters in my vision.The severity of these symptoms comes and go but are fairly constant over the last 8 months.I thought it was possible that I had sinus issues caused by the Cipro/Levaquin so I went to see an ENT who did a CAT scan of my sinuses. Results showed my sinuses were pristine. He recommended me to a neurologist stating that sometimes cluster headaches will mirror sinus symptoms,he also acknowledged that these antibiotics can cause neurological issues. Based on all the reading on this site it seems to be seeing a neurologist might be a waste of time so I haven’t taken him up on his referral. Things that have helped me: For lightheadedness Ashwagandha root, Headaches/Pressure: Tylenol, Magnesium, Acupuncture, Glutathione tablets. Hot cold sensation and tingling in the legs: Alpha lipoic acid, Meyers cocktail (IV treatment).

    Have you done anything different? Taking a new supplement? Are you still eating antibiotic free meat? The reason I ask is I’m pretty much positive my symptoms flare up if I put the wrong thing in my body.

    • A. Coleman March 20, 2019 at 6:52 pm Reply


      Thanks for sharing. I did see neurologists, but they really didn’t do much other than confirm I had some peripheral nerve damage.

      I will investigate the Ashwagandha root. I am already doing tylenol as needed. I take 600 mg of Mg daily, upped from 400 mg when I got recent Mg RBC results. I used to do acupuncture regularly, but haven’t been in quite a while. I do take liposomal glutathione daily. Tried ALA and while it worked for neuropathy it also made the headaches worse, so I stopped.

      I haven’t done anything noticeably different. Just a relapse. I eat Paleo and organic, so don’t think it is food related. Since the beginning of the year I haven’t even been to a restaurant.

    • Mike May 1, 2019 at 10:00 am Reply

      Hi Kyle,

      did you have any numbness in your face as well as the facial pressure? It’s been 2.5 years since I took Levo and my symptoms come and go. nothing like it was for the first four months when I was having my toughest time. Anyway, I still find myself concerned that there’s a more serious underlying problem even though I’ve had CT scan, MRI, X Rays all the blood work. it never leaves my mind. The head pressure hasn’t been back much in months thankfully. I also stick with Tylenol (usually Cold and Flu) for my headaches.

      • Kyle May 1, 2019 at 10:52 am Reply

        Hi Mike- yes I have had some numbness, overall I would say the pressure in my head and face has occurred less and less frequently, however my head is far from back to normal. Although I still have black floaters and cold or burning sensation through out my body (Mostly legs) that comes and goes and my energy level is far from were it should be, my head symptoms are also my biggest concern. Although I’ve had moments/days were my head has felt normal, for the most part these symptoms have been a constant for me over the last 8-9 months.The severity of my head issues seems to be triggered by to much physical activity.I feel as though I’m constantly walking on egg shells, monitoring how much physical activity I can do before I push myself over the edge which results in having sometimes days or weeks of feeling crappy. Acupuncture helps allot, my acupuncturist thinks that certain physical activity can strain your neck not allowing energy to get to your head which may trigger the severity of my head symptoms.I’ve also had IV Meyers cocktail treatments with extra Mag that has also provided some relief. I’m also NOW a firm believer of the gut brain connection, restoring order in the gut should improve overall health throughout the body. With that being said I remain very optimistic that these symptoms will subside in the next 4-6months. I hope this is temporary for you and the symptoms disappear for good.

    • Anna May 1, 2019 at 10:10 am Reply

      I too have weird sensations and a feeling of movement or pressure in my sinus/temple area. Specifically the sinuses in the front of the forehead. I never felt these sensations, not even once, before Cipro. Also, there is eye swelling in one eye, not the eye itself, but the muscle under the eye. The doctor told the eye muscle swelling was an autoimmune response, but the swelling is still there almost one year later. Either the inflammation is persisting due to autoimmune response or now the skin stretched a little and is encouraging fluid to build up in a pocket under the eye that was not there before Cipro. Anyway, it is most likely related to the sinus pressure and weird sensations in the face that I feel.

  21. Craig Coulter March 20, 2019 at 11:10 pm Reply

    I was floxed in December now about 3 months out, am only 21, had to withdraw from college for psychological reasons, im suffering from severe psychological adverse effects from Levaquin from a 10 day prescription, I’m pushing though even though I’m scared, this website helps me a lot i learn new things everyday from it , while sometimes reading the bad stories worries me, but i am appreciative of all the good info, specifically a guy named Jason he contributes a lot of good stuff in some of he posts comments.

    • A.Coleman March 21, 2019 at 11:47 am Reply

      Craig – so sorry to hear. College should be the best years of your life!

      Just remember that time helps nearly everyone to some degree. I know in early days it is REALLY HARD to push on; especially if you think it may be years before you are well. I am 3 1/2 years out and getting closer; hoping to be well in 6 to 12 months.

      IMO – being young is a key to a quicker recovery. I think those who are younger recover quite a bit faster than those of us who are older – I was 48 when I was floxed.

      Hold on; eat clean; follow the recommendations on here especially for Mg, Vitamin D, Vitamin B. Other things may help you individually. Don’t know how you are located or how money impacts your situation, but acupuncture may help both mind and body. I know it really helped me mentally and helped me physically some too.

      Stay strong

      • Craig Coulter March 21, 2019 at 12:10 pm Reply

        Thanks for responding, I’m trying to gain as much info on this site a little bit daily as it’s hrs for me to retain much i have severe brain fog on top of already pretty bad adhd so it’s tough, i want to come up with a plan to try to be well enough to return to school in August, I’m already 3 months out, i wouldn’t say I’m better if anything my symptoms have been progressive but also changing, so far what I’m planning on doing is takin PQQ, magnesium, probiotic ( already taking but going to get a better one) , Mito Q, working out and using sauna, acupuncture, yoga, trying to eat better, trying to minimise fluorine exposure, not touching alcohol or caffeine, caffeine i haven’t had in over a year anyway so will be easy , alcohol will be easy as i never was a big drinker, but i did like to go to parties as I’m in a fraternity and drink on vacations weddings special occasions etc.. but i would never drink for no reason … . This all happened to me because a doctor prescribed me Levaquin for a suspected bronchitis which i probably didn’t even have all he said was i should take a probiotic with it cause it’s strong and causes stomach issues .. i can’t believe he would do this because on the computer it says i have a bad psychiatric reaction to prednisone and I’m pretty sure Levaquin has a black box warning for nervous system reactions.. about a year before this happened i had a adverse reaction to methylprednisolone that resulted in severe panic attacks/ anxiety for a year which i completely recovered from which is why i think i am mentally toughing this out and i became skeptical of medicine but when i got the Levaquin i thought oh it’s just a antibiotic what can go wrong .. sorry for the lengthy response it’s just i feel good talking about it as i have no one to talk about with at home because i feel as the only people who really understand are the ones who have gone through this

  22. canie March 28, 2019 at 10:12 am Reply

    why any kind of organic thing works for me i think
    juicing nut butters and other herbal
    organic cashew or food that has vitamin
    im allergic in in can food and other chemical
    even in external use
    meats flare up the symptoms so living 3 years only can be okay if i maintain lifestyle
    so now its a lifestyle to keep it up … stay away from any other meds for three years only organic vitammin grapeseed oil is good and moringga powder
    so i think i forget about my sickness a little because i keep myself making busy to cultivate of things that help the body or regenerate fully raw kristina was one of my inspiration
    and other vegan that was more into health
    because some animal has antibiotic and fed by articial food or corn that flare up and dont help to have a new cells i think
    thanks i wish everyone have speedy recover and god bless to all 🙂

  23. GINN March 28, 2019 at 11:33 am Reply

    I was floxed by Cyprofloxacin. Sorry for my english. Im from slovakia. I am took cyprofloxacin on inflammation prostate 8 days, i had 15 pills, but i stop on 8. When i took 1 pill, i had terrible pain in my legs, i cant move… i lie in my bed 3 weeks, because my legs aches, pain, … i had depression, panic attacks. I have 23 years and im happy that i stop take all pills, maybe I would be in a wheelchair. After 3 weeks of crazy consequences, I decided to start healing and detoxifying. I studied what would help to try tomorrow. I bought serrapeptase, CigaPan.ru, magnesium, calcium, vitamin D, B-complex, vitamin C, Kremlin, Epsom salt, Goji, milk thistle. I still have eye problems, I see my own eyelashes maybe because they are the eyes that are for you that are spread out in the light, on the head, on the muscles, on the head or on the head. out of sight, weird vision of movement and movement. I have a brain fog. Cyprofloxacin destroys lives without believing I will get out of it over time. It’s all about patience and time. I still have palpalatyat’s problem, palpal has got antibiotics but palpable I wish All that came from what happened that might happen to be helping, as it happens. Well thank you.

    • L March 28, 2019 at 11:46 am Reply

      I had a lot of vision issues and I THOUGHT was seeing my own eyelashes, but I was not. That part at least is now gone.

      • GINN March 28, 2019 at 12:46 pm Reply

        Should detox help with my eyes or i should go on eye doctor? how you got rid of eye problems please? and i have tinnitus too… its terrible :/

        • A.Coleman March 28, 2019 at 1:07 pm


          So sorry to hear about your problems. You will find people from all over the world on this forum; so know you are not alone. You are taking the right first steps. Maybe try to find a naturopathic doctor (someone who works with your body; won’t prescribe medicine; but will suggest vitamins and minerals and help you manage amounts).

          Time is your friend. Eventually everyone heals some and since you are so young it is likely you will heal all the way. Be prepared for lots of ups and downs and your body tries to rid itself of the poison and get nutrients re-balanced.

          As to the tinnitus – it too will likely get quieter given time. My tinnitus started about a year ago and is now so quiet that I only notice it when it is completely quiet. For those quiet times when you are trying to sleep consider some of the apps out there that either match the tone of your tinnitus or create white noise. I used one that created a noise that matched my tinnitus and hearing that externally helped cancel out the internal noise. Within a week or so of using this I was sleeping as good as before the tinnitus (still not very good because of ciprofloxin related insomnia). Today I don’t even use the app and it is not because of conditioning.

          Good luck – keep positive and post here as needed.

        • L March 28, 2019 at 2:09 pm

          I honestly don’t know what helped. Something I think that helped the bazillion floaters I had was Can C eyedrops. (NAC eyedrops) Had to used them religiously, twice a day for over a year. As for eye doctors, I have seen several, most are AMA ensconced and still use cipro eyedrops.

          As for the tinnitus, I have it too and I WISH I knew how to get rid of it. Sometimes it is a near deafening hiss/buzz/humming sound. Makes me nuts.

      • GINN March 28, 2019 at 2:19 pm Reply

        Thanks for answers. I see this https://www.google.sk/search?q=light+&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwj5sbyR4aXhAhUK4BoKHaTfAFoQ2-cCegQIABAC&oq=light+&gs_l=mobile-gws-wiz-img.3..0l5.23377.24580..24908…0.0..1.547.1802.0j6j5-2……0….1…….0.kII_x3T3tbQ&ei=uzmdXLnoJYrAa6S_g9AF&bih=718&biw=412&prmd=ivn&hl=sk#imgrc=pWvTMO3y7aN3CM

        Reflections from lights and objects… strong from lamps….

        • L March 28, 2019 at 2:59 pm

          yeah, I had a lot of light stuff going on including tons of floaters, the eyelash thing and LOTS of flashes. You need to be careful because the flashes are associated with macular degeneration, so you may want to go see an opthamologist

  24. Henk Noordhuizen March 29, 2019 at 3:30 am Reply

    Here’s an excelent article by Dr.Mercola on the different supllement forms of magnesium,and why Magnesium L-threonate is the best form for your brain:


    Here,in the Netherlands,Mercola products,Magtein (=Magnesium L-Threonate) are very expensive.The Magtein from the “NOW” trademark is much cheaper,the Mercola Mag being two times as expensive!.

    • L March 29, 2019 at 10:06 am Reply

      Yes the L-threonate is the one I have been using for the last year or so…recommended to me by both an integrative MD and an ND.

      • GINN March 29, 2019 at 12:05 pm Reply

        I take 400 mg nature magnezium. But i must still take antibiotic azytromicin 500 mg because i still have inflammation prostate. I think its no help… idk what to do.. how delete inflammation..

        • L March 29, 2019 at 12:44 pm

          You might try some natural anti inflammatories like turmeric or Boswellia. There are others you can find in a search

        • Henk Noordhuizen March 29, 2019 at 12:53 pm

          When an antibiotic doesn’t work within a week,it’s no use going on with taking it any longer,I guess.I might be wrong,but what I dó know is that every day of use brings more damage to your body on multiple levels.

          One thing you might try is taking 25-50 mg of zinc(citrate) every day;zinc is very importatnt for the prostate.

          Another thing you might try is,visiting the Bobbeck website and read the instructions for building your own magnetic pulser.This device,together with the zinc,helped me several times with a painfull underbelly (prostate?).The first time I used this methode/protocoll I had much pain,and troubles peeing.After a few weeks the pain was gone and I pee’d like an 18 year old,while in my 50’s.

        • Andrea March 30, 2019 at 4:27 pm

          Hey HEnk, when you say the “bob beck protocol” you mean just the pulser, or is it really a protocol with things to follow, like suppleemtns etc..?

        • Henk Noordhuizen March 31, 2019 at 3:07 am

          Andrea,I wrote,more than once,about the Beck protocol,and where you can find info on everything about it,and about the man who developed it.The complete protocol consists of the Silver Pulser (to clean your blood of bacteria,fungi,virusses etc,ánd to make Colloïdal Silver.),the Magnetic Pulser (doing the same,in deeper tissues,and decreases pain),and the Ozonator ( to make fresh,ozonated water,which gives your body an oxide boost).

          You can use all of these four parts of the protocol on it’s own;thats why I advised you to try the Magnetic Pulser (pain and infections).This is also one of the two devices you can easily build yourself,for cheap.You can build the Silver Pulser as well;both schematics are on the Bob Beck website.But this one needs a basic understandic of electronics.

          Here,once again,the link to the Bob Beck memorial website,with all the information you need about this remarkable man and his devices (and a lot about his other inventions as well):


  25. Andrea March 30, 2019 at 4:41 pm Reply

    Hey guys, I know we have talked about it many times, can anyone please give a direct experience with ozone therapy. I’ve found a doctor in my town who use this method, but I’m also reading that the siede efects can be really dangerous. I’m considering it because of my bladder problems. Any info?

    • L March 30, 2019 at 4:44 pm Reply

      none as of yet, but planning on doing as soon as they can see me next week. I have not read anything negative about it other than you are not supposed to inhale it.

      • Andrea April 1, 2019 at 4:49 pm Reply

        Thanks L

        • L April 1, 2019 at 5:19 pm

          I wanted it done this week but the soonest they could take me is next week. Will keep you posted.

      • Andrea April 2, 2019 at 9:03 am Reply

        All rright, thanks. I’m very interested

      • Justin Baghai April 3, 2019 at 5:46 am Reply

        What are the proposed benefits of it? I’m also exploring doing it but haven’t heard how it differs from IV therapies

        • L April 3, 2019 at 8:56 am

          There is a wealth of information online regarding ozone therapy, It oxygenates the cells and is used for detoxifying, boosting the immune system, fighting bacteria, virus, fugus, and mold; It is used routinely in treating Lyme disease and also cancer. It is also supposed to help treat auto immune disease and macular degeneration.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 3, 2019 at 9:53 am

          L., do you have any scientific sources for all these claims,or only anecdotal ones?

        • L April 3, 2019 at 11:04 am

          again, I would search online. I know that when I was first floxed virtually ALL the Lyme patients, floxies, and cancer patients were given ozone and were all helped by it. I find it interesting one someone on floxie hope says “but is this anecdotal or are there scientific studies?” because that is the same thing that big pharma advocates always throw at us, when we personally know things outside of the AMA/FDA/allopathic world that have helped us. That said, here is a start https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3312702/

      • Barbara Arnold April 3, 2019 at 10:38 pm Reply

        I have first hand experience of ozone autohemotherapy. It is one of the few things that really helped me. It is not a cure, for me at least, but it helped heal my mitochondria, gave me energy and a general feeling of well being. My ozone Doctor had been using ozone for 20 years and also helped heal back problems with ozone. I had a fall and compressed my spine which did heal, but left me with a very painful coccyx. I had two injections in my coccyx which cured this problem. As L said there is plenty of evidence ‘out there’ if you search. It is used as a 1st line treatment in Cuba, and there are many Countries in Europe using it. As long as you make sure the clinic is ‘experienced in using it, there is no downside.You normally start to feel better after about the 5th or 6th session. You may also experience a ‘herx’ re action intially, but that goes.
        I agree with L about ‘Big Pharma’ because the only negative reports I found were from employers of ‘Big Pharma’ trying to discredit it. After all we can’t have people feeling better can we.

        • Madge Hirsch April 4, 2019 at 2:15 am

          Hi Barbara- how did your bladder investigations go?

        • Barbara Arnold April 4, 2019 at 4:09 am

          Hi Madge,
          Having a cystocopia on the 29th of this month. It’s because of a microscopic amount of blood after a urine test. Apparently it’s pretty common. Thanks for asking, I’ll let you know how it goes.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 4, 2019 at 4:58 am

          A cystoscopia because of a microscopic amount of urine in the blood? The risk (of a UTI,for excample) might be higher than the cause.Might be a little kidney- or bladder stone,etc. Might be better to test the urine (yourself?) with teststrips of good quality,over a period of weeks,to see if these bloodcells in your urine are there permanently. UTI is a common infection after a cystoscopia,and antibioticas are not our (floxies) favorites.If the blood maintains to be there,a cystoscopia might be considered.

        • Barbara Arnold April 4, 2019 at 5:33 am

          Henk, how can you see microscopic blood in your urine with test strips ? I’ve had two urine tests and it’s still there. I realise the risks and if I could I would choose not to have it. But I think peace of mind it’s nothing sinister is worth it.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 4, 2019 at 8:09 am

          Barbara,the self-check I use is only sold in The Netherlands.It checks on Leucocyt’s,Nitrites and blood (hemoglobin).These tests are the best,availible,and identic and of the same quality doctors use.I don’t know if a simular check is availible where you’re living.
          I didn’t want to frighten you but you might want to make your doc aware of the risk of UTI and the use of antibiotics for floxies.He/she might want to consider postponing the cystoscopia and doing a regular testing in the coming weeks/month to see how things develope.

        • L April 4, 2019 at 8:54 am

          Glad to hear it helped you. As I mentioned before virtually every single one of my first ND’s Lyme, cancer and flox patients was given it, and I wasn’t because he was giving me H2O2 and there was too much overlap. I am really hoping it helps with this nonstop congestion issue that keeps me up at night, trying to get it out of my lungs—and keeps my coughing and choking all day. I have been to over 6 different kinds of doctors and no one has been able to help. I truly think it is an auto immune thing brought on by the cipro, and I have read that it can help with auto immune disease. You said you started to feel it after the fifth…were these individual IVs? I am doing 5 pass. (I was going to do 10 pass but this is the soonest they could get me in and there was only time for the five, so I jumped at the appointment.) I am not too worried about herxing…I am over 4 years out and so far nothing that has seemed to affect others on here has bothered me, eg dental anesthesia, glut. this last year has been miserable and this has prevented me from getting back to my “old life,” so I am pretty much willing to do anything at this point.

        • Barbara Arnold April 4, 2019 at 9:21 am

          L… I had individual sessions once or twice a week. Initially I had 20 sessions felt so much better. Then a long time later I had some more after a fall. My Doctor does not recommend 10 pass because of something to do with the veins as I recall. He went to a conference with a lot of ozone Docs where 10 pass was discussed and not recommended. So I would personally not do it. I have not heard of 5 pass.

        • L April 4, 2019 at 11:28 am

          Thanks. Five pass sounded like a happy medium for me.

        • Barbara Arnold April 4, 2019 at 10:01 am

          Henk, I really appreciate your imput. It’s a difficult decision for me as I know all the risks. Two of my friends one a floxy another not a floxy have had it without any problems. I am making an informed choice, even though I don’t want it I am having it. The reason is, I want to know it’s nothing major. I have had penicillin since being floxed and I’m not worried about taking it again if necessary. My Doctor is the one that poisoned me, knows all about fluroquinolones now through me educating him and the EMA results. He didn’t know about the side effects previously as the Spanish government sanctioned them. Doctors just follow the rules. When he found out from me he never wrote anther prescription for fluroquinolones again. They are fully aware of my floxing and I do question EVERYTHING. So rightly or wrongly I’m having it. I am lucky I’m not one of those people that doesn’t seem to re act to everything. At least this time I know the risks. Thanks for your concern.

    • L April 8, 2019 at 7:33 pm Reply

      Hey Andrea, I just got back from my first ozone. I was going to do 5-pass, but since it was the first time he suggested 2-3. I ended up doing 3. (IT is a machine and you can do anywhere from one pass to 10.) Whether or not it will help with my particular issues, I won’t know until I do a few more. But I feel fine. In fact, if anything, I feel like it gave me a spurt of energy. Definitely going back for more.

  26. Henk Noordhuizen March 31, 2019 at 3:37 am Reply
  27. Henk Noordhuizen March 31, 2019 at 3:44 am Reply

    I feel sóóó much pity with this troll,frequently “visiting” this website! I’m pretty sure he’s ugly as hell,and has a teeny weeny pe…,which he can only get erected by trolling other people on forums he dislikes. Poor guy has got to get a life,but chances are minimal,I guess.

  28. Andrea April 2, 2019 at 9:06 am Reply

    Hey Henk, Here in my town, I found a docotr who use magnetic therapy for many healht problems. I think it should be more or less the same procedure as the Beck magnetic pulser.
    I have a visit on April 10th. I’ll let you knw what she’s going to tell me…

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 3, 2019 at 6:24 am Reply

      Hi Andrea,there are different forms of magnetic therapy.I’m curious about the form this doctor uses,an if it works. Beck’s method works by generating strong magnetic pulses with steep flanks. This is done by using a capacitor,which delivers a powerfull and very short burst (discharge),delivering most of it’s total charche in only milliseconds.

  29. L April 2, 2019 at 9:58 am Reply

    I know some of you alrealdy get the Mercola letter (Henk 🙂 ) I would urge everyone to read this article on forced vaccination and then join the NVIC Advocacy Portal (in the US I believe) to be able to contact legislators. https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2019/04/02/taking-no-prisoners-vaccine-culture-war.aspx?utm_source=dnl&utm_medium=email&utm_content=art1&utm_campaign=20190402Z1_UCM&et_cid=DM278260&et_rid=582505689

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 2, 2019 at 10:35 am Reply

      Hi L.,I saw it,this morning (it’s evening,here,at the moment). Have you noticed the comments of (professional?) troll igman1291? A perfect example of what happens to your kids (or yourself),when having been made “made strong and healthy” with the full list of vaccines. Poor ig1291 must have severe braindamage; can,by now,only parrot vaccine propaganda and call other people names (probably copied from a list,others wrote down for him).”Moron”,”Retards”,Nut jobs”,or”Get a mental health evaluation. I think then all your problems will be resolved. You are cray-cray.” are among his favorites ;-)) Probably,most of these terms describe him perfectly ;-))

      My latest guess is,that not the vaccins,but aditives like Fluoride are the maing reason for “them” to vaccinate every single person,with as much vaccines as possible,NOT because of the vaccins itself but because they want to dumb the whole world down (except for the “chosen few”),to make us,the people,easier to manipulate. What Fluoride does with the brain is well-known,and since this neuro/brain toxin is not only in water (USA) and toothpaste,but in a growing list of “medicines” and vaccines as well,it’s almost impossible to avoid it entering your body.Look,what it did with our children;never,before,so many of them have brain damage symptoms and/or are sick to the bone.It’s hard to find a child,NOT using medicines on a daily/permanent base!

      • L April 2, 2019 at 11:44 am Reply

        No I didn’t (thankfully) read them. But I have been attacked in the same way on this when I post on facebook. Even when I present really good research. They have no research but are so brainwashed by the big pharma message. And yes I think the additives are a big part of the problem, but even beyond that, they compromise the immune system.

        • Madge Hirsch April 4, 2019 at 2:24 am

          I have recently read a book called “Plague” about the research and persecution of a scientist called Judy Mikovits. It is not well written as it jumps back and forth in time too much and a lot of the technical scientific stuff could be better explained for non scientists but it is a real eye opener. Having had her career ruined she has become involved with advocating for more discussion on the pros and cons of vaccination.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 4, 2019 at 3:23 am

          Here a good interview of Dr. Judy Mikovits,by Dr. Mercola:

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 4, 2019 at 3:56 am

          Here another interview with her. There’s still some controversy about the trustability of her findings. I wonder what’s the truth,here:

        • L April 4, 2019 at 9:04 am

          It’s really sad how many have had their careers ruined by corporate greed. Doctors like Mercola and Oz get their names smeared routinely and are called quacks. We have many politicians and agencies trying to (some successfully) push mandated vaccines which is very scary. Then there are the few brave lone voices like Robert F Kennedy Jr.

  30. GINN April 4, 2019 at 12:29 pm Reply

    My friends, i have one question, can i use Can C eye drops if i have problem with eye from cyprofloxacin? Can i use this for prevention and better visual and orientation, if i don’t have macular degeneration? Because this eyedrops is for it.. or no only for this ? I want antioxidant for eye, i have a lot of visual problem… i think i better see when i look through window how real… so.. Can someone please give here link on amazing for great eye drops, whos are the best for hral vision from floxed cyprofloxacin? Thank you so much.. sorry for bad english…

  31. Attsy April 10, 2019 at 4:57 am Reply

    Hi all,
    from time to time I contact our drug inspection office to inform them about my health state. Just stating what happened. Well today I got the information back that it’s not possible to have prolonged symptoms……Well I sent them results from my biopsy which states that my colon is destroyed (yes it’s destroyed after 10 months after swallowing 6 pills). So I think it is highly impossible that doctors will every stop prescribing these pills to some minor infection.
    I really regret the day when I turned to the doctors for help. So far only three people believe to what happened and I had to give them a lot of information.
    Guys do you continue going to the allopathic doctors for solution or do you think it is just waste of time? Because I went through numerous tests and even when positive results doctors can’t give me solution or advice what to do.

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 10, 2019 at 5:13 am Reply

      Hi Attsy,I agree;most people,friends,and doctors don’t believe the horror stories about FQ’s.That is,untill they,themselves get into trouble after using these evil “medicines”. Untill now,I’ve had only one success with telling the warning to friends:a longtime friend with an enlarged prostate (first treated with Cipro because his doctor “suspected” it to be a bladder infection) visited an internist in the hospital.She wanted to prescribe him an AB,and he told her the story about the danger,heard from me.She agreed (had heard about the problems surrounding FQ’s),and gave him another AB,not from the FQ family.

    • L April 10, 2019 at 9:30 am Reply

      Either this person is completely ignorant or he is gaslighting you. Even the FDA, in their description of fluoroquinolone associated disability talks about the ongoing nature of the problems. There is just SO much information out there. Utter bs.

      I avoid allopaths as much as possible, and try to seek out ones that are functional or integrative. Sadly, I had a great integrative internist who no longer accepts insurance and is very expensive. I am always on the look out for another. Mostly I see naturopaths. I see a holistic dentist (Huggins training—the gold standard). I have an integrative cardiologist. I have an acupuncturist who I see on occasion.

      • Attsy April 10, 2019 at 11:00 am Reply

        well L, I think it’s gaslighting…..because they informed people back in November last year about possible persistent problems including joint paints, depression, anxiety, insomnia etc. and now they deny it to my email.
        Unfotunately we probably don’t have integrative, holistic and naturopathic doctors in my country 😦 :(, I am very sad because of this. Many people who call themselves naturopaths here are frauds who are only after your money and they don’t have real medical knowledge. Are you from Canada (if I can ask)?

        • L April 10, 2019 at 11:25 am

          sorry to hear that. no, I am in the US. I don’t know where you are, but here is a tool for finding functional medicine doctors in many countries. https://www.ifm.org/find-a-practitioner/

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 11, 2019 at 12:27 am

          Thank you for the link,L. I even found a few in NL,and in Belgium.The nearest one,for me,has a classic schooling as an MD,and specialized in Functional Medicine.But too far away for me,and too expensive.My insurance does only pay a very small part of the costs,so,I can’t afford it.

        • L April 11, 2019 at 10:18 am

          too bad…that’s a good combination because then usually insurance will pay for at least the consult, if not the treatment. I had an integrative MD I love but he no longer takes insurance and is very expensive. I rely mostly on NDs but sometimes you just need an MD and damn it’s hard to find functional/integrative ones!

        • Attsy April 11, 2019 at 2:04 am

          Thanks L, I am from the Middle Europe. Still it Is funny I went through many tests and in the end was told to wait….the thing I already knew months before. I could have saved myself numerous hours od useless stress waiting at the doctors.

        • L April 11, 2019 at 10:25 am

          yeah, I had tons of tests too. Most of us have, because doctors cannot fathom that ALL this is from their precious little pills. If I could go back and have a do-over (of course I wouldn’t have taken them to begin with) but I would have skipped the half dozen doctors I saw, the myriad tests I did, and gone straight to the naturopath and IVs.

        • Attsy April 11, 2019 at 2:40 pm

          L, I checked the link and the closest are in Germany 😦 so this is not possible for me….but still thanks

        • L April 11, 2019 at 3:58 pm

          So sorry Attsy…where are you located again?

        • Attsy April 12, 2019 at 5:16 am

          L, from the Czech Republic, I am only able to go inside my country….

        • L April 12, 2019 at 9:22 am

          Attsy, this is a long shot, but… Here is a listing for an integrative MD in the US, but part of her training was in the Czech Republic. Perhaps you can contact her via email and ask her for suggestions…. https://www.providencephysicians-sc.com/doctor-directory/dana-m-i-nairn-md

  32. Andrea April 10, 2019 at 8:54 am Reply

    Hi everyone, Henk in particular. I’ve got some news.
    Yesterday, after dinner, I’ve tried the Lactospore you’ve suggested. It’s probably too soon to say it,but i think I’ma laready seeing some minor improvement. I’m keeping my finger crossed… I was already taking a probiotic with 15 different strains of lactobacillus and bifidobacterium, but it was missing this particular bacillus coagulans. So I added 1 capsule to the stack.
    Today I went to see that orthopedic I told you about in a previous post. She’s using this particular “chair”, that uses magnetic therapy. She said that it’s very different from the Sota Pulser. Defenetly in power. She’s said that it’s like 1000 more powerful than an MRI and there’re not know side effects. She seems to be very intelligent and not money driven, as a matter of fact, she said that she doesn’t know if this particular treatment could help in my case, anyway, she want to see all my medical papers and then decide. Anyway, she already treated with success people with prostate problems. She even treated people after a prostectomy.
    Another thing, Henk. I remember you writing about your good experience with zinc in the prostate department. Could you tell me what kind of zinc you used, what supplement?
    I was reading about this optizinc (wich is zinc bound to the aminoacid monomethionine), wich is a well absorbed form of zinc. But you have to be careful with what the label says, in facts, the label says 30 mg, wich is a great dosage, but in reality 30 mg is equivalent to 30 mg of zinc+monomethionine, only 3.6 mg are elemental zinc, with that dosage. So I think I should take at least 4 capsules to get close to the real 30 mg dose. What do you think about it?

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 10, 2019 at 10:27 am Reply

      Hi Andrea,great,that the Lactospore works for you!

      Her magnetic chair 1000 times more powerfull than MRI? Sorry;I doubt that a lot! And about adverse reactions (if the 1000 times more powerfull than MRI is true): people,working around MRI equipment often complain about headaches,and other reactions. Please,ask her for the name,and model of that chair;I’m very curious.Even the fact that she seems to know about the technical facts and specifications of the Sota Pulser amaze me;most people,in particulair doctors,never even heard of Bob Beck and the Sota devices.

      At the moment,since about 2 weeks,I use zinc again.The same as I always use Zinc Citrate 50 mg (sometimes 100 mg,when the problem is acute,and only for a short while).This is 158 mg zinc citrate,with 50 mg elemental zinc.This trademark stops with the 50 mg;from now on they will only produce 25 mg (elemental zinc).Might be due to new EU-reglementation. Your 3,6 mg elemental zinc pils caps Four caps is 14,6 mg;only half of the 30mg dose you aim for.

      Trying too many things at a time might bring confusion.When things go as wished,you won’t know which part of your “protocol” works,that’s not a bad thing but it might cost more money than neccesary.But when something goes wrong you won’t know which part of the “protocol” causes the problems.

      Well,I’m glad to hear there’s improvement,at last, and I hope that it will keep on going the right way from now on.And please,don’t try to fix something that’s not broke,next time;you’ll save yourself a lot of problems and money.

      • Andrea April 10, 2019 at 3:22 pm Reply

        Hi Henk. The only page I can find are just a few, and in Italian. Is a quite new device, I suppose. I don’t know, I’m very skeptical, but, who knows…
        PS I don’t know if the lactospore is really working, but right know I feel a little better. Hope it continues, even if I doubt it.
        Anyway, regarding the zinc supplement I meant 6.3 mg per pill, so more or less 25 mg. Not that bad…

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 11, 2019 at 12:43 am

          Hi Andrea,you could send me the name of the device;I might find info in english.Or send me a link from one or more pages in Italian;I can understand a little of it (or use Google Translate ;-))

          I hope the Lactospore will keep on improving your gut health;it gave mine a great,and lasting improvement. The other supp. I’m enthousiastic about is the Magnesium L-Theorate;it improved my sleep quite a bit.I already used Melatonine and a big cup of Camomilla tea before sleep,and this Magn.Th. brought my sleep quality to a higher level,deffinitely.

          In a few month my Lavender will blossom and I will put a few blossoms under my pillow.That’s an old remedy,but I only recently remembered.For people who want to try Lavender:use only a few blossoms;too much might give you a headache.

          The 25mg Zinc is enough for maintaining a good zinc level but when you want to take a defficiency away,you might take more (50mg) for a while.

        • Andrea April 11, 2019 at 8:17 am

          Well, then just google Functional Magnetic Stimulation (FMS) , or Tesla Stym.

          Never had great results with mag. L threonate. Used it for a month. Actually sometimes it gave me some weird brain feeling. I don’t know how to explain it. Right now, besides the probiotics, I’m back on my regimen of vitamin D3 (5000iu) and k2 (200 mcg) plus some magnesium malate. It is considered one of the best for muscle spasm etc. Very recomended for people with fybromialgia. But I’m taking it just as prevention, since while using D3 you should always use mag.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 11, 2019 at 11:31 am

          Tesla Stym. delivers 2500 Gauss,where as the Sota Magnetic Pulser delivers .6000 Gauss,which makes the Sota Pulser over 2 times as powerfull !! One thing I like on the Tesla Stym is the ventilation of the electro-magnet;the Sota e.m. gets quite warm after 20-30 minutes.On the pics I can not see if it’s an active cooling system (with a ventilator),or a passive one (just by the openings in the magnet hausing).

          So,the “story” of the Teala Stym being over 1000 times as powerfull as the Sota MP proves to be wrong;in fact the Sota Pulser is 2,4 times as powerfull as the Tesla Stym.And the steep pulses of the Sota MP are intended to create a strong electric pulse,deep in the tissues,whereas the frequenty modulated signal of the Tesla Stym will not. Beck knew what he was doing;he was a life-long inventor,and also improved on many excisting devices.Read his biography on the bobbeck website and you will understand why it’s so hard to improve on his devices.

          These frequenty modulated devices are,in fact not real PEMF devices;they MODULATE the magnetic field while the Sota Pulser PULSES the magnetic field.These pulses generate very stron magnetic pulses,NOT waves.The writer of the folowing article understands part of it,but not all.In fact,he doesn’t even understand that his favorite device is,in fact,NOT a PEMF device at all.So,the research het mentions,on the goods of PEMF,are valid for the Sota MP,but NOT for frequenty modulated devices like the Tesla Stym:


          The new model from Sota has two programs: 2500 Gauss pulses with short reload times,and the standard pulses,6000 Gauss,with longer (ca. 5 seconds) reload times.The 2500 Gauss pulses are used for “skindeep” treatment,while the 6000 Gauss pulses penetrate the body much deeper (> 20 cm).

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 11, 2019 at 11:36 am

          I forgot: PEMF means PULSED Electo-Magnetic Field(s).

        • Andrea April 12, 2019 at 5:04 pm

          Well, now I have something to talk about, next time I see her 🙂
          Thanks Henk. So not only the sota pulser is stronger, but it works in a different way. Even though I don’t completely understand the difference between the two equipments. When you say one modulate the magnetic fields and the other one pulses the magnetic field, you mean that it creates the magnetic fields?
          Just a quick suggestion, how would you use the sota pulser, to try to treat a problem like mine (bladder/prostate). I mean where would you put the magnetic pulser (near your pelvis for example) and for how long?

        • Andrea April 12, 2019 at 5:10 pm

          Oh, just another thing, where did you find the info about the gauss generated by the sota and the tesla devices? In the description it says 2.5 tesla.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 13, 2019 at 2:17 am

          I was wrong with the conversion:the Tesla machine delivers 25.000 Gauss (tired eyes,due to the time of day,and my damaged vision :-(( So,it delivers 4 times the magnetic flux of the Sota,but there’s an important difference;the pulse vs. the waveform. This pulse form is thought to be very important for treating infections;it damages pathogens in a way that stops them from replicating,and it happens so quickly that they can’t adapt. Oh:the conversoion is easy:just search the web for Tesla to Gauss (conversion).

          The “secret” is in the short and very powerfull burst ;in the world of music it’s called “attack”.Electric guitars are known to have such a sharp attack (sudden rise) in their signals that they can destroy the conusses of speakers.It throws al it’s power in a 2,5 mS pulse. The paddle is much smaller than the paddle of the Tesla,so,all the energy is concentrated in a small area,where the Tesla smears it’s energy over a much larger area.


          As far as I understand from the info on the Tesla,it’s mainly ment to treat muscle problems,and other problems that are right under the surface of the skin. In the indications they do write it’s also suited for proatet pain,so you might give it a try,and let me know if it works for you.

          Have a nice weekend (all of you :-))

        • Andrea April 13, 2019 at 5:38 am

          If I’ll start the treatment, I’ll let you know, everything about it 🙂

        • Andrea April 13, 2019 at 3:33 pm

          Oh, and you too, have a nice week end

        • joanneb4 April 13, 2019 at 4:58 pm

          How can I detox fluoride and fluorine ? My functional medicine doctor told me to take Iodoral tablets that have a total of 12.5 mg iodine. That’s 8333% RDA for iodine. But I was floxed in 2015 while on benzos. I avoided all fluoride and fluorine until endoscopy Dec 2016 they used anaesthesia with fluorine, then I took protonix for acid reflux in 2017 which had fluorine and then Prozac and Luvox in 2018 and 2019 that have fluorine and I used toothpaste with fluoride because my dentist scared the living daylights out of me and drank bottled water with fluoride too! I really messed up now I can’t sweat, have kidney problems and can’t sleep and my brain is messed up. I have burning mouth and skin. What can I do to get this out of me? I’ve got extensive nerve and brain damage from all that. Should I take that super high dose of iodine? What else? Please help. I’ve ruined myself.

        • L April 13, 2019 at 10:24 pm

          one thing you should definitely do is start eating two brazil nuts every day. That will keep it at bay. AS far as detoxing, there are a number of options eg iodine/seaweed; dry sauna—if it were I would seek the help of an integrative MD or ND. They can help you through

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 14, 2019 at 4:10 am

          Some research has shown to help get rid of the fluorid in your body.There are,as far as I kno,no tamarind supplements available,so you have to buy the real thing.Nothing wrong with that;it is healthy,with a nice soursweet taste.I love the tamarind candies,made of dried tamarind,with some sugar on the outside (and sometimes some pepper as well).You can buy Tamarind in Toko’s and Asian shops.

          The damage all this Fluoride has caused is hard to (partially) repair.Magnesium supplementing is the first step;there’s a lot of info about it,and of the most effective forms here,on FloxieHope. Take your time to read through all of that,and ask put your questions here,if you don’t understand something or need to know more on a particular subject.

          Avoid ALL sources of Fluoride for the rest of your life,and infor your doctor about this,so he doesn’t prescribe you any “medicine” with Fluoride in it,in the future.

  33. htazbhuoyt April 11, 2019 at 4:54 am Reply
  34. gjocwqlbgx April 11, 2019 at 5:18 am Reply
  35. Henk Noordhuizen April 11, 2019 at 5:26 am Reply

    Damn, where’s my TROLL spray??!!?

  36. Attsy April 15, 2019 at 12:46 am Reply

    Hi all,
    just a question about painkillers. I realised that probably I am getting refloxed bacause I have never stopped taking NSAIDs and that’s why I get a lot of joint pain lately. It makes sense now to me. My question is what do you use for pain? I ordered today Magtein. Unfortunately I don’t know how to deal with the chronic pain I have and stomach cramps. Is there anything which helps you to relieve pain and it’s not NSAIDs? I am now again taking Lactospore.

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 15, 2019 at 2:45 am Reply

      Hi Attsy,the only thing I use against pain is Paracetamole. There are several good advices to treat pain on the Mercola website,like Tumeric,and essential oils. CBD oil/medical marijuana might help you as well:


      NSAID’s are a dangerous class of painkillers. Do you know if the one you use,or other medicines you use contain fluoride?

    • Barbara Arnold April 15, 2019 at 3:56 am Reply

      Hi Attsy, for over a year I have used Kratom for pain and for me it works wonders. Like anything you have to use it responsibly so you don’t build up a tolerance to it. I would suggest you thoroughly research it and if you decide to use it make sure the source is a good one. I use Kraatje. On their website is a lot of information also there are lots of websites that give you full information so you can make an informed choice.

    • L April 15, 2019 at 9:44 am Reply

      First, yes, you absolutely positively do NOT want to be taking NSADS..ever. Some have been helped with CBD balm. I bought some that was supposed to be good but did nothing for me. May try a different line.

    • Attsy April 16, 2019 at 12:39 am Reply

      Thank you all for your answers! I checked and it seems my painkillers don’t contain fluoride. I have been taking a lot of nimesulide and ibuprofenum and that’s why I think I have some side effects lately. Well I have checked your tips and some I have at home so I will take them. I have CBD for example. I have also checked the link.
      If the pain is severe do you think is safe to take metamizol and pitofenone? Because paracetamol always makes my stomach burn.
      Thank you again!

      • Henk Noordhuizen April 16, 2019 at 4:28 am Reply

        Hi,Attsy,with all painkillers it’s very important to take thim with a lot of water,or “imbedded” in food,to protect your stomach. Not only when using Paracetamole,but with Ibuprofen and other NSAID’s as well. Might it be that the stomach problems and (painfull?) stomach cramps are caused by your painkillers? Here,in NL, doc’s combine with PPI’s,when prescribing painkillers like Diclofinac. Be carefull: PPI’s can cause major health problems;like they bdid for me.They cause a seriour magnesium defficiency within a year,getting worse if prolonged use!

        • L April 16, 2019 at 10:13 am

          None os us should EVER take ibuprofen or ANY NSAIDs ever again.

      • Attsy April 16, 2019 at 7:05 am Reply

        Henk, thank you, that makes sense to me. Because when I have pain I take pain killer, it irritates my stomach so I take omeprazole, then I have more pain so I take pain killer again and then it’s a circle. I have to stop with it. Otherwise it will cause more and more problems.

      • Attsy April 16, 2019 at 11:33 am Reply

        L, seems I was doing a lot of mistakes during my healing, no wonder, my colon is still destroyed and not healing properly….

        • L April 16, 2019 at 11:37 am

          My gut took a year of probiotics, clean diet, HCL betaine, digestive enzymes, etc to get better. I am now over 4 years out and still have occasional issues. But I am SO much better than was. I had lost 1/4 of my body weighty in TWO WEEKS, and had white stool. WHITE! Still, by that time, I was done with non-integrative MDs and just trusted my self and my ND.

        • lisalisa12years April 16, 2019 at 4:36 pm

          Glad to know your healing. I still believe this is always with us and WE each need to find what works best with our bodies. It was odd as when this hit me I was going to the gym 6 days a week walking 2 miles daily plus 3 miles nightly on a stationary bike. I lost 6 sizes in 18 months. I didn’t see the levequin/ Avelox connection. I was talking about probiotics which are amazing the enzymes as well to help digest and absorb nutrients. Papaya is a tasty enzyme to use after meals. Anyhow I ordered a product that contains 14 different strains of Probiotics plus all B vitamins and chicory root. I took one as instructed in the am with a full glass of water. The next day I was getting a rash around my ankles. I felt fine besides that. I tried a few more days and itchy everywhere. I flushed out with lots of purified water. Waited a week. Tried taking after food not so itchy but itchy. These are the first probiotics I’ve seen with 14 different strains plus the B vitamins. The company has a great. 90 day money back guarantee. I’ve returned my unused boxes already. Each box is a 30 day supply. Just in case anyone who does well with the probiotics and might do well with 14 Strains plus all of the B vitamins they’re called 3 in 1 Synbiotics United Naturals Synbiotics 365 GMO FREE. Hoping this might help someone heal. I’m just super extra sensitive to some things others of us aren’t. They had absolutely no problem sending me a return label with free shipping. So again I believe these just might be helpful to others who won’t have a reaction. It was just itching. Plus I probably should have eaten breakfast after taking them. May try again sometime. 🙏 for healing as much as possible if not completely. One day at a time. Waiting for them to say we found a cure. Or at the very least stop it from doing more damage.. 🙏 for all of my fellow Floxies. The group no body wants to be in, yet SO glad we are here for each other. As no one understands the frustration of being floxed, except for a fellow Floxie. Wishing you all the best possible and healthiest tomorrow and everyone after 🙏 United Naturals Synbiotics 365 gmo free. 1-844-794-7728 Made in Utah Hoping they might help someone heal.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 17, 2019 at 1:13 am

          I think it’s not the pro-biotic strains composition but the fact that there are probiotics (Inuline) and the vit. B-complex in it.The biggest difference might be the stomach acid resistant capsule;the stomach (acid) is the main obstical for probiotics to reacht the intestines alive.

          This product is very expensive! And I found that more people show negative reactions,taking it. One reaction is caused by the Niacin (vit.B3),which can cause hot flushes.In fact,that’s a sign that this person has a vit.B3 deficiency.The flushes will disappear when the deficiency is gone.

          The best way to use probiotics is,to mix them with 2-3 teaspoons of inuline powder) in half a glass of body-temperature warm,water,,let it rest for 10 minutes (this will activate the bacteria),and drink it on an empty stomach.

          Stay away from every food with preservatives in it (those are ment to kill bacteria), use a natural toothpaste without Fluoride or,even better,brush your teeth with a mix of (Himalayan) sea salt and olive oil: this will clean your teath very well, and the thin layer of oil that remains after the brushing on your teath will keep food from sticking to them for hours.And limit your consumption of garlic,oregano and other herbs with a known anti-bacterial working for a while,untill your gut flora is restored.

          I’ve used a lot of different probiotics,most of the time together with pre-biotics,but the best effect I ever had was with Lactospore and Inulin. I took these together with Psylium powder and vit.C;don’t know if these had any added effects (the Psylium,as well has a high fiber content;I have to use it daily because I still use Flecainide Acetaat,which makes your stool rock-hard).

          What I noticed during my quick research on “Synbiotics United Naturals Synbiotics 365” is,that on the website of the producer are ONLY positive reviews,most of them 5 Stars. Quite a difference with reviews of their product,placed on other websites/forums/blogs like supplementcritique.

          Probiotics are,in fact,a good way to promote health.But a lot of products are overpriced,and most people don’t know what’s the best way of taking them, to pass the stomach alive.That is the main reason Lactospore works so well:it is activated (not:killed) by the stomach acid and starts to replicate as soon as it enters the intestines,where other probiotics are dead or damaged on entering the intestines.Anothother fact I noticed: on the website of the Synbiotics:there’s no info on research of the product,at all! Well,there is research on the Lactospore website (and the Bacillus Coagulans is a well researched bacterium,to begin with):


          Worked miracles for me,and is cheap! The website where I buy mine (UK,sending to NL is no problem,and I hope the Brexit will not change that) asks less than €10 for 60 tablets (direction of use:one per day).That’s €5 per month! Using this pro-bioticum might be the best way to make those other probiotica usefull as well,because it creates a healthy climate in the guts,for them.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 17, 2019 at 1:16 am

          Some science on probiotics and health:


        • Attsy April 16, 2019 at 11:35 pm

          Hi L,
          I just remember you wrote it there when I first came here. That’s why I finally knew it was not just in my head and it was really happening. Same as you I lost a lot of weight in a short amount of time but my stool was red-black. Could not eat at all. I am happy to know it is improving for you (also for me).
          Thank you all for your tips, this is huge amount of help.

        • L April 17, 2019 at 7:28 am

          Glad you’re improving too! We will get there eventually! Some of us are just slower than others. 😉

  37. Mike Wallbridge April 15, 2019 at 4:48 am Reply

    If you’ve been floxed, is there any danger in using antihistamines for hayfever, please?

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 15, 2019 at 5:42 am Reply

      You might try a natural way to deal with hayfever: a small dose of bee pollen,every day (preferably started 4 weeks before the hayfever season starts,helps quite well,according to some research (eaten,not sniffed,of course).

    • L April 15, 2019 at 9:49 am Reply

      I’ve had zero issues with antihistamines. In fact since many of us suffer with histamine issues post floxing they can really help. Of course there is always that caveat that we all react to different things, but it’s hard to imagine that an antihistamine would be an issue. I have used them A LOT.

      • Mike Wallbridge April 15, 2019 at 10:03 am Reply

        Thank you both. The bee pollen sounds a good idea but it’s probably too late to start this year and it’s probably a lot more expensive.

        • h April 15, 2019 at 10:40 am

          I buy mine at an apiculture webshop, € 33,40 for 1 kilo.You need one tablespoon,every day. They taste great,sour-sweet,and mix great with muesli and a lot of other things. I just put them in my mouth and let them melt/disolve. Used them in the past because they’re very healthy (before I got hayfever,thanx to AB’s),and intend to use them now for my hayfever,which started just now.bater a bit late then never ;-))

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 15, 2019 at 10:45 am

          sorry: h = Henk :-)) And antihistamines have side effects while bee pollen are very healthy,and have no side effects ( that I know of).

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 15, 2019 at 10:49 am

          Almost forgot: some people are over-sensitive to bee pollen,so start wit a tiny bit to try if tey’re oké for you.

    • Attsy April 16, 2019 at 12:52 am Reply

      Hi Mike, I also have zero issues with antihistamines. But everyone is different but I guess you can try them.

  38. Mike Wallbridge April 16, 2019 at 1:15 am Reply

    Thanks for the input everyone. Normally I don’t get hayfever badly. Is it possibly a result of being floxed? Is that what you’re saying Henk? What are the ABs you mention?

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 16, 2019 at 4:17 am Reply

      Mike,I never had hayfever untill I got an AB-course with Amoxicillin and Metronidazole,in 2004.And things got worth since being floxed.The same goes for other allergies and sensitivities as well.

      • Mike Wallbridge April 16, 2019 at 4:55 am Reply

        That’s not good but may explain a lot. Thanks.

    • L April 16, 2019 at 10:04 am Reply

      It may be worse after floxing since it seems to effect our mast cells and create histamine intolerance…but to be honest, it is getting worse for everyone thanks to climate change. https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2016/04/160408-pollen-climate-change-allergies-spring-seasons/

      • Attsy April 16, 2019 at 10:31 am Reply

        that would make sense, because I am 100 % sure that I did not have histamine intolarance before being floxed, now my gastroenterologist told me he thinks I have it, although no way he would agree that antibiotic could cause this
        I too have many more allergies than I used to have before and eczema (never had it!) which was strange to me

        • L April 16, 2019 at 11:09 am

          the odds of any allopath acknowledging that ANY of these side effects were caused by the flqs are sadly small. That is why I now avoid them like the plague

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 16, 2019 at 12:22 pm

          Health lies,for the bigger part,in the guts. A bad working immune-system,or an over-active immuunsystem are caused by a damaged gutflora,a damaged gut lining (leaky gut syndrom),or overpopulation of pathogens like Candidas.

          The base of a good working brain lies,at least partly,in the gut as well. Think of the connection between autism and a disturbed gut flora,but also depression and other mental problems could be caused by gut problems. There’s prove that Pro-biotics,sometimes,work well on (some) mental problems.

        • Attsy April 16, 2019 at 12:55 pm

          Henk, I have never heard any doctor telling me this truth…..everything would be easier then and it makes a lot of sense.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 17, 2019 at 10:55 am

          Doctors are for SELLING,not for TELLING (the truth).No gain in discrediting their own profession,and “medicines”.

          It took me years,and lots of misery,to understand what a nathuropathic doctor (MD,specialized in intestinal diseases.Orthomolecular,Acupuncture,and some other scholings as well),that antibiotics KILL! This was shortly after my first AB disaster,in 2004.She was so right !

        • Attsy April 20, 2019 at 1:53 am

          Henk, still I think that advice would not hurt them to give. But I know that the more money they can get from the patient the better and healthy patient is not profitable for them. Usually if they find out I have some knowledge about something they stop giving me their medicine and try to get rid of me fast. Not everyone but usually most of them. The only doctor who kind of discussed it with me was my urologist and that’s all. Very sad.

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 20, 2019 at 2:36 am

          Attsy,the quote Bob Beck used is: “A patient cured is a client lost”. His quest was all for giving the power over their health back to the people and he did a marvelous job. So sad,not many people are aware of his protocol.

          One yould suspect a doc to want the best for his patients,but most of them seem to have sold their souls to the devil.Even when you tell them about adverse reactions you experienced,they tell you it’s all between the ears,imagination. And they refuse to registrate these adverse reactions,causing so much more damage and misery than needed.My doc even got angry when I told ger I had to stop the Cipro after 4 pills,and only calmed down a bit when I told her I stopped in consultation with a weekend-doctor.

          Then,still angry,she told met that she “Never had complaints about Cipro”. I don’t see much difference between that kind of doctors and the one’s who experimented on prisoners in Auschwitz,and other places and times,willingly experimenting on human beings. In a time where there’s so much debate about medical experiments on animals. These protests come from people who don’t understand that there’s a giant global medical experiment on human beings going on for 150-200 years, trying to replace natural medicines by synthetic,patentable “medicines”.

          It’s people like us,you and me,damaged by their poisons,who wake up and start doing research on their (the Farmaffia) crimes,and searching,and wrestling our way back to health by using natural remedies. Trying to eleminate causes in stead of suppressing symptoms. And,luckily,and with a lot of patience,even our heavily damaged floxie-bodies prove to be able to,at least,repair,themselves,enough damage to be able to live an almost normal live again. Some do even better, and restore their health (almost) completely.

          But don’t forget those who don’t,and those who are not even aware of the fact that they’re badly damaged by an antbiotic,meant to cure them (or,so they think).They will go back to their doc and get more,and more “medicines”.

          I wish you all nice and sunny Easter day’s :-))

        • Attsy April 20, 2019 at 7:42 am

          Henk thank you, this is Věry similar….my previous doctor also has never had any issues with fluorochinolonins. He likes to give to give them to everyone and I was stupid I stopped. His exact words: you will never feel better if you won’t continue with them. So I feel for you.
          Wish you all nice Easter too :).

        • L April 20, 2019 at 10:25 am

          More like “you will never feel worse.” This is medical malpractice. What ignorance

    • L April 16, 2019 at 10:09 am Reply

      Me too. But one thing that might work for you (although it may take a few days or up to two wees) is nasalcrom. It is an older nasal spray with no steroids, that works on stabilizing the mast cells. I couldn’t find it at three different stores so I asked my local drug store to order it and they got it in the next day. It’s too bad that a much safer medication like this has been replaced by all steroids. Anyhow, if you can’t find it, here it is on amazon. (almost hate to post since I try not to use them. They makes trillions and pay no taxes.) https://www.amazon.com/Nasalcrom-Nasal-Relieves-Allergy-Symptoms/dp/B000R829FO

      • Mike Wallbridge April 17, 2019 at 1:46 am Reply

        Thanks, L. I’ll check that out. I’ll be seeing my doctor on Friday so I’ll ask him about it.

  39. Mike Wallbridge April 16, 2019 at 1:17 am Reply

    PS Normally for hayfever I would take a steroidal nasal spray, Beconase, but I guess that’s out of the question now.

    • Dee April 17, 2019 at 8:17 am Reply

      Henk, I know you mentioned before about a more accurate test for Magnesium? I am going to my Doc next week and would like to get an “accurate” test!! I am 22 months out of being floxed and “mostly” healed. I am still dealing with several bathroom visits in the morning with loose stools. In the first several months of being floxed I took 700-800 mgs of Angstrom Mag throughout the day. I took some additional Mag Theronate before bed since it penetrated the brain. At about a year in a half out I cut down to 400-500 mgs a day. Now I am cutting back to 300-400 a day. I’m thinking this may be contributing to my on going loose stools in the morning? Maybe my body no longer needs such big dosage?? Since cutting back to 300/400 I think my bathroom is maybe a little better?? It hasn’t been that long and I’m thinking it takes awhile for your body to start adjusting to less Mag?? I am interested in the Lactospore you mentioned as it is suppose to help Diarrhea? I did purchase a Probiotic called Mega Spore which is soil based and similar ingredients I think?? I took the recommended 2 caps the first day and later had severe cramping and diarrhea. Another floxie mentioned starting with a half cap over time then adding? I haven’t tried it since? If I get this loose stool under control and some remaining tinnitus which has improved but not gone I will feel mostly recovered!! Any suggestions or thoughts and the Mag intake and or Probiotics?? All other opinions are welcome too!!!! Also what test for Mag to get from Doc! As always thanks for any help or advice!!!!

      • Henk Noordhuizen April 17, 2019 at 10:45 am Reply

        Hi Dee,his mag. test is called RBC Magnesium test.The blood I can get here is tested in Germany,at Medische Laboratoria Dr. Stein,which has a good reputation,but you’ll have to find a doctor where you live,who can help you with this;there are only a few laboratoria who do this test.You took a lot of magn. over the 1 1/2-2 years,but with that loose stool you might still have a deficiency.

        Too much magn. might have caused,or added to the problem of the loose stool;magn.,may cause loose stool;it is even used,in some forms,as a laxative.I read about Mega Spore,and those does contain the same bacterium as Lactospore (Bacillus Coagulans),but 4 other Bacilli spores as well.I found this advice on their website:


        So,two caps a day,from the start,might be too much;better try again,this time with a slow start?? And combine it with Inuline,for an optimal result.

        I hope this will work for you :-))

        • Dee April 18, 2019 at 8:24 am

          Henk. Thank you for your response!!! I appreciate it!! So how does Inuline help with the probiotic? And where do you buy and how much do you take? Any side effects from it? I will try the Mega Spore again next week but start with a half cap for a month or two and see how I react!! Hopefully it will help me!! I had leaky gut and IBS, acid reflux BEFORE being floxed so my stomach was already a weak spot for me! It is going to be a tough one to heal for me and probably why it is one of my remaining symptoms. But I know it can heal if I find the right way to go about it!! Thanks Henk! If anyone else has suggestions on healing the gut I will gladly accept!!!
          Healing to all!!

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 19, 2019 at 7:57 am

          Hi Dee,the Inulin is the preferred food for the probiotics;helps the bacteria settle and grow in the intestines.I use 10-15 grams,daily,as adviced.I mix it with the Psyllium fibers and some vitamine C;need the fibers because the Flecainide Acetaat makes my stool rockhard.The inuline is aded,just for gut flora health.

          Have you tried adding some acid to your meals? A glas of water,with 1-2 tablespoons of apple cider vinager,right before a meal,or a citrusfruit after a meal works for most people,because the main cause of acid reflux is not to much but too little acid, a well kept secret;PPI’s are a main blockbuster for meds,and the adverse reactions of longterm use of PPI’s are very profitable as well.

          Glad to (be able to) help you,and others; I depend on information of other helpfull people as well :-))

          Happy Easter to you all!

  40. Anne April 19, 2019 at 8:03 am Reply

    Anyone have some advice on healing leaky gut?
    And how to get rid of heavy metals when you have methylation problems ?
    How about DMSA chelation? Anyone use it ?

    • Dee April 19, 2019 at 8:15 am Reply

      Henk. Quick question! Where do you buy inulin? Any particular brand you recommend?? Thank you for getting back to me!! Dee

      • Henk Noordhuizen April 19, 2019 at 9:13 am Reply

        No Fluorid in Zopiclone,but thet do have some quite serious adverse reactions:


      • Henk Noordhuizen April 19, 2019 at 9:14 am Reply
      • Henk Noordhuizen April 19, 2019 at 9:23 am Reply

        I buy my Inulin here:


        I buy my Lactospore and Magnesium Bysglycinate here as well;they’re cheap,have a good quality and send to almost the whole world,to the Netherlands as well (push the flag,on top of the page).Untill now only good experiences.

        You also had a question about leaky gut;read the comments about probiotics like Lactospore,posted here recently for all the info you need :-))

  41. Anne April 19, 2019 at 8:22 am Reply

    Does the sleeping zopiclone contain fluoride ?

    Thank you

  42. Cipropoisoned April 19, 2019 at 11:07 am Reply

    I have been suffering from CIPRO toxicity for just over 7 years. I don’t know what really works, so I can’t give much of an advice. What I have discovered is that for the recurrent headaches maintaining your urine barely colored can help relieve the headache. The headache seems to be connected to the drying syndrome (dry mouth, ears, nose, etc.). Making sure the dryness is limited by staying well hydrated you can avoid clogging the sinuses, which in my opinion is one etiology for the headaches.

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 19, 2019 at 11:36 am Reply

      Dizzyness and headache are the first symptoms of drying out/not drinking enough. Too dark urine is another symptom.But take care to get enough minerals in your system;you need those to keep the water from being lost.

      One extreme example: a women once thought that somebody had poisoned her,and for flushing the poison out of her system she started drinking water,liter after liter.Not much later she was found,unconscious,and brought to the hospital.There,they tried to save her but she died soon after.The water had flushed all the important minerals out of her body,and all important functions stopped,one after another because of a total lack of all the minerals,needed.

  43. Andrea April 20, 2019 at 5:27 am Reply

    Hi guys. Does anyone have any experience with muscle relaxants (Muscoril, Myoril, Neoflax etc.) Thanks…after starting this new magnetic treatment I’m experiencing only side effects in pelvic/bladder area. As a matter of fact, all the pressure an pain in that part just increased, and now I can’t even sleep for 30 minutes…
    PS To Henk, did the Sota pulser give you the same problems when you started using it?

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 20, 2019 at 8:39 am Reply

      Andrea,like I wrote you a while ago;while magno-pulsing,during the first weeks,pain started to get more intens.After two weeks,or so,I stopped pulsing and the pain vanished over a couple of days.So did the problem itself, urinating got better and better.Then I started suplementing zinc (100mg,during the first month’s,then down to 50 mg/day),and pretty soon I urinated like an 18 years old :-))

      I hope your experience will be the same.One thing: during the period,after stopping the mag-pulsing,I also concentrated on relaxing the muscles in the pelvis area,especially those in the lower part of the belly,because I noticed that those,in part,added to the pain/uncomfortable feeling in that area by being too tight.

      Success,and have a nice Easter :-))

      • joanneb4 April 20, 2019 at 9:13 am Reply

        Which zinc did you take?

        • Henk Noordhuizen April 21, 2019 at 6:24 am

          I use Zinc Citrate

      • Andrea April 20, 2019 at 4:09 pm Reply

        Thanks Henk. Right now I’m doing that “magnetic chair” every other day. The physioterapist who is treating me, said that you shouldn’t being doing this more than every 48 hrs. Anyway, the feeling I get from it, it’s almost like an electrostimulation. I don’t know what to think, I was able to sleep a few hrs latalety, and now all the pressure got back. Hope it disappear soon….Plus,I want to try some zinc, I’ll follow you’re suggestion. Maby not that much, as you did, but at least 30 mg a day. As always, I will keep you(all) updated….Thanks.

    • L April 20, 2019 at 10:16 am Reply

      I don’t but acupuncture helped with that. You might also look into aloe vera capsules. https://thealoeverasite.com/articles/super-strength-freeze-dried-aloe-vera-capsules-for-interstitial-cystitis.pdf

      • Andrea April 21, 2019 at 5:36 am Reply

        Thanks L.
        I’ve tried acupuncture, actually electro-acupuncture, but the effects weren’t very satisfying, and they didn’t last more than a couple of days anyway, plus it was very expensive…

  44. joanneb4 April 20, 2019 at 8:35 am Reply

    I feel refloxed after taking one acetaminophen 325 mg and two cephalexin 500 mg and two Bactrim DS after medical procedures. Please help. What can I do? I’m in a major flare inflammation and pain all over. No movement in bowels or bladder. Very distended and bloated.

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 20, 2019 at 8:58 am Reply

      Acetaminophen (Paracetamol) is,as far as I know,and from my own experience,well tolerated by floxies;I use 500mg,without any problem,sometimes several on one day (max. 3 grams a day,max. 1 gram at a time).

      Both antibiotics you mentioned are fluoride-free,but both are broad spectrum AB’s and do a lot of harm to your intestinal flora.

      You didn’t write if you stopped taking these AB’s,or not. If your adverse reactions are that serious,you’d better stop taking them and ask your doc if futher AB use is requiered,or if it’s safe to stop,because of these reactions.

      What you can do yourself,now? First of all: drink a lot,and use a good magnesium supplement, and,if neccesary, a good pré- and probiotic.When things don’t return to normal, it depends on the remaining symptoms to descide what to do next.

      I hope this helps a bit, and that you will find a quick recovery.

    • L April 20, 2019 at 10:31 am Reply

      I am wondering if some sort of detox would help, eg dry sauna, ozone, etc

  45. joanneb4 April 20, 2019 at 9:09 am Reply

    I am not taking antibiotics anymore. I only took those 4 pills. But I think I may have drank a bottle of water that had fluoride. It was Whole Foods 365 Spring Water. So this may be fluoride again. I also drank 3/4 Poland Spring bottled water a week ago. So I’m a mess. I do have probiotics and prebiotics but I think I also have SIBO. I feel electrocuted again and zaps in body and twitching in ankles and eyes, muscle spasms in body, can’t think or remember things, blood flow issues, heart palpitations. I really think it’s the fluoride. My Functional Medicine Doctor thinks I should take Iodoral tablets daily for 3 months. That is high dose iodine 12.5 mg to help detox fluoride. I have so much head pressure and ear ringing and anxiety. It’s like refloxing is worse than the floxing due to cumulative damage.

    • L April 20, 2019 at 10:36 am Reply

      spring water may have some naturally occurring fluoride which is different than what is added to our water, so I don’t think that was the problem. It sounds like it was the pills. That is really a high amount of iodine. (I take daily, but about 1/24 of that. I think detox idea is good, which is why I mentioned the dry sauna or ozone. But I am not sure I would feel comfortable with that high a dose for that long…it really effects your thyroid. Is there another integrative doctor or ND you can see? Where are you located?

      • joanneb4 April 20, 2019 at 10:41 am Reply

        Yes I do see another ND she advised to take sea kelp tablets and eat seaweed and dulse. I am worried they are contaminated with heavy metals. I also had a CT scan so it could be all that radiation. Do you think it could be that? What should I do for that? I have an infrared sauna I bought after Cipro but now I can no longer sweat. Should I try anyways? I’m very worried about all the radiation plus I had 8 x rays this past year from car accidents and 2 CT scans Dec 2016 and some in 2010 and 1995.

        • L April 20, 2019 at 11:11 am

          I would definitely try the sauna. Also I had been told about modifilan brown seaweed extract, which is actually used to help eliminate heavy metal contamination, as well as radiation from the CT scan. I would try that. And yeah, CT scans are the worse as far as radiation. Severa doctors have wanted me to do one, but have avoided so far.

  46. L April 20, 2019 at 10:38 am Reply

    weird, I just posted and it disappeared. anyhow, that water would have trace amounts of naturally occurring fluoride which is not the same thing, so don’t think it’s that. I think the detox idea is good which is why I mentioned dry sauna or ozone but that seems like a very high amount of iodine to take for that period. I take about 1/24th f that daily. I would worry about the effect on the thyroid. Is there another integrative doctor or nd you can see? Where are you located?

  47. joanneb4 April 22, 2019 at 7:36 pm Reply

    Help. I NEED to use an anti-inflammatory or steroid after CT scan and severe allergic reaction or I’m going to lose my vision. What can I use? I’m at severe risk at going blind.

    • L April 22, 2019 at 8:12 pm Reply

      why would you need one of those after a ct scan? what is the vision diagnosis?

    • Henk Noordhuizen April 23, 2019 at 1:22 am Reply

      Hi Joanne,why do you need a steroid,after the CT scan? Did you get an allergic reaction from some contrast substance they gave you to get better scan results? I know that some floxies have very bad reactions from steroids,but I think that,when the risk of getting blind is so severe, I’d go for the steroids. Maybe one or more floxies with steroid experience(‘s) might be able to tell you which steroid’s are the best options for floxies,and which ones you should absolutely avoid. I really hope things will turn out fine for you!

  48. Deb April 23, 2019 at 7:04 am Reply

    My doctor wants me to use a very small amount of 1% to 2% steroid cream for two weeks. Has anyone been able to use a steroid cream after floxing?

    • Andrea April 24, 2019 at 11:12 am Reply

      Just my two cents : I would never take that chance

  49. M April 23, 2019 at 1:30 pm Reply

    Hi all,

    Long time floxie. Been doing ok until this past weekend. Mostly nervous system stuff. Brain fog, anxiety, twitching, head pressure.

    I’ve recently started trying to have one cup of coffee, once a week. I make it at home with my own fluoride-free water and organic coffee beans. I’ve been sensitive to caffeine since being floxed so the one cup always made me feel a little funny, but it wasn’t so bad that it took away the enjoyment of it. It felt safe and worth it as the “funny” feeling always wore off.

    Until now. Sunday’s cup seems to have set me over the edge somehow. I had the same beans/water/amount that I always have, only this time all my nervous system symptoms seemed to get worse and have stayed worse two days later. I assume it was the coffee, but it could have also been…

    Water. I went out Friday night and Sunday night (Sunday night was after the coffee earlier that day) and had small cups of water at restaurants. I do this very rarely as I try to avoid fluoride. I did not even finish the water on each occasion. We are talking several sips here. Still, after several sips of water on Sunday night is when I immediately felt that my “coffee side effects” from earlier significantly worsened. I truly thought I was going to die right then and there.

    The worsened brain fog, anxiety, muscle twitching and head pressure have not dissipated for two days now.

    Was it the coffee? The water? Some combination of the two?

    I want to say it was the water, but I’ve risked it with small cups of water far more often than I have risked it with coffee. The coffee is the newest factor here.

    I understand no one can say for sure. Just looking for any insight/shared experiences. And also venting about how the smallest exposures to every day things seem to still mess me up. I can’t have ONE small cup of coffee ONCE a week?! For f*ck’s sake.

    • Andrea April 24, 2019 at 11:11 am Reply

      Hi M.
      I really don’t know what could’ve triggered your relapse. I really hope for you it’s just a temporary thing, but I’m more inclined to think that it could be the coffee.
      I’ve been floxed in December 2016, and coffee never bothered me until June/July of the next year. You said you’ve been drinking coffee, from time to time,but who knows, maybe coffee could trigger your floxie symptoms right away, or it could take time to build up. Or it could be that, in that particular day, your immune/nervous system wasn’t that strong and you “made a mess” with that coffe…
      I know it sucks, but my suggestion is to just stay away from coffee and never drink it again. That’s what I did.
      In almost 2 years (from summer 2017, when I realized how bad caffeine was for me), till now, I only had one coffee, and it triggered all my symptoms, the neurological ones expecially, right away. It was just a small cup of espresso.

      • M April 25, 2019 at 11:44 am Reply

        Thanks Andrea . I think you’re right. After your relapse from one coffee did your symptoms eventually start to calm down? Or did that become the “new normal”? I hope I get back to my baseline soon.

        Is there ANYTHING safe I can indulge in to elevate my mood? All prescription drugs, comfort foods, alcohol, and now caffeine are off the table. I think I’m going to try marijuana next? I mean, chances are I’ll react to it, considering my luck with almost everything else I ingest.

      • Mike May 1, 2019 at 10:12 am Reply

        I just wanted to share that I had pretty much the same timeline as you. Floxed after two pills in Sep 2016… all the terrible symptoms for months. But it wasnt until about 7 months after that I no longer could tolerate coffee. I now take acid reflux medication that works. 2.5 years and I”m much better than those first six months but I still get the weird stuff (like now) creeping back in which always freaks me out.

        take care.

      • Anna May 3, 2019 at 3:32 am Reply

        I drink a lot of coffee and a lot of red wine, daily, and neither bother me. ( I am 9 months post flox.) However, I think either mint tea or Benadryl caused a bad relapse a few months ago.

        • Anna May 3, 2019 at 3:37 am

          It is also worth mentioning my coffee is Newman’s Organic, and the mint tea I had was not organic. Not sure if that is why I tolerate the coffee or not. I just wonder if the real problem is chemicals in the tea or coffee, and not actually the tea/coffee itself. I don’t know.

        • Henk Noordhuizen May 3, 2019 at 4:55 am

          “I drink a lot of coffee and a lot of red wine, daily”. Wow;you are a real party-animal ;-))

          Is there any black tea in the mint tea,or is it pure mint? In black tea is a small amount of fluoride.Small,but enough to cause a relapse in (some?) Floxies.

          I only drink one Doppio Espresso (double espresso,which means;one full espressocup,instead of the regular espresso,which is little less than half an espresso-cup).This doesn’t effect me in a negative way.

          When I drink alcohol,it’s in small amounts.One bottle (35 cc) of beer,one glass of wine or 1/2-3/4 espressocup of liqueur (= 30-35% alcohol),only in weekends.Here’s a little effect,sometimes,lasting one or two days,most of the time only my double vision. For jokers: no,that’s not while I’m influenced by the alcohol;it’s during the folowing days ;-))

        • Anna May 3, 2019 at 7:11 am

          The tea was blended with spearmint /peppermint leaves, and was the Bigelow brand.And, yes it says on the back of the package that there is black tea mixed in. I can’t be sure that is what caused my ankle /knee issues to flare up, but that is what I noticed that I had that was different. I guess I’ll stick to my fluoride free Bordeaux instead 🙂

        • Henk Noordhuizen May 3, 2019 at 7:33 am

          A votre santé ;-))

        • L May 3, 2019 at 10:05 am

          For the first year I could not tolerate coffee, wine or pretty much anything else. I literally lived on smoothies. I am not more than 4 1/2 years out and am glad to say that I have coffee every morning (sometimes two cups) and wine several nights a week. Even the occasional single-malt scotch—without ill effects. When I do have a relapse of something it is usually not relatable to anything that I am doing. I still am very careful re fluoride, gmos, gluten, etc. I even get wine from countries in Europe that don’t fluoridate their water and usually it’s organic. That way I know the grapes are also grow without fluoride in the water. I would choose nonorganic Italian or French over organic American. In fact I avoid American wines altogether, sadly. Here in CA even organic ones were found to have glyphosate in them. 😦

  50. M April 25, 2019 at 11:45 am Reply

    Reposting a response to Andrea RE coffee in case it got lost on the last page:

    Andrew, I think you’re right. After your relapse from one coffee did your symptoms eventually start to calm down? Or did that become the “new normal”? I hope I get back to my baseline soon.

    Is there ANYTHING safe I can indulge in to elevate my mood? All prescription drugs, comfort foods, alcohol, and now caffeine are off the table. I think I’m going to try marijuana next? I mean, chances are I’ll react to it, considering my luck with almost everything else I ingest.

    • M April 25, 2019 at 11:46 am Reply

      *Andrea, not Andrew!

    • Andrea April 25, 2019 at 12:41 pm Reply

      Don’t worry M, Andrea (italian) it’s actually Andrew in english, so it’s ok, I’m a man… 🙂
      Anyway, after that one coffee, I felt different, worse, for a couple of days, but luckly it calmed down. But like I said, no more coffee for me…and it sucks, since I used to love coffee. Oh well…
      To elevate your mood, I don’t know, since we’re all different. You’ve mentioned alchol. Many floxies reacts badly to alchol, but I’ve read that some of us can even feel a little better with SMALL amount of it. This is not my case, because I was completely abstinent from alchol even before my first exposure to FQ, but maybe you could try a good glass of red wine, maybe organic, after dinner, for example. Prescription drugs, I agree, better not even consider them. Most of the time they’re useless and very dangerous (for everyone, not just floxies) and very addictive. I regard of cannabis, I don’t know where you live, but, if you live in a state where there’s this option (legal medical/recreational) you could try it. Just be careful to not take the super strong strains that are avaible today. I won’t even consider cannabis bought illegaly, you really don’t konw what’s in there…or maybe you could try CBD. I’ve tried it, but it did nothing to me. After reading many studies, I’ve come to the conclusion that Cannabis is the real deal as far as pain menagement and relax.
      Just another thing, are you following a particular diet after being floxed?

      • M April 25, 2019 at 4:03 pm Reply

        Thanks for the response Andrea. Glad to hear that things calmed down after a few days for you. It’s been about four days for me and I still don’t feel great…here’s to hoping it will clear up in a day or two.

        I definitely know to avoid alcohol. In my case it always seems to make things worse, even in small amounts. Although, what’s crazy is that my recent reaction to coffee seems far, far worse than it has been to alcohol, which I never would have expected. I figured caffeine was the lower risk.

        I definitely would like to look into cannabis and would probably try to get it legally. Still worried about a potentially adverse reaction, which I seem to have to almost anything I try. Almost every supplement I have tried has made me feel worse.

        As a result of that – and to answer your question – I try to get all my nutrients through diet. I’ve been following a strict paleo diet for three years. A lot of diverse veggies, some fruits and meat. Organic as much as possible. I honestly don’t think the diet has contributed to any healing, but I do believe it is safe and prevents me from getting worse. I feel stable on it, which is about as much as I can hope for these days.

        • Andrea April 26, 2019 at 1:42 pm

          M, one reason why we’re so sensitive to caffeine,could probably due to the fact that caffeine affects the nervous system, and since most of us develop some form of neurological damage, the connection is clear…plus I remember talking to a nutritionist and she was explaining to me that caffeine actually depelates energy from our cells, so I’m not surprised you could even feel worse than while drinking alchol…

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